Is Hell Real?

[LightLoveHope]

Go a head and hide behind the "sheol" explanation it changes nothing in reality. The bible teaches about hell, if there is no hell then, it realy defeats and invalidates Jesus's sacrifice on the cross.

I have never thought "Hell" was actually why Jesus died.
Some people live in so much emotional pain they kill themselves.
People desire good things, peace, love and happiness, yet find broken lives, pain and suffering, going from one disaster to another.

So Jesus came to open the door to life, the door being the cross.
It is why if you regard society as functional and ok, that if it was made eternal it would just carry on fine, Hell is punishment and destruction for sin, which does not lead to death, but is just fun without real consequences. But this is the illusion the world tells itself, to cope.

The lake of fire is the final resolution to failure, destruction, whether in eternal torment or isolation or something else.

So to save us from the world, which is dying and destroying the very life it has, suffering without relief, Jesus came. It is the world that is the problem not Hell.

So in this discussion one has to pitch in what is the world and what is Jesus saving us from.

 

[DeaconDean]

Where do you get this from?

Scripture. (Specifically, Lk. 16:19-31)

You know very well what the word hell means today, and it is not the same thing as hades. So to say that hell and hades are synonymous is misleading at best.

No! You are wrong.

I also took the time to show the etymology of the word. Over a period of a millennia, "hades" was replaced with the word "hell". If you don't like it, or won't accept it, what can I say.

"Etymology of Hell:

"also Hell, Old English hel, helle, "nether world, abode of the dead, infernal regions, place of torment for the wicked after death," from Proto-Germanic *haljō "the underworld" (source also of Old Frisian helle, Old Saxon hellia, Dutch hel, Old Norse hel, German Hölle, Gothic halja "hell"). Literally "concealed place" (compare Old Norse hellir "cave, cavern"), from PIE root *kel-(1) "to cover, conceal, save."

The English word may be in part from Old Norse mythological Hel (from Proto-Germanic *halija "one who covers up or hides something"), in Norse mythology the name of Loki's daughter who rules over the evil dead in Niflheim, the lowest of all worlds (nifl "mist"). A pagan concept and word fitted to a Christian idiom. In Middle English, also of the Limbus Patrum, place where the Patriarchs, Prophets, etc. awaited the Atonement. Used in the KJV for Old Testament Hebrew Sheol and New Testament Greek Hades, Gehenna. Used figuratively for "state of misery, any bad experience" at least since late 14c. As an expression of disgust, etc., first recorded 1670s."

Source"

Here again, if you don't like it, what can I say.

The same thing happened with our phrase "holy ghost". The Greek phrase " Φάντασμά ἁγίου" (ghost holy/holy ghost) cannot be found in ANY Greek MSS.

Sometime in the 13th century, "ghost" became acceptable in reference to the third person of the Trinity. (In my opinion, that's wrong, but that's my opinion)

If you don't like any of what I posted, please consult your Bible.

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[LastSeven]

Scripture. (Specifically, Lk. 16:19-31)

That's a parable. Not a literal description of where we go after death.

I also took the time to show the etymology of the word. Over a period of a millennia, "hades" was replaced with the word "hell". If you don't like it, or won't accept it, what can I say.

You're completely missing the point. The point is that the modern definition of hell does not match the original definition of hades. Therefore you can't say that they're synonymous.

It doesn't matter where the word hell came from or how it came to replace the word hades. What matters is that they don't mean the same thing. Hades was never a place of eternal torture for the wicked, and so to claim that hades and hell are synonymous is no less absurd than claiming that "hot dog" is synonymous with "dachshund".

 

[DeaconDean]

That's a parable. Not a literal description of where we go after death.

What is the definition of a "parable"?

An illustrative story of a "spiritual truth".

WHat Jesus taught in Luke 16:19-31 is "truth"!

If we take your word for it, none of the parables Jesus said, we cannot use.

Yea...right.

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[DeaconDean]

It doesn't matter where the word hell came from or how it came to replace the word hades. What matters is that they don't mean the same thing. Hades was never a place of eternal torture for the wicked, and so to claim that hades and hell are synonymous is no less absurd than claiming that "hot dog" is synonymous with "dachshund".

Your just here to argue aren't you?

I never said "hades/hell" was a place of eternal torture. Not once have I said that. In fact, several times it was stated by me, that that place (hades/hell) is only temporary. Yet you didn't read it or consider it.

I'm done responding to you. Hello ignore list.

Have a nice life.

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[LastSeven]

Your just here to argue aren't you?

I never said "hades/hell" was a place of eternal torture. Not once have I said that. In fact, several times it was stated by me, that that place (hades/hell) is only temporary. Yet you didn't read it or consider it.

I'm done responding to you. Hello ignore list.

Have a nice life.

God Bless

Till all are one.

Are you being purposely obtuse? It doesn't matter whether or not you said hell was a place of eternal torture. You said hell and hades are synonymous. And that's not true because "hell" is defined as a place of eternal torture. If you don't define it as such, that's fine, but that is how the rest of the entire world defines it.

 

[Dragon Fly]

I have heard that many Christians do not believe that hell is real. I found this to be absurd, but I am open to hearing both sides of the argument. So that is what has lead me to proposing this question, is Hell real?
If it is or is not please explain.

P.S. I for one do believe it exist. Sorry for the pun in the poll but is just too much for me to resist.

Could you ask this question again in the Controversial Theology section?
People who believe something other than "hell is real and it is spectacular" will have problems if they answer your question in this forum.

 

[Shempster]

Yes, "hell" is real.
The grave that we end up in is real.
And the "Gehenna" we may experience is real. Some of us experience it every day.
When Jesus spoke of "Gehenna" it was used as a metaphor, not a cavity in the earth where God tortures us. Like if we fornicate with someone and catch a painful STD, we will be entering Gehenna.
A simple analogy would be "If you commit a crime, you may end up dying in prison". That is all he was saying. Gehenna is a condition we may experience when we sin. Notice Jesus said to fear him who has the power to destroy a body and soul in Gehenna. He did not say God WILL do it, only that we should tread lightly and be aware that he could do such a thing.

The lake of fire is something else entirely.

 

[DeaconDean]

Yes, "hell" is real.
The grave that we end up in is real.
And the "Gehenna" we may experience is real. Some of us experience it every day.
When Jesus spoke of "Gehenna" it was used as a metaphor, not a cavity in the earth where God tortures us. Like if we fornicate with someone and catch a painful STD, we will be entering Gehenna.
A simple analogy would be "If you commit a crime, you may end up dying in prison". That is all he was saying. Gehenna is a condition we may experience when we sin. Notice Jesus said to fear him who has the power to destroy a body and soul in Gehenna. He did not say God WILL do it, only that we should tread lightly and be aware that he could do such a thing.

The lake of fire is something else entirely.

I agreed with you up to the point of your usage of the Greek words.

"The lake of fire is something else entirely"

In the Greek, Gehenna is the place described as:

"the fire that shall never be quenched" (Mark 9:43).

Whereas, hades is only a temporary "holding" place.

Isaiah describes this place saying:

"Topheth has long been prepared; it has been made ready for the king. Its fire pit has been made deep and wide, with an abundance of fire and wood; the breath of the LORD, like a stream of burning sulfur, sets it ablaze." -Isa. 30:33

If you'll look back through this thread, I have give definitions of both words as used in the New Testament.

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[Shempster]

I agreed with you up to the point of your usage of the Greek words.

"The lake of fire is something else entirely"

In the Greek, Gehenna is the place described as:

"the fire that shall never be quenched" (Mark 9:43).

Whereas, hades is only a temporary "holding" place.

Isaiah describes this place saying:

"Topheth has long been prepared; it has been made ready for the king. Its fire pit has been made deep and wide, with an abundance of fire and wood; the breath of the LORD, like a stream of burning sulfur, sets it ablaze." -Isa. 30:33

If you'll look back through this thread, I have give definitions of both words as used in the New Testament.

God Bless

Till all are one.

Those verses sound as if it is a physical place, but absolutely can be a metaphor.
I was just giving my view of it. To me, the bible is chock full of metaphors.
I realize that I am in a very small minority seeing it this way, so there is no point in trying to push it any farther.

 

[DeaconDean]

Those verses sound as if it is a physical place, but absolutely can be a metaphor.
I was just giving my view of it. To me, the bible is chock full of metaphors.
I realize that I am in a very small minority seeing it this way, so there is no point in trying to push it any farther.

Whatever.

Except the scriptures make it no way to be understood as a metaphor. It is a reality that the unsaved will know.

God Bless

Till all are one.