Is Death Final?

I Am Hugh

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There seems to be some confusion about whether or not death is final. Since the Bible teaches a resurrection this response will deal with the alleged contradictions with scriptures which say that death is final and have some brief comments upon some of the verses given to support resurrection as well.

The following scriptures are given to support the interpretation that death is final.

Joshua 23:14 simply states that Joshua was going to die, it says nothing about death being final.

Job 7:9 - There are two possible meanings when Job said this; one is that from the perspective of his contemporaries his death would be somewhat final in this lifetime, the other possibility is that he was pointing out that the resurrection was out of his control. It wasn't up to him, and only a possibility. One thing is sure, Job believed in the possibility of resurrection. (Job 14:13-15)

Job 14:10, 12 - It has already been established that Job believed in the resurrection, but verse 10 is important to note because there is some variation in translation. The Masoretic Hebrew text found in Codex Leningrad, as presented by the Biblia Hebraica, by Kittel, Kahle, Alt and Eissfeldt, Privilegierte Wurttembergische Bibelanstalt, Stuttgart, seventh to ninth ed., 1951-55, and Biblia Hebraica Stuttgartensia, by Elliger and Rudolph, Deutsche Bibelstiftung, Stuttgart, 1977, reads "Where is he?" where the Septuagint, third and second cent. BCE, (A. Rahlfs, Deutsche Bibelgesellschaft, Stuttgart, 1935) and Syriac Peshitta, Christian Aram., fifth cent. CE, S. Lee, London, 1826, reprint by United Bible Societies, 1979 reads "he is no more." So where the KJV reads "he is no more" other translations like the Douay reads "where is he?" One thing to keep in mind when considering these verses of Job as possible contradictions regarding a resurrection is that Job, at the time, was doubting his being approved of by God and so may have wondered about his own possible resurrection, even though in the next few verses he expresses a belief in the possibility.

Job 20:7 - Here even the KJV asks Where is he? (see above)

Psalm 6:5 simply states that when we die, we are no longer conscious of anything. We can't do anything. King Hezekiah expressed a similar sentiment, in fact it is common throughout the Bible. (Ecclesiastes 9:5; Isaiah 38:17-19; Genesis 3:19; Psalm 30:9; 88:10)

Psalm 31:17; 88:5; 115:17 - David refers to the wicked who are in contrast to the faithful, the faithful having the possibility of a resurrection to eternal life whereas the wicked do not.

Ecclesiastes 3:19 - This verse simply states that like animals, humans die. It doesn't say that it is final.

Ecclesiastes 9:5 - The KJV says there is no reward during death, some translations use the word wages rather than reward. The verse is trying to convey the vanity of materialism. Sort of like the modern day expression "You can't take it with you." It doesn't imply that death is final in the sense of there not being a resurrection.

Ecclesiastes 9:10 - This verse is an extension of the verse above. The book is talking about the vanity of an ungodly life as temporal.

Isaiah 26:14 - This verse is a reference to the wicked, and is a specific prophecy regarding Babylon, the captors of Judah during that time and who later fell to the Medes and Persians in 539 BCE.

Isaiah 38:18 simply states that when we die, we are no longer conscious of anything. See Psalm 6:5 above.

The following scriptures are given to support the interpretation that death isn't final and there will be a resurrection from the dead. Though the Bible teaches the resurrection, I do want to comment on some of the scriptures given.

1 Kings 17:22; 2 Kings 4:32-35; 13:21; Luke 7:12-15; John 11:39-44 all convey a temporary resurrection. All of the people raised from the dead in these verses died again sometime later. Those resurrected by Elijah, Elisha, Jesus and the apostles were, in part, a demonstration of the possibility of resurrection.

Daniel 12:1; Matthew 25:46; 9:24-25; Mark 5:39-42; Luke 20:37; John 5:28-29; Acts 26:23; 1 Corinthians 15:16, 52; Revelation 20:12-13 all convey the idea of a general resurrection of the dead. Of the faithful to life everlasting or of the unrighteous to either life everlasting or eternal destruction. (Acts 24:15)

Isaiah 26:19 - Where the KJV says "my dead body" some translations read "a corpse of mine" from the Hebrew Eveleth. It is singular, but likely in a collective sense. The Septuagint reads "those in the memorial tombs" and the Vulgate reads "my killed ones."

Ezekiel 37:12 is more likely a figurative resurrection of the Jewish nation when 42,360 people of all tribes of Israel and some 7,500 non-Israelites seized their opportunity to repopulate Judah. (See Isaiah 66:14; Revelation 11:11; Ezra 1:1-4; 2:64-65)

Matthew 27:52-53 - Matthew was the only one to mention dead people emerging from their graves upon Jesus' death. It is assumed that these resurrected dead were walking around. The omission of the dead people emerging from the graves by the other writers does not, of course, mean anything. Matthew was the first gospel to be written. In De viris inlustribus (Concerning Illustrious Men), chapter III, Jerome says: "Matthew, who is also Levi, and who from a publican came to be an apostle, first of all composed a Gospel of Christ in Judaea in the Hebrew language and characters for the benefit of those of the circumcision who had believed." So this (Matthew having been the first gospel) might be a reason for the others having not included the dead people emerging from their graves.

At Matthew 27:52-53 the Greek egeiro means simply raised up rather than resurrected back to life, resurrection in Greek is anastasis and in addition to this "they" (meaning the bodies that were walking around) is a pronoun, and in Greek all pronouns have gender and "they" is masculine whereas "bodies" (the bodies that were lifted up) is in the neuter. They are not the same. The passage is saying that an earthquake caused buried corpses to be thrown up out of the ground and there were other people, who were alive, walking around who seen this happen. This is not so unusual as it may seem. It has been reported as having happened in modern history, in Ecuador in 1949 and again in El Tiempo, Bogota, Colombia, July 31, 1962 where 200 corpses were thrown out of their tombs by a violent earth tremor.

Luke 9:30 - Not a resurrection of Moses and Elijah. Jesus referred to the transfiguration as a vision. (Matthew 17:9) Some critics have called it a dream but Peter, James and John didn't likely have the same dream. It was foretold that a prophet like Moses and Elijah would be sent, and in this vision the "appearance" or representation of them signified this. (Deuteronomy 18:15-19; Acts 3:19-20; Malachi 4:5-6; Luke 1:17)
 
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Beslowtoanger

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I’m not sure I follow?

Death is not final if we believe in Jesus Christ, repent, live a life away from sin, do good deeds and spread the good news? Am I missing something? That is what I have my whole faith in, so what is the purpose of the discussion?

Sorry I’m not very intellectual when it comes to these matters, but it does seem like a contradictory subject to what we Christians worship…….see my signature, therefore death is not final.

Sorry if I’m down a rabbit hole.
 
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2PhiloVoid

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I’m not sure I follow?

Death is not final if we believe in Jesus Christ, repent, live a life away from sin, do good deeds and spread the good news? Am I missing something? That is what I have my whole faith in, so what is the purpose of the discussion?

Sorry I’m not very intellectual when it comes to these matters, but it does seem like a contradictory subject to what we Christians worship…….see my signature, therefore death is not final.

Sorry if I’m down a rabbit hole.

No, you didn't miss anything, bro! ... it's just that he likes to excel in giving unasked for monologues. It's his "thing."

Of course, maybe it's worth something if he at least gets a few things right here or there to remind us of what most of us on CF know we have in Christ. ;)
 
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I Am Hugh

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I’m not sure I follow?

Death is not final if we believe in Jesus Christ, repent, live a life away from sin, do good deeds and spread the good news? Am I missing something? That is what I have my whole faith in, so what is the purpose of the discussion?

Sorry I’m not very intellectual when it comes to these matters, but it does seem like a contradictory subject to what we Christians worship…….see my signature, therefore death is not final.

Sorry if I’m down a rabbit hole.

Death is final for most, but for the faithful there is the hope of resurrection.
 
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I Am Hugh

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No, you didn't miss anything, bro! ... it's just that he likes to excel in giving unasked for monologues. It's his "thing."

Of course, maybe it's worth something if he at least gets a few things right here or there to remind us of what most of us on CF know we have in Christ. ;)

If I had to give a quick overall answer to the question of what you must do to be saved there would be no one answer. There is nothing that you can do to be saved. One could do and say all of the right things and still not have earned the privilege of being saved. It is given as an undeserved kindness.

What does it even mean to be saved? It simply means to be delivered from danger or destruction. Some wrongly think that the Bible teaches that those who are saved go to heaven and those who are not go to hell. The Bible doesn't teach this, it teaches the possibility of being saved from the destruction of a world of ungodliness, to be resurrected to eternal life for a few in heaven, and of many to paradise on earth.

I have addressed each of the points and scriptures often provided by the skeptic briefly and individually with the above in mind.

1. Say the right things.

For by thy words thou shalt be justified. (Matthew 12:37)

Response: Yet the sinning tax collector is justified and the righteous Pharisee is not. (Luke 18:9-14) Words are a reflection of the inner workings of the person or a projection - hypocrisy.

2. Do the right things.

And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life. (John 5:29)

Response: Yet there is a resurrection of the unrighteous as well as the righteous. (Acts 24:15) The contrast here is a resurrection of life or of judgment. There will be opportunity for all, including those who have not been introduced to his will.

For you render to each one according to his works. (Psalm 62:12)

Response: Yet those doing good and those doing bad both benefit from the sun and the rain. (Matthew 5:43-48) Nevertheless, both reap what they sow.

When the wicked man turns away from his wickedness . . . and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul. (Ezekiel 18:27)

Response: Not a bad arrangement, unless you are wicked. (Ezekiel 33:14-19)

For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works. (Matthew 16:27)

Response: Then it is not just a question of salvation, but also judgment. (2 Corinthians 5:10)

Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. (Matthew 25:34-36)

Response: When was the founding of the world? Not the Earth, but specifically, the world. Upon the birth of Abel. (Luke 11:50-51; Matthew 13:35; 25:34; Revelation 13:8; 17:8; Hebrews 9:26)

Who will render to each one according to his deeds. . . . For not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified. (Romans 2:6, 13)

Response: A very important point here has been overlooked. The law is written in the hearts of those without the written law. It accuses and excuses. (Romans 2:12-16)

Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works. (2 Corinthians 11:15)

Response: Those doing the will of their father, Satan the Devil, bring destruction. (John 8:44)

The Father, who without partiality judges according to each one's work. (1 Peter 1:17)

Response: The term without partiality or impartiality depending on the translation, in Greek, literally means "without reception of faces." The term comes from the Hebrew words nasa panim which means literally, "lift up the face," and figuratively makes reference to the Oriental greeting where a person bowed and turned their face to the ground. The one being greeted would then lift the face and "give a kindly reception." (Genesis 32:20) Thus figuratively the term applies to partiality. Impartiality being without impression of an outwardly appearance.

I will give unto every one of you according to your works. (Revelation 2:23)

Response: I think the beginning of that verse should be explored. "And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts:" Of course, reins here is kidneys. Just as we use the heart as symbolic for our feelings, the kidneys were used to symbolize our deepest most inner feelings.

And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. (Revelation 20:12-13)

Response: How can a man be judged, once he has died, if, upon death, we are acquitted of our sins? (Romans 6:7) Judgment day, therefore, isn't a day where we are judged for what we did while alive, but what we do during that time. In this life we judge ourselves. The believer and unbeliever needn't be judged at all on Judgment day because they had already done so themselves. That day is for the unrighteous that haven't been informed to decide to believe or disbelieve. (Acts 24:15)

3. Believe the right things.

A man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law. (Romans 3:28)

Response: Justified, or declared righteous (see 1. above) is the Greek dikaiousthai (Latin iustificari) which literally means "to be being justified."

Therefore, being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. (Romans 5:1)

Response: Yet are they perfect? Without sin? (1 John 1:8; 2:1)

A man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ. (Galatians 2:16)

Response: The NWT reads: "knowing as we do that a man is declared righteous, (Greek dikaioutai; literally "is being justified."), not due to works of law, but only through faith toward Christ Jesus, even we have put our faith in Christ Jesus, that we may be declared righteous due to faith toward Christ, and not due to works of law, because due to works of law no flesh will be declared righteous."

For by grace are ye saved through faith. (Ephesians 2:8)

Response: Ephesians 2:8-9 (RSV) "By grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God - not because of works, lest any man should boast."

4. Do and believe the right things.

Faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. (James 2:17)

Response: "But someone will say, "You have faith; I have deeds." Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by what I do." (James 2:18 NIV)

5. Do the will of God.

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. (Matthew 7:21)

Response: "Why do you keep on saying that I am your Lord, when you refuse to do what I say? Anyone who comes and listens to me and obeys me is like someone who dug down deep and built a house on solid rock. When the flood came and the river rushed against the house, it was built so well that it didn't even shake. But anyone who hears what I say and doesn't obey me is like someone whose house wasn't built on solid rock. As soon as the river rushed against that house, it was smashed to pieces!" (Luke 6:46-49 - CEV)

6. Believe in Jesus.

Whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. (John 3:16)

Response: And the taking in of knowledge of God and Jesus. (John 17:3)

He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life. (John 3:36)

Response: And those who disobey? (Jude 1:6)

Believeth on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved. (Acts 16:31)

Response: Believing, and in this case, learning the word and being baptized. (Acts 16:32-33)

7. Be born again.

Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. (John 3:3)

Response: An interesting point here. "Is born again" comes from the Greek geneses anothen which literally means "should be generated from above." (John 1:12-13)

8. Hear the words of Jesus and believe in whoever sent him.

He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life. (John 5:24)

Response: It is important not to overlook that in the later part of the verse Jesus makes reference of those who are spiritually dead coming alive spiritually. (Ephesians 2:1-2, 4-6; 1 Peter 4:3-6; Matthew 8:21-22)

9. Be born of water and the spirit.

Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. (John 3:5)

Response: Was the criminal impaled next to Jesus baptized? (Luke 23:43)

10. Be washed by the Holy Ghost.

Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost. (Titus 3:5)

Response: And the washing of regeneration through the blood of Christ Jesus. (1 John 1:7)

11. Be converted and become like a little child.

Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. (Matthew 18:3)

Response: Receptiveness, humility and trust. "Brothers, stop thinking like children. In regard to evil be infants, but in your thinking be adults." (1 Corinthians 14:20 - NIV

12. Hate your own life.

The man who loves his life will lose it, while the man who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life. (John 12:25)

Response: Life here is from the Greek psykhen; Hebrew naphshoh, from nephesh. Soul. Many people would give their life for freedom, but A Christian will give his life for eternal life rather than disobey God and perish. The word hate is used often in the Bible to indicate that one loves something less than another. (Genesis 29:31-33; Deuteronomy 21:15-16)

13. Believe and be baptized.

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved. (Mark 16:16)

Response: Mark 16:16 is a spurious scripture, added on much later.

14. Call upon the name of the Lord.

Whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved. (Acts 2:21)

Response: The Lord's name, in this case, is Jehovah. The name was replaced with the generic term LORD out of religious superstition. I ask how can they call the name if they don't know it? Paul asks how can they call out the name without faith? (Romans 10:14)

15. Confess with your mouth "Jesus is Lord" and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead.

If thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. (Romans 10:9)

Response: And yet some will say "Lord, Lord" and yet he never knew them. Some translations read acknowledgment or confession. It is a continuation of the acknowledgment or confession after baptism. Baptism is a public declaration, which continues.

16. Follow the commandments (at least some of them)

If you want to enter into life, keep the commandments. He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love neighbour as thyself. (Matthew 19:17-19)

Response: Christians are not under the Law of Moses. (Colossians 2:13-14)

Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life. (Revelation 22:14)

Response: Most other translations I checked says "wash their robes" instead of "do his commandments." NIV, NASB, ESV, CEV, NKJV (footnote).

17. Keep the commandments (at least some of them), give all your money to the poor, and follow Jesus.

And a certain ruler asked him, saying, Good Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? . . . Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother. And he said, All these have I kept from my youth up. . . . Thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me. (Luke 18:18-22)

Response: Notice that Jesus is speaking directly to the man, "Thou one thing . . ." Jesus knew that to this man who kept the commandments since his youth there was something he loved more than that which he was seeking from Jesus. It wasn't that there is something wrong with riches, but to this man those riches were his true master. (Matthew 6:24-32)

18. Keep the commandments and the faith of Jesus.

Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus. (Revelation 14:12)

Response: The endurance of the faithful is a very individual sort of thing. "If anyone [is meant] for captivity, he goes away into captivity. If anyone will kill with the sword, he must be killed with the sword. Here is where it means the endurance and faith of the holy ones." (Revelation 13:10)

19. Endure to the end.

He that endureth to the end shall be saved. (Matthew 10:22; 24:13; Mark 13:13)

Response: Yes. There is nothing to say to this.
 
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