Investigative Judgment

[Olikamay]

Oh ye of little (next to none) faith. Of all the things that EGW said would come to pass in these last days--and all that has come true, how can you doubt now? The old addage is, he who laughs last laughs best, applies here. Except it really isn't so funny. How many times throughout history when people have laughed and criticised God's prophets did those same people have to eat crow? My oh my.

Da'll neber lurn!

 

[statrei]

Oh ye of little (next to none) faith. Of all the things that EGW said would come to pass in these last days--and all that has come true, how can you doubt now? The old addage is, he who laughs last laughs best, applies here. Except it really isn't so funny. How many times throughout history when people have laughed and criticised God's prophets did those same people have to eat crow? My oh my.

Da'll neber lurn!

Nothing we have said contradicts what she wrote. Read again the section you highlighted. Take your time. Then read what we posted. When you are finished detail the contradictions you have discovered. EGW is not the problem. The problem is with those smart people who twisted her words.

 

[StormyOne]

Testimonies for the Church Volume Nine, page 232, paragraph 2

Chapter Title: The Religious Liberty Work

The light given me by the Lord at a time when we were expecting just such a crisis as you seem to be approaching, was that when the people were moved by a power from beneath to enforce Sunday observance, Seventh-day Adventists were to show their wisdom by refraining from their ordinary work on that day, devoting it to missionary effort.

To defy the Sunday laws will but strengthen in their persecution the religious zealots who are seeking to enforce them. Give them no occasion to call you lawbreakers. If they are left to rein up men who fear neither God nor man, the reining up will soon lose its novelty for them, and they will see that it is not consistent nor convenient for them to be strict in regard to the observance of Sunday. Keep right on with your missionary work, with your Bibles in your hands, and the enemy will see that he has worsted his own cause. One does not receive the mark of the beast because he shows that he realizes the wisdom of keeping the peace by refraining from work that gives offense, doing at the same time a work of the highest importance.


When we devote Sunday to missionary work, the whip will be taken out of the hands of the arbitrary zealots who would be well pleased to humiliate Seventh-day Adventists. When they see that we employ ourselves on Sunday in visiting the people and opening the Scriptures

233

to them, they will know that it is useless for them to try to hinder our work by making Sunday laws.

Sunday can be used for carrying forward various lines of work that will accomplish much for the Lord. On this day open-air meetings and cottage meetings can be held. House-to-house work can be done. Those who write can devote this day to writing their articles. Whenever it is possible, let religious services be held on Sunday. Make these meetings intensely interesting. Sing genuine revival hymns, and speak with power and assurance of the Saviour's love. Speak on temperance and on true religious experience. You will thus learn much about how to work, and will reach many souls.

Let the teachers in our schools devote Sunday to missionary effort. I was instructed that they would thus be able to defeat the purposes of the enemy. Let the teachers take the students with them to hold meetings for those who know not the truth. Thus they will accomplish much more than they could in any other way.

According to the above statements, EGW suggests that we use Sunday to spread the word... so where is the conflict?

 

[StormyOne]

Let me add that if we follow the counsel given we would not be in violation of any law enacted to observe Sunday.....

remember she said:

Sunday can be used for carrying forward various lines of work that will accomplish much for the Lord. On this day open-air meetings and cottage meetings can be held. House-to-house work can be done. Those who write can devote this day to writing their articles. Whenever it is possible, let religious services be held on Sunday. Make these meetings intensely interesting. Sing genuine revival hymns, and speak with power and assurance of the Saviour's love. Speak on temperance and on true religious experience. You will thus learn much about how to work, and will reach many souls.

 

[deu58]

Hi all

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According to the above statements, EGW suggests that we use Sunday to spread the word... so where is the conflict?

I have not seen this before, And it seems very confusing, Are saying that she said when the law comes to go ahead and stop worshipping on the sabbath???

To keep the Sunday law???

 

[StormyOne]

Hi all



I have not seen this before, And it seems very confusing, Are saying that she said when the law comes to go ahead and stop worshipping on the sabbath???

To keep the Sunday law???

No she suggests that services be held on both days....

 

[StormyOne]

I never said it was about us. Don't YOU start putting words in my mouth now, as well.

I told you what I intend to do...there's no "WE" in I

That was not my intent, and I am not sure I could put words in your mouth.....lol Let me rephrase... Sassy I would hope that if confronted with a decision at that time, you follow the Lord's leading.... That you would do His will and not your will...(how's that?)

 

[deu58]

Hi Stormy one

No she suggests that services be held on both days....

How can you still keep Saturday when it is forbidden by law to do so??? It is my understanding that the Sunday keepers will be killing the Sabbath keepers during the great tribulation,

So I do not understand how pretending to keep the Sunday law is going to avert the wrath of the anti Christ towards sabbath keepers,

I am used to the historical Adventists interpretation of the Sunday law, Where they will be running and hiding, Not witnessing on Sunday and holding religious services,

probably why I never saw this particular teaching from the writings, I have never heard any SDA here speak of it before,

Many SDA's where I live have already sold their posessions and moved to the mountains because they believe the Sunday law is soon to come,

We live in a predominatly Catholic country so many traditional SDA's are pretty skittish most of the time any way, Many Tradational Adventists here are afraid of the Catholic church,

yours in Christ
deu 58

 

[statrei]

probably why I never saw this particular teaching from the writings, I have never heard any SDA here speak of it before,

I truly hope you keep this basic concept in mind in the future. I could save us quite a bit of misunderstanding. Many people who spout off about EGW have only read and digested what was presented to them at a seminar. The rest they just read over and subconsciously fit into the model they were given.

 

[statrei]

How can you still keep Saturday when it is forbidden by law to do so??? It is my understanding that the Sunday keepers will be killing the Sabbath keepers during the great tribulation,

You'd be surprised at how effective such a mentality is at keeping people committed to a cause. There is nothing much stronger than the victim or martyr complex.

 

[statrei]

Hi all



I have not seen this before, And it seems very confusing, Are saying that she said when the law comes to go ahead and stop worshipping on the sabbath???

To keep the Sunday law???

A Sunday law could never forbid worship on the Sabbath, nor could it forbid you from going to church on the Sabbath. Just think of what that entails. They can forbid you from having church services at all, but who would that target?

 

[Olikamay]

Let's look at the other thing this belief does... it generates fear and paranoia.... those things should be absent when it comes to the things of God.... Daniel was not fearful, he knew God would be faithful to him....

The disciples were not fearful, nor did it cross their minds, they did what the Holy Spirit compelled them to do, and rested in the fact that God would be faithful in His promises to them....

We sometimes preach fear... why?

Stormy--yes--part of the sunday law will be a forbidding to recognize the true Sabbath. Do you think satan will be satified with just the sunday law?? Heavens NO--his aim to rid the earth of ALL that is God's or that is holy. Here is some more council.

After the Sabbath has been sacredly observed, in places where

the opposition is so strong as to arouse persecution if work is done

on Sunday, let our brethren make that day an occasion to do genuine

missionary work. Let them visit the sick and the poor, ministering

to their wants, and they will find favorable opportunities to open

the Scriptures to individuals and to families. Thus most profitable

work can be done for the Master. When those who hear and see

the light on the Sabbath take their stand upon the truth to keep

God's holy day, difficulties will arise, for efforts will be brought to

bear against them to compel men and women to transgress the law

of God. Here they must stand firm, that they will not violate the

law of God, and if the opposition and persecution are determinedly

kept up, let them heed the words of Christ, 'When they

persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say

unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son

of man be come.'



The Lord will judge according to their works those who are

seeking to establish a law of the nations that will cause men to

violate the law of God. In proportion to their guilt will be

their punishment. The Lord would have us lift up the Sabbath

of the Lord our God. We have a sacred work to do in opening

blind eyes in regard to the day that the Lord has set apart and

sanctified as the rest day of mankind. (my insert-some say that the Advent movement was only to declare the second coming—this proves them wrong)

He declares, "The seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God." He has

placed His own signature upon that day that He has set apart

to be observed as long as time shall last. We should have much

to say upon this subject just now.

While we cannot bow to an arbitrary power to lift up
the Sunday by bowing to it, while we will not violate the
Sabbath, which a despotic power will seek to compel us to do, we will be wise in Christ. . . .




So you see--the TRUE test will not be in helping folks of the sunday--but indeed will be to resist the powers when they demand our violation of the Sabbath. Then the sheep and goats will be known.

 

[statrei]

When I read certain posts it becomes a bit easier to understand how people who suffered under Saddam Hussein could prefer that life than the promised "liberty." When you have lived in a certain atmosphere for a long time it begins to fit like a glove and good news sounds like horror.

 

[StormyOne]

The sheep and goats need only be known by the True Shepherd....

It is not possible for the reasons I outlined previously to enforce a law that prohibits worship on sabbath (they would track that how?) and make mandatory worship on Sunday. Logistically its not possible. The recent hurricane and the poor crisis plans should make that obvious. They could not even get 100,000 people out of a flooding city to safety, so making 270 million people here in the U.S. and the billions of people globally to not worship on one day and worship on Sunday will be possible.... naw... that boat won't float today... IMO

 

[statrei]

They could not even get 100,000 people out of a flooding city to safety, so making 270 million people here in the U.S. and the billions of people globally to not worship on one day and worship on Sunday will be possible.... naw... that boat won't float today... IMO

It would float in a flooding city, however.

Another point most who quote EGW on this overlook is that she understood that Christ would have come long before we got to 2000. In 1856 she was told by an angel that Christ would return within a generation or so. I put that information in the same category as Christ's statement to His disciples that He would return within a generation. Each time humans drop the ball new contingency plans have to be put into effect. I don't even think we can extend those predictions beyond their "natural" lives.

 

[SpeakNow]

All I can say, StormyOne, is "we'll see".

 

[statrei]

All I can say, StormyOne, is "we'll see".

Why wait to see when you can read and understand? God expects us to actively seek His will.

 

[StormyOne]

Hi Stormy one

How can you still keep Saturday when it is forbidden by law to do so??? It is my understanding that the Sunday keepers will be killing the Sabbath keepers during the great tribulation,

So I do not understand how pretending to keep the Sunday law is going to avert the wrath of the anti Christ towards sabbath keepers,

I am used to the historical Adventists interpretation of the Sunday law, Where they will be running and hiding, Not witnessing on Sunday and holding religious services,

probably why I never saw this particular teaching from the writings, I have never heard any SDA here speak of it before,

Many SDA's where I live have already sold their posessions and moved to the mountains because they believe the Sunday law is soon to come,

We live in a predominatly Catholic country so many traditional SDA's are pretty skittish most of the time any way, Many Tradational Adventists here are afraid of the Catholic church,

yours in Christ
deu 58

Well Deu (pleasure to talk with you by the way) there is a saying in another forum I am on... "This ain't sabbath school, we pay attention...." I have provided her statements, and where they can be found. I suppose you may want to ask your traditional or historic adventist friends why they felt the need to hold out some crucial info from you.... She said it, and as I said, if that counsel is followed, there would be no conflict....

Let me quickly add that the scenario that is often painted is not supported by scripture.... The fake 2nd coming to the national sunday law to the being killed... I haven't seen it yet.....

Lastly remember the context. The early adventists believed that they were to work a literal 6 days then rest on Sabbath. They got in trouble because they refused to close their businesses on Sunday. So even then they were worshipping on Sabbath, but getting into trouble because of not obeying the laws of the land on Sunday.... let that sink in for a moment....

 

[statrei]

Lastly remember the context. The early adventists believed that they were to work a literal 6 days then rest on Sabbath. They got in trouble because they refused to close their businesses on Sunday. So even then they were worshipping on Sabbath, but getting into trouble because of not obeying the laws of the land on Sunday.... let that sink in for a moment....

This raises a question that deu and I have debated elsewhere: Is the church always correct in what it concludes and believes. The evidence is clear that being under the influence of the Holy Spirit does not prevent one from making fundamental errors. The worst error man can make has already been made.

 

[deu58]

Hi Stormyone

Lastly remember the context. The early adventists believed that they were to work a literal 6 days then rest on Sabbath. They got in trouble because they refused to close their businesses on Sunday. So even then they were worshipping on Sabbath, but getting into trouble because of not obeying the laws of the land on Sunday.... let that sink in for a moment....

I was not aware that early SDA's were following the 6 days of work rule and 1 of rest, When did that change?? I have seen on Sabbath threads where SDA's are asked why they do not work 6 days and the question usually goes unanswered,