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So are you saying that before moses’ time, incestuous relations didn’t cause birth defects?
there are clear levitical laws regarding these types of relations. in 2019 we should take Pauls approach he speaks of in 1 Cor 9:22 saying "I have become all things to all people" while at the same time noting in v21 "I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law". Why do we do this? he has an answer for that too in v23... "I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings"This is going to sound strange but bear with me. Many times throughout the Bible we see relationships that are considered strange in 2019 and rightly so. In Genesis we see Noahs son Canan apperently have sexual relations with his mother.
“And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without.”
Genesis 9:22 KJV
Many commentators believe that it is a son and mother interaction here because as Noahs wife, she is Noah’s nakedness.(Research into it if you’d like)
Also we see Lot’s children chose to have sex with their father in order to continue his lineage.
“And the firstborn said unto the younger, Our father is old, and there is not a man in the earth to come in unto us after the manner of all the earth: Come, let us make our father drink wine, and we will lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.”
Genesis 19:31-32 KJV
In both of these passages it is clear that this was not acceptable to Noah nor Lot. If it were acceptable, Noah would not have said
“Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren.”
Genesis 9:25 kjv
And Lot would not have been made drunk in order to be raped essentially by his daughters.
BUT
What we do see in MANY places throughout the Bible, especially the Torah, the husbands and wives usually tend to be cousins. See abraham and sarah. Jacob and rachel. Issac and rebekah and many more, too many to list!
So I guess my question for you guys is this:
Was it part of Gods design to keep marriage within the family? 1st, 2nd or 3rd cousins?
Or
Was this just because of the low amount of Jews in the early years of life on Earth and since Jews only married Jews that’s just how it happened?
Or
Do you think it was just because the population as a whole was just very small?
And more than that, as Christians in 2019 how should we stand on inter-family marriage?
No, I mean how do you know that defects were only caused by mother/son incest rather than sister/brother incest. You said something about “mankind’s blood not being able to handle” it anymore.
Bro,At first glance i see where you are coming from, but, i urge you to look into some commentaries and research on this passage. Even just a quick google search. Would your father curse you to God and ask him to make you a servant of a servant just for making fun of him? Very interesting stuff but beyond the point i was making. 1. I didnt ever ask if these things were wrong. And 2. Your opinion really is irrelevant, im looking for a more biblical solution rather than peoples opinions when it comes to inter family marriage.
What we do see in MANY places throughout the Bible, especially the Torah, the husbands and wives usually tend to be cousins. See abraham and sarah. Jacob and rachel. Issac and rebekah and many more, too many to list!
My take on Noah.This is going to sound strange but bear with me. Many times throughout the Bible we see relationships that are considered strange in 2019 and rightly so. In Genesis we see Noahs son Canan apperently have sexual relations with his mother.
“And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without.”
Genesis 9:22 KJV
Many commentators believe that it is a son and mother interaction here because as Noahs wife, she is Noah’s nakedness.(Research into it if you’d like)
Also we see Lot’s children chose to have sex with their father in order to continue his lineage.
“And the firstborn said unto the younger, Our father is old, and there is not a man in the earth to come in unto us after the manner of all the earth: Come, let us make our father drink wine, and we will lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.”
Genesis 19:31-32 KJV
In both of these passages it is clear that this was not acceptable to Noah nor Lot. If it were acceptable, Noah would not have said
“Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren.”
Genesis 9:25 kjv
And Lot would not have been made drunk in order to be raped essentially by his daughters.
BUT
What we do see in MANY places throughout the Bible, especially the Torah, the husbands and wives usually tend to be cousins. See abraham and sarah. Jacob and rachel. Issac and rebekah and many more, too many to list!
So I guess my question for you guys is this:
Was it part of Gods design to keep marriage within the family? 1st, 2nd or 3rd cousins?
Or
Was this just because of the low amount of Jews in the early years of life on Earth and since Jews only married Jews that’s just how it happened?
Or
Do you think it was just because the population as a whole was just very small?
And more than that, as Christians in 2019 how should we stand on inter-family marriage?
Do you think it was just because the population as a whole was just very small?
Wait... what? Did I miss an important part? What’s a Luciferian? If that’s off-topic, can you start a post about Luciferianism, because I don’t know what that is but it sounds like something that should have a post. I’m guessing it has something to do with Lucifer?Yes. With Adam and Noah new beginnings necessitated incestuous relations. By Moses, it was not needed, and the restriction was stated.
The problem of incest is blood lines. Incest is still quite common in European royal families and in the wealthy aristocrats of the world who want to keep the wealth in the family. For the royals, they promote the myth that they are descendants of Christ through Mary Magdalene, so it is the continuation of the "divine" bloodline.
Up until the time of Christ, genealogies were kept, first with the line of Seth, then the line of Shem, Abraham, Judah, David and his descendants because the promise of the Messiah was given to them. Thus incestuous marriages, not immediate per se, but 1st, 2nd, and 3rd cousins, were kept looking forward to the Messiah.
But the Messiah has come. Now the bloodline is passed on spiritually through the new birth. All who are born again have joined into that blood line.
So, today, there is no need for incestuous marriages. The European royals are in truth, Luciferians and believe that the new Messiah, which we call anti-christ, will come through their line, along with the wealthy aristocrats.
Then why did Shem & Japheth feel the need to avert their eyes? Did they feel like they would be tempted, too?It is a euphemism for sexual activity.
Again why? and where do you see Biblical support for this?I disagree. Through marriage, I take my wife's nakedness personally, and anyone viewing her nudity commits an offense against me. I thought that much would be clear. Does this mean I can never personally be naked? Am I not permitted to be equally protective of my own nakedness? I would think it absurd that Noah drank wine, causing his wife's clothes to fall off (reminds me of a country music tune, but I digress). I might add that his wife was not referenced.
Yes, and it was a sin, I'm sure.
God probably did not create Adam and Eve with deleterious genes. I assume the recessive mutations came later. That being the case, marriage between near relatives earlier on was not harmful as it is now. Give it enough time, and we'll find that we can't get far enough away in our relations to prevent these kinds of problems.
No. It was part of God's design to mix and match genomes, not make carbon copies.
Ok so where do you even get this idea Bionically?
None of the people you just mentioned were Jews, nor did any Jews exist, anywhere, when those people walked the Earth.
I understand that they were not labeled Jews at that time but their faith makes them Jews looking backward in time.
The size of the population would have made it more necessary, but not more acceptable. It was the age of the human species, as a whole, that made the difference. If the Flood happened today, and our population were bottle-necked like that, now, the survivors and their offspring would probably go extinct.
We oppose it like the good citizens we are.
Wait... what? Did I miss an important part? What’s a Luciferian? If that’s off-topic, can you start a post about Luciferianism, because I don’t know what that is but it sounds like something that should have a post. I’m guessing it has something to do with Lucifer?
Im interpreting it the way that Leviticus describes it.Bro,
sometimes naked just means naked. Never once have I seen it interpreted the way you are trying to interpret it, and by church uses the original Greek translation of the OT.
It is off topic, but one reason the royals and wealthy incestuously intermarry. Luciferian and Satanism are similar but different by degree. Luciferians are people who worship Lucifer and use satanic ritual abuse and mind control to keep the families under Lucifer. This is why Lucifer has maintained family lines that worship him for generations. It is through the Luciferians that the blood line for the anti-christ will come, but they think is the real "savior" of the world. Luciferians look down on Satanists who are not in the blood line.
Satanists are all those who want power to do selfish desires. As Anton LeVey had said, Do what thou wilt. These people include witches, warlocks, sorcerers, and the like. They are not part of the global plan for the end time world government. They are useful idiots for the Luciferians.
I thought that was a Crowley quote?
But, this is off topic, so we should not pursue it in this thread.
All you need to do is read up on Fundamentalist Mormonism who practice marriage between cousins and see it causes genetic disease. So I would say, avoid at all cost.And more than that, as Christians in 2019 how should we stand on inter-family marriage?
Wow!All you need to do is read up on Fundamentalist Mormonism who practice marriage between cousins and see it causes genetic disease. So I would say, avoid at all cost.
Polygamist community faces rare genetic disorder - Reuters
So I guess my question for you guys is this:
Was it part of Gods design to keep marriage within the family? 1st, 2nd or 3rd cousins?
Or
Was this just because of the low amount of Jews in the early years of life on Earth and since Jews only married Jews that’s just how it happened?
Or
Do you think it was just because the population as a whole was just very small?
And more than that, as Christians in 2019 how should we stand on inter-family marriage?
All you need to do is read up on Fundamentalist Mormonism who practice marriage between cousins and see it causes genetic disease. So I would say, avoid at all cost.
Polygamist community faces rare genetic disorder - Reuters
Many commentators believe that it is a son and mother interaction here because as Noahs wife, she is Noah’s nakedness.(Research into it if you’d like)
I took the time to read the article that you linked to another person later on. I found the article outstanding. It cultural issue of that era to claim head of dynasty by having intercourse with the current head's spouse and concubines explains so much.
I shared highlights with my wife and that sparked a long discussion on the issue of incest. She believes, and I agree with her, that from Adam the knowledge that incest was wrong was in the heart of everyone. Of course, of necessity, God had to suppress that knowledge in the beginning so the Earth could be populated. Likewise after the Flood the necessity came again.
Since at that time, marrying and procreating with relatives was a natural behavior with no taboo, we came to the conclusion that the idea of establishing the head of a dynasty was the result of the unrighteous line. We could not imagine that Seth, the 3rd son of Adam and Eve would sleep with Eve to establish a dynasty of a righteous line. It seems more likely that Cain's son, Enoch (or one of his sons) began such a vile practice. Clearly it had to begin before the Flood since it was known after the Flood by Ham and the wrongness of such action was understood by his brothers Shem and Japheth. Looking at Cain's line we see the seeds of the world had begun with his grandson, Lamech, who took 2 wives and told them he had slain a man and if Cain was avenged sevenfold he would be avenged seventy and sevenfold. Truly misunderstood what God did with Cain, and perverted this even more so.
Regarding Lot's daughters, we have no idea what the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah looked like. From their point of view, they probably truly believed the world had come to an end and that it was up to them to repopulate the world. No doubt their perspective had been affected by the perverse lives of their former neighbors.
Anyway, just want to thank you for linking to that article. It opened our eyes and gave us better understanding of the story, including why Reuben slept with Bilhah and Absalom slept with David's wives and concubines. Even the story of Abishag lying with David in his old age.
I am glad that I was able to get your mind moving a bit and spark up a conversation between you and your spouse. I would love to take credit for linking that specific article but it actually was not me who linked it. Have a blessed day!I took the time to read the article that you linked to another person later on. I found the article outstanding. It cultural issue of that era to claim head of dynasty by having intercourse with the current head's spouse and concubines explains so much.
I shared highlights with my wife and that sparked a long discussion on the issue of incest. She believes, and I agree with her, that from Adam the knowledge that incest was wrong was in the heart of everyone. Of course, of necessity, God had to suppress that knowledge in the beginning so the Earth could be populated. Likewise after the Flood the necessity came again.
Since at that time, marrying and procreating with relatives was a natural behavior with no taboo, we came to the conclusion that the idea of establishing the head of a dynasty was the result of the unrighteous line. We could not imagine that Seth, the 3rd son of Adam and Eve would sleep with Eve to establish a dynasty of a righteous line. It seems more likely that Cain's son, Enoch (or one of his sons) began such a vile practice. Clearly it had to begin before the Flood since it was known after the Flood by Ham and the wrongness of such action was understood by his brothers Shem and Japheth. Looking at Cain's line we see the seeds of the world had begun with his grandson, Lamech, who took 2 wives and told them he had slain a man and if Cain was avenged sevenfold he would be avenged seventy and sevenfold. Truly misunderstood what God did with Cain, and perverted this even more so.
Regarding Lot's daughters, we have no idea what the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah looked like. From their point of view, they probably truly believed the world had come to an end and that it was up to them to repopulate the world. No doubt their perspective had been affected by the perverse lives of their former neighbors.
Anyway, just want to thank you for linking to that article. It opened our eyes and gave us better understanding of the story, including why Reuben slept with Bilhah and Absalom slept with David's wives and concubines. Even the story of Abishag lying with David in his old age.
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