Important Question In Regards To Christianity

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What is the reason for the continued power of Christianity? Is it the life, story, and message of Jesus or the industrialization of Christianity?

In other words, are you Christian because of the story of Jesus or because what happened after his crusification which was the Bible, development of churches, sects, and etc.
 

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What is the reason for the continued power of Christianity? Is it the life, story, and message of Jesus or the industrialization of Christianity?

In other words, are you Christian because of the story of Jesus or because what happened after his crusification which was the Bible, development of churches, sects, and etc.
Isn't it the same thing?
Since the story is true about Who God is, God has brought Christianity to flourish around the world.
 
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OzSpen

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jonathan,

The continued power of Christianity comes
from truth. Things that don't have a hint of truth to them rarely survive on
a large scale.
Have Hinduism, Buddhism, paganism and Islam survived on a large scale?
They have, so does that make them truthful to the world of reality in which
you and I live?
 
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jonathan180iq

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jonathan,


Have Hinduism, Buddhism, paganism and Islam survived on a large scale?
They have, so does that make them truthful to the world of reality in which
you and I live?

Other religions still exist because there are hints of truth in them. Other religions exist because people want to find God. I think the fact that there are so many religions is evidence itself that there is a God. It's just that they are slightly misguided in their understanding of who and what God is.
 
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OzSpen

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jonathan,

Other religions still exist because there are hints of truth in them. Other religions exist because people want to find God. I think the fact that there are so many religions is evidence itself that there is a God. It's just that they are slightly misguided in their understanding of who and what God is.
Slightly misguided??? Buddhism is atheistic.
 
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jonathan180iq

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jonathan,


Slightly misguided??? Buddhism is atheistic.
I am not saying that it's right.
But do we not agree that there are certain aspects that are respectable, like the importance of meditation/prayer? Or the teaching that the pains of this world are temporary and that there is a greater reward on the "other side".
 
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OzSpen

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jonathan,

I am not saying that it's right.
But do we not agree that there are certain aspects that are respectable, like the importance of meditation/prayer? Or the teaching that the pains of this world are temporary and that there is a greater reward on the "other side".
I agree that meditation and prayer are important, but Buddhist meditation is radically different to meditation on the Lord God Almighty, Jesus Christ, the Scriptures and openness to the ministry of the Holy Spirit.

The doctrine of trials/pains in this world and God's intent for the Christian believer, as summarised in verses such as James 1:2-4, is very different from the Buddhist approach to suffering. Buddhism and Christianity are poles apart when we look at the reason for suffering.

In Christ,
Spencer
 
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jonathan180iq

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jonathan,
I agree that meditation and prayer are important, but Buddhist meditation is radically different to meditation on the Lord God Almighty, Jesus Christ, the Scriptures and openness to the ministry of the Holy Spirit.

The doctrine of trials/pains in this world and God's intent for the Christian believer, as summarised in verses such as James 1:2-4, is very different from the Buddhist approach to suffering. Buddhism and Christianity are poles apart when we look at the reason for suffering.

In Christ,
Spencer

Right. Again, I am not saying that it is correct. I am simply saying that there are certain aspects of these other religions that have similar teachings on things that we Christians consider holy. Doctrines are profoundly different. Concepts are similar.

The explanation in James of why we suffer trials is to learn perserverance and to help develop dependence on the Lord. There is also the Christian foundation that the whole world is fallen and the reality we live in now is based in original sin. (Rom. 8:22)

Similarly, "the Buddha taught that humans suffer because we continually strive after things that do not give lasting happiness. We desperately try to hold on to things - friends, health, material things - that do not last, and this causes sorrow." -Religionfacts.com

The Buddhists also notice that life is full of suffering. This is to be expected, right (Romans 1:20)? These people aren't blind. They are looking and they see God's invisible qualities. They are simply ignorant to the truth. They lack the original cause of that suffering and knowledge of the attributes of God and his plan for redemption. Where they think they can enlighten themselves out of suffering is where they fail, since we know that salvation comes only through the sacrificial atonement of Christ.
 
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OzSpen

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jonathan,

Right. Again, I am not saying that it is correct. I am simply saying that there are certain aspects of these other religions that have similar teachings on things that we Christians consider holy. Doctrines are profoundly different. Concepts are similar.

The explanation in James of why we suffer trials is to learn perseverance and to help develop dependence on the Lord. There is also the Christian foundation that the whole world is fallen and the reality we live in now is based in original sin. (Rom. 8:22)

Similarly, "the Buddha taught that humans suffer because we continually strive after things that do not give lasting happiness. We desperately try to hold on to things - friends, health, material things - that do not last, and this causes sorrow." -Religionfacts.com

The Buddhists also notice that life is full of suffering. This is to be expected, right (Romans 1:20)? These people aren't blind. They are looking and they see God's invisible qualities. They are simply ignorant to the truth. They lack the original cause of that suffering and knowledge of the attributes of God and his plan for redemption. Where they think they can enlighten themselves out of suffering is where they fail, since we know that salvation comes only through the sacrificial atonement of Christ.
I agree with what you have said, that there can be aspects in other religions that draw people to them and these aspects may have some kind of cross-over with the Christian faith, but at a very reduced and distorted level.

We do know from Romans 1 that all people, whether Buddhist, Hindu, Muslim, Communist, pagan, occultist, materialist, etc. have a revelation of God in creation that confronts them with God's "invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature" that "have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world" (1:20). This leaves them "without excuse" (1:21), but they suppress this natural revelation because of their unrighteousness (1:18) and then proceed to commit sinful acts of "impurity" (1:24).

What if we get back to the original question asked in #1 of this thread:

Important Question In Regards To Christianity What is the reason for the continued power of Christianity? Is it the life, story, and message of Jesus or the industrialization of Christianity?

In other words, are you Christian because of the story of Jesus or because what happened after his crusification which was the Bible, development of churches, sects, and etc.
The continued power of the Christian gospel, in my understanding, is that God nails the human problem: (1) "The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately sick; who can understand it?" (Jer. 17:9), thus meaning, "all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God" (Rom. 3:23).

The power of Christianity is the power of Jesus to cause the inner change that Christ brings to my rebel, sinful human heart as is expressed in verses such as Ephesians 2:
And you were dead in the trespasses and sins.... But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ--by grace you have been saved.... For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no once can boast (vv 1, 4-5, 8-9, ESV)
The power of Christianity is the inner change and continuing power for change (called sanctification) that Jesus brings.

I'm a long term family therapist (33 years) and I've been exposed to many counselling psychological ways to bring change to people. But nobody brings the permanent change that Jesus' does. That's the power of Christianity. It is such a strong dynamic of change that people go to martyrs' graves in support of it, from the 1st century to the 21st century.

The beauty of the Scriptures is that they provide a diagnosis of the true problem (like no other religion) and the permanent solution to the problem. No other religion can do this. The Bible's diagnosis of the human dilemma and the solution for individuals, families, countries and the world, fits like a hand in a glove. The Christian world and life view fits reality.

While there are glimmers in other religions, the glaring light of Jesus and the permanent change he brings, is what gives the power to genuine Christianity.

Of course, there will be fakes and those who give up on the genuine solution.

In Christ, Spencer
 
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jonathan180iq

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I think we primarily agree on this issue.

And I agree that we should get back to the original question.

"Is it the life, story, and message of Jesus or the industrialization of Christianity?"
The staying power of Christianity, given the options listed, is certainly the life, message, and character of Christ. The "industrialization" can certainly be cited as a tool used to spread Christianity but it can aslo be cited as one of the things that turns people off to Christ. That claim cannot be made against Christ. Even atheists conclude that there isn't much wrong with the message of Christ. Their beef comes from problems within the church - infighting, hypocrisy, doctrinal disagreements etc...
 
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OzSpen

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jonathan,

I think we primarily agree on this issue.

And I agree that we should get back to the original question.

"Is it the life, story, and message of Jesus or the industrialization of Christianity?"
The staying power of Christianity, given the options listed, is certainly the life, message, and character of Christ. The "industrialization" can certainly be cited as a tool used to spread Christianity but it can aslo be cited as one of the things that turns people off to Christ. That claim cannot be made against Christ. Even atheists conclude that there isn't much wrong with the message of Christ. Their beef comes from problems within the church - infighting, hypocrisy, doctrinal disagreements etc...
The industrialisation has been used to spread Christianity in some parts of the world. However, there is the other dynamic of persecution being used to cause the faith to grow. Take China as an example with the underground church having approx. 100 million people in it. That, to me, is the power of the Christ of the cross -- the power to change lives and thus influence communities. There is also a considerable growth of Christianity in Africa and South America.

Since the problems within the church may be seen by atheists as reasons to oppose the faith and promote atheism, I am not of the view that occasional defects should be read as a detriment to a product. My Toyota Camry has had its problems over the 12 years I have owned it, but that will not prevent my purchasing another Camry when I need it. Overall, it's an excellent product.

I want to draw a parallel with Christianity. Yes, there are squabbles, hypocrisy and doctrinal disagreements, but the power of the overall product (changed lives through Christ) is superior to any other religious product I have met or experienced.

Jesus changes lives - permanently. The product is superb. The best!
 
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sdmsanjose

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Important Question In Regards To Christianity
What is the reason for the continued power of Christianity? Is it the life, story, and message of Jesus or the industrialization of Christianity?

In other words, are you Christian because of the story of Jesus or because what happened after his crusification which was the Bible, development of churches, sects, and etc.



IMO the reason for the continued power of Christianity is:

The vast majority of mankind believes in a higher power
The vast majority of mankind believes in good and evil
The vast majority of mankind believes in life after death
The vast majority of mankind believes in consequences
The vast majority of people believe they have spiritually failed

The message of Christ is that God’s GRACE overcomes all the above and that those that have failed and has faith in His message can be accepted into the better life after death.

In some Christians there is an observable affect on the spirit that results in a change in attitude and actions.
 
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