Immigration Myths and Global Realities

[Redac]

Let me ask you something Gad....just to keep things simple....

If there a legitimate stopping point? Is there a point where a nation should say "enough is enough....we should only let in those who enter legally "?

If not, why? If so, where is that point in your mind? When every 1 in 2 people is foreign born? When it's 1 in every 3? When it's 1 in 10?

Out of curiosity, would you find such a proportion of foreign-born residents acceptable if they were all technically allowed in legally? Is the legality of it the only concern for you?

 

[Ana the Ist]

Out of curiosity, would you find such a proportion of foreign-born residents acceptable if they were all technically allowed in legally? Is the legality of it the only concern for you?

If they came here because they truly embraced the values and culture....and were entirely non-dependent upon the state...the number I would be comfortable with would be pretty high. Perhaps 1 in 4....before I would put a halt on immigration to preserve our society.

That is, of course, depending upon an economic situation where we could afford that.

 

[Redac]

If they came here because they truly embraced the values and culture....and were entirely non-dependent upon the state...the number I would be comfortable with would be pretty high. Perhaps 1 in 4....before I would put a halt on immigration to preserve our society.

That is, of course, depending upon an economic situation where we could afford that.

It's getting off course a bit, but I'd say that such a number would hinder any kind of attempt to assimilate in the first place. Even if you could control for a desire to "truly embrace the values and culture" -- and I'm not sure how you might propose to do that without also screening for the actual ability to do so -- how effective can promotion of assimilation really be if a quarter of the population isn't even American in the first place? That number is similar to California right now, and that's not a great model for immigration overall.

 

[Ana the Ist]

It's getting off course a bit, but I'd say that such a number would hinder any kind of attempt to assimilate in the first place. Even if you could control for a desire to "truly embrace the values and culture" -- and I'm not sure how you might propose to do that without also screening for the actual ability to do so -- how effective can promotion of assimilation really be if a quarter of the population isn't even American in the first place? That number is similar to California right now, and that's not a great model for immigration overall.

And while you could certainly see that at first...2-3 generations later there's often just a few remnants of their previous culture left. Their children no longer speak spanish...they no longer pray 5 times a day. Instead they obsess over the new iphone.

Monolithic unchanging cultures tend to have monolithic unchanging problems. I know it's hard to see if you live here...here you just see the problems of multiculturalism.

Ask yourself though...how did Europeans, a group with fewer people and less resources than much of the world, end up conquering the entire globe and eventually defining culture for most of the world?

 

[Redac]

And while you could certainly see that at first...2-3 generations later there's often just a few remnants of their previous culture left.

This is a common refrain, but that's not really how things have turned out with Hispanic immigrants. As I stated earlier, the nature of their immigration is quite different from what happened a century ago.

This kind of assimilation only happens when the groups assimilating are compatible enough with the culture into which they're assimilating, and even then it's not always total assimilation. It also will absolutely not happen if you're comfortable with allowing enough legal immigration each year that fully a quarter of the country's population will always be foreign-born.

Monolithic unchanging cultures tend to have monolithic unchanging problems. I know it's hard to see if you live here...here you just see the problems of multiculturalism.

Cultures don't require mass immigration to avoid stagnation. That's ridiculous.

Ask yourself though...how did Europeans, a group with fewer people and less resources than much of the world, end up conquering the entire globe and eventually defining culture for most of the world?

I have my thoughts, but why don't you tell me?

 

[Ana the Ist]

This is a common refrain, but that's not really how things have turned out with Hispanic immigrants. As I stated earlier, the nature of their immigration is quite different from what happened a century ago.

How so?

This kind of assimilation only happens when the groups assimilating are compatible enough with the culture into which they're assimilating, and even then it's not always total assimilation. It also will absolutely not happen if you're comfortable with allowing enough legal immigration each year that fully a quarter of the country's population will always be foreign-born.

Ummm...I said I would be comfortable with it up to 1 in 4 before halting immigration. I didn't say for how long.

I would imagine that a great many of those would be from compatible cultures.

Cultures don't require mass immigration to avoid stagnation. That's ridiculous.

They do if they don't have any significant outside pressures to change...or if there's a significant internal pressure fighting against change.

I have my thoughts, but why don't you tell me?

The short version of it? As they moved out of the dark ages and into a more rational way of thinking, they began to more fully appreciate innovation....change. The close proximity of so many kingdoms meant you had to see what your neighbors did well, and copy it or improve upon it, or you might not survive.

It was a very different way of thinking back then compared to other peoples and societies. The long version really goes all the way back to Aristotle, but I'm not going to get into that.

 

[Rion]

Let me ask you something Gad....just to keep things simple....

If there a legitimate stopping point? Is there a point where a nation should say "enough is enough....we should only let in those who enter legally "?

If not, why? If so, where is that point in your mind? When every 1 in 2 people is foreign born? When it's 1 in every 3? When it's 1 in 10?

You're arguing with a Labour Brit over immigration. The same group that hasn't figured out that they lost the working class a long time ago.

 

[Herbert'sHoover]

The left wants open borders to facilitate voter population replacement because they can't convince the native population to go full communist. And if their treason is not checked, it will lead to civil war within our lifetimes.

 

[SummerMadness]

The left wants open borders to facilitate voter population replacement because they can't convince the native population to go full communist. And if their treason is not checked, it will lead to civil war within our lifetimes.

Read "native population" as white and the meaning of this post makes sense.

 

[Herbert'sHoover]

Read "native population" as white and the meaning of this post makes sense.

E are the majority, and up until av few decades ago, overwhelmingly so. Democrats only express their hatred for whites because we wouldn't buy into their agenda, then we became evil racist Nazi bigots, despite being the most charitable and hospitable people who have created the most advanced, generous and humanitarian societies on earth.

But all that must be forgotten about because communists need us to hate ourselves for their plan to work.

 

[SummerMadness]

E are the majority, and up until av few decades ago, overwhelmingly so. Democrats only express their hatred for whites because we wouldn't buy into their agenda, then we became evil racist Nazi bigots, despite being the most charitable and hospitable people who have created the most advanced, generous and humanitarian societies on earth.

But all that must be forgotten about because communists need us to hate ourselves for their plan to work.

I assume "E" means "we" but it says a lot, native = white, everyone else shouldn't be here, except for those darn Dem... er, liber... er, communists, yeah communists attacking the native white population!

 

[Herbert'sHoover]

I assume "E" means "we" but it says a lot, native = white, everyone else shouldn't be here, except for those darn Dem... er, liber... er, communists, yeah communists attacking the native white population!

It's your anti white hysteria that leads you to assume it's only whites against open borders treason.

 

[SummerMadness]

It's your anti white hysteria that leads you to assume it's only whites against open borders treason.

You mention "we" and talk about whites being under attack... yeah, "we" and "native population" means white.

 

[Herbert'sHoover]

You mention "we" and talk about whites being under attack... yeah, "we" and "native population" means white.

Again, it is only your anti white hysteria that leads you to believe it's only whites who advocate against open borders treason.

 

[W2L]

People fear illegal migrants because they are not putting there faith in God. In my fallible opinion. Most of these migrants are not the bad guy, although they break the law. How many people here have ever had a speeding ticket? Well, you broke the law.

James 2:12 So speak and so act as those who are to be judged under the law of liberty. 13 For judgment is without mercy to one who has shown no mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment.

 

[Herbert'sHoover]

People fear illegal migrants because they are not putting there faith in God. In my fallible opinion. Most of these migrants are not the bad guy, although they break the law. How many people here have ever had a speeding ticket? Well, you broke the law.

James 2:12 So speak and so act as those who are to be judged under the law of liberty. 13 For judgment is without mercy to one who has shown no mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment.

I don't think God is pleased by your using faith as a crutch for weakness.

 

[jazzflower92]

I don't think God is pleased by your using faith as a crutch for weakness.

Tell that to Sessions then.

 

[W2L]

The Lord was friends to prostitutes. I think we can be friends with immigrants. THe point is to show them love and mercy, to show them the gospel not the door. That's what any Christian should be thinking of. in my fallible opinion.

 

[W2L]

I don't think God is pleased by your using faith as a crutch for weakness.

What weakness is that?

 

[Herbert'sHoover]

The Lord was friends to prostitutes. I think we can be friends with immigrants. THe point is to show them love and mercy, to show them the gospel not the door. That's what any Christian should be thinking of. in my fallible opinion.

Then we should deport you as well, since you are so flippant with American security.