im still struggleing...

[Caty]

okay, so you know scriptures about just believeing and you'll be saved...its not that simple right, you also have to repent, confess things as sin, and ask God to forgive you. So how do i know that the scripture about blasphemey isn't as simple as "if your worried, you haven't..." because there are others scriptures that talk about people crying out for mercy and not being heard, and God laughing at sinners and stuff, so how do i know that once you commited that sin...what if those scriptures about mercy no longer apply to you??

 

[keryakos]

Caty this wont solve your problems but it might help some

If the Bible is the word of God then it is impossible absolutely impossible to have committed the unpardonable sin by any thing you have merely thought
The way i know this is simply because Jesus made it very clear in Matthew that this sin was a speaking sin ..It does begin as a thought in the heart as in a wilful deliberate choice knowing the fullest implications but it comes out as a speaking sin ..

I know you struggle like me with fears about things you have said mumbled uttered in some way and the above does not adresse that but i have been wanting to share it will you ..so at the very least you can cross all of these thoughts out as a possibility of committing this sin that way ..

Now to your post ..Honestly that is a very good question ..

Strictly speaking FAITH PLUS NOTHING EQUALS SALVATION .

Meaning that if you simply believe and place your trust in Christ that is all that is required .. No prayer is required no long litany of confession ..
Repentance means you change your mind and confession means you agree with God about your sins ..thats all ..that goes along with being saved but there are not a little list of things you must do in an exact order before you are saved ..that is a works salvation otherwise ..and it isn't like that .

Scriptures regarding God laughing at sinners ..not showing mercy ..usually are displaced from their context ..for example ..i could take the scripture
that says That if you doi not forgive others then your Heavenly Father will not forgive you .. And then wonder well what if i just had a bad argumenty with my mom then go out and then die suddenly from an aneuyrysm then that must mean im going to Hell ..

Ah ..but it doesn't .. because if you read what all of the scriptures say you will see that thtrue christian which is every one who has truely placed their faith in Christ and who is regenerated by the power of the Holy Ghost is eternally secure .. And even if you dont believe in Eternal Security of the believer still you must admit thats a pretty cheap Grace considering that you could loose it so easily ..

In short dont do that to yourself Caty its certainly not what God wants nor what he means ..

 

[Caty]

but i feel like God doesn't want me, like why have i gone this long like this...i wanted to get close to him & to get to know him, love him etc... But i feel like i've been pushed away & I feel like I was born to go to Hell, I wonder sometimes."why did God make me to want him and I can't even have him." I'm so tired of being depressed, not enjoying life like I used to, my dreams are gone cause i feel like i can't be anything w/out God in my life/on my side. I almost regret coming to God, because at least before maybe I had enough faith to go to Heaven, but now all that has been destroyed. I hate myself and I'm tired of being this and feeling these terrible things, I read stuff that tells me I'm on my way to Hell & stuff that tells me I "might" have hope...then I read things that tell me im okay (but they don't seem very logical) I told myself today that it was time to give up, But I don't understand how he could send someone who rejected him ALL their lives, someone who HATES him...to Hell w/soemone who wanted him and wanted to love and get to know him, but made some mistakes that they regret. I just don't get it. People post scriptues ( & I really do appreciate it don't get me wrong) but they appy to people who haven't done this terrible sin and not to me, tha's why they don't help me for long.

 

[annrobert]

Caty,
My heart goes out to you,I know how painful this all is.So does Jesus,He understands everything about us and He says to cast all our cares on Him because He cares for us.
Jesus has you in His hand and you will never perish.
You are safe.

I wonder sometimes."why did God make me to want him

Caty, it is impossible for you to want God without the Holy Spirit drawing you to Him.


7Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be

see , it is impossible for us to want God by ourself.

We only want Jesus because the Holy Spirit makes us know our need for Jesus and salvation, and makes us want to come to Him,which we have done.

Jesus said , he that cometh to Me I will in no wise cast out.
This has no exceptions, it applies to all.

everyone who comes to Jesus will in no wise be cast out for any reason,ever.


Jesus said he that believeth in Me has everlasting life

This is what Jesus said and Jesus is truth.

True repentance is believing in Jesus for salvation rather than any works.
True repentance is believing that Jesus has power to forgive sins and save us.

Confessing our sins and turning from them happens later.

All of us here confess our sins and try not to sin all the time.

This is proof we believe.
Jesus is trustworthy and Jesus said he that cometh to Me I will in no wise cast out.

Ocd is a painful illness and tries to tell us we cannot trust Jesus,give up, and we are doomed,but ocd lies to us.
We have an illness that is not trust worthy .
But Jesus is trustworthy.
Jesus is Truth.
Jesus will in no wise cast us out.

 

[Jayangel81]

" because there are others scriptures that talk about people crying out for mercy and not being heard, and God laughing at sinners and stuff

That was in proverbs, and that was about man proclaiming His Wisdom to be foolishness to theirs which caused them all sorts of problems.

God doesnt laugh at our sins, He is not pleased with it one bit and I can only imagine how it saddens Him, on how lost they are..

There is a prophecy how in the last days man will rebel against God Himself, I mean Man vs God one on one and how God laughs but it quickly turns into an anger..

God doesnt like sin, there is nothing to laugh about trust me

God knows you do not want to blaspheme Him. Don't listen to the devil whispering lies in your ears.

 

[kaykay9.0]

but i feel like God doesn't want me, like why have i gone this long like this...i wanted to get close to him & to get to know him, love him etc... But i feel like i've been pushed away & I feel like I was born to go to Hell, I wonder sometimes."why did God make me to want him and I can't even have him." I'm so tired of being depressed, not enjoying life like I used to, my dreams are gone cause i feel like i can't be anything w/out God in my life/on my side. I almost regret coming to God, because at least before maybe I had enough faith to go to Heaven, but now all that has been destroyed. I hate myself and I'm tired of being this and feeling these terrible things, I read stuff that tells me I'm on my way to Hell & stuff that tells me I "might" have hope...then I read things that tell me im okay (but they don't seem very logical) I told myself today that it was time to give up, But I don't understand how he could send someone who rejected him ALL their lives, someone who HATES him...to Hell w/soemone who wanted him and wanted to love and get to know him, but made some mistakes that they regret. I just don't get it. People post scriptues ( & I really do appreciate it don't get me wrong) but they appy to people who haven't done this terrible sin and not to me, tha's why they don't help me for long.

Don't give up, Caty. Bottom line is this...you have OCD. OCD causes us to distort and exaggerate things. Unfortunately, for us who are Christians struggling with OCD, it causes us to often take scripture and distort and exaggerate it and take it to lengths and depths that the Lord neveer intended. It causes us to be extremely legalistic with scripture. I truly believe this is what has happened with this scripture about "unforgivable sin." I think people whose heart is soft towards God, who desire to walk in the truth condemn themselves when these are not the kind of people the Lord had in mind at all when he was commenting on this. But again the OCD takes anything and enlarges it to the point that we think somehow we've done this. But it's just an OCD distortion.

 

[Caty]

thanks guys, I hope you all are right and I hope that I'm not an exception somewhere.

 

[Caty]

i feel like the exception may be that the scripture only applies to people who haven't committed the unforgivable sin, that because it says that "they will not have forgivness", i'm afraid that means---even if they come to him they will not have forgiveness. I'm also having a fear about the antichrist thing. i feel like since maybe im having all of these thoughts that maybe they are from me and since i want to go into politics after i graduate that maybe thats a sign. is there any way that someone could tell if this is a spiritual condition or a ocd one??? i also feel bad that whenever i have a thought against Jesus it doesn't affect me as bad as if i have one against the Spirit, I'm afraid that also is like a sign that its Spiritual.

 

[keryakos]

i feel like the exception may be that the scripture only applies to people who haven't committed the unforgivable sin, that because it says that "they will not have forgivness", i'm afraid that means---even if they come to him they will not have forgiveness. I'm also having a fear about the antichrist thing. i feel like since maybe im having all of these thoughts that maybe they are from me and since i want to go into politics after i graduate that maybe thats a sign. is there any way that someone could tell if this is a spiritual condition or a ocd one??? i also feel bad that whenever i have a thought against Jesus it doesn't affect me as bad as if i have one against the Spirit, I'm afraid that also is like a sign that its Spiritual.

Caty the anti christ is a man so you dont qualify there . So put that one out of your mind

A person who has committed this sin cannot come to him literaly cannot do it ..and from all indications they would not want to anyway .

the idea that you will trust Christ think you are saved and then find out when you die that oops you said this particular thing on this particular day so sorry ..is crazy , i say that having that fear myself ...but if you think about it is a crazy idea ...salvation is not a game show where if you screw up then you have lost .

 

[kaykay9.0]

I agree with keryakos about both issues. Again, as I said above OCD makes us distort things and believe that certain things apply to us when they don't.

 

[Caty]

okay thanks again guys, im feeling pretty good about everything right now, but you know i'll be back w/more fears. i have an app. on Monday and I get anxeity thinking about it, im afraid she'll end up telling me something i don't want to hear. but im gonna go this time.

 

[keryakos]

okay thanks again guys, im feeling pretty good about everything right now, but you know i'll be back w/more fears. i have an app. on Monday and I get anxeity thinking about it, im afraid she'll end up telling me something i don't want to hear. but im gonna go this time.

your welcome caty and thanks for the support that you give us you really are a blessing to us ..

i hope it goes well and please let us know how it goes

Andy

 

[Caty]

can you fear believeing soemthing, and then your ocd trick you into thinking you believe it??

& are you sure the Anti-Christ will be a man, I mean the Bible says that..."all men who look to Jesus will be saved." but that doesn't really mean that only men (it also means women) who look to Jesus will be saved. So can we be sure it will be a man????

 

[annrobert]

Caty,
that sin is not unforgiveable because Jesus died for all sin.
Jesus said he that cometh to Me I will in no wise cast out.
Jesus always tells the Truth,it is impossible for God to lie.
Jesus not only tells the Truth, Jesus is Truth.
and Jesus said he that cometh to Me I will in no wise cast out.
In no wise cast out.
In no wise cast out.
when we come to Jesus we will never ever be cast out,that is a promise from Jesus who is Truth.
After we have come to Jesus which we have,we are safe in His hand forever and none shall snatch us out and we will never perish.Never perish.
None shall snatch us out of His hand and we shall never perish.
No ocd thoughts or fears or obsessions or ruminations etc,shall snatch us out of His hand and we shall never perish.
Jesus guarantees us this.
We will in no wise be cast out ever for any reason.
We are not keeping ourself safe.
Jesus who is all powerful our Creator and Redeemer who washed us clean in His own blood is Himself keeping us safe.

The only reason why people are never forgiven for this sin is because they will never come to Jesus.
Since Jesus said he that cometh to Me I will in no wise cast out.


People who commit this sin do not like to retain God in their knowledge.

All of us here think about Jesus all the time and want Jesus and want forgiveness and want to please Jesus and want to serve Jesus and want to be with Jesus forever.

This is very very different from the people who do not like to retain God in their knowledge,
they do not want to think about Jesus
do not want to serve Jesus or please Jesus
do not regard Jesus's love and mercy
do not want Jesus forgiveness and do not think they need it
They could not careless about being with Jesus in heaven etc.
These people never come to Jesus for forgiveness and salvation
thus they never have forgiveness

7Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be

see , it is impossible for us to want God by ourself.

anyone who wants to come to Jesus is being drawn by the Holy Spirit , because our carnal mind is naturally an enemy to God.


However Jesus who is Truth states,he that cometh to Me I will in no wise cast out.

can you fear believeing soemthing, and then your ocd trick you into thinking you believe it??

Yes definately.
That has happened to me many times.

Also the antichrist does not like to retain God in his knowledge.
Instead rather than retain the real merciful gracious forgiving God in his knowledge,
he gets people to focus on himself, a phoney, to lead them away from the real God.
He has no fears about doing this ,he loves to do it.

 

[keryakos]

can you fear believeing soemthing, and then your ocd trick you into thinking you believe it??

& are you sure the Anti-Christ will be a man, I mean the Bible says that..."all men who look to Jesus will be saved." but that doesn't really mean that only men (it also means women) who look to Jesus will be saved. So can we be sure it will be a man????

According to Revelation it is a man ..

But even if it was a woman .. you have to be Anti Christ to be the Anti Christ
so you do not qualify ..

Thats two strikes against you Caty ..

 

[gracealone]

i feel like the exception may be that the scripture only applies to people who haven't committed the unforgivable sin, that because it says that "they will not have forgivness", i'm afraid that means---even if they come to him they will not have forgiveness. I'm also having a fear about the antichrist thing. i feel like since maybe im having all of these thoughts that maybe they are from me and since i want to go into politics after i graduate that maybe thats a sign. is there any way that someone could tell if this is a spiritual condition or a ocd one??? i also feel bad that whenever i have a thought against Jesus it doesn't affect me as bad as if i have one against the Spirit, I'm afraid that also is like a sign that its Spiritual.

Hi Caty,
It's excruciatingly painful and exhausting to continue in this compulsive cycle. Everything you've just written is classic OCD fodder. My OCD suggested that I might be turning into an athiest just because I'd read apologetic books. But real atheist's aren't bothered by their faith in and dependence on themselves. And the real antichrist won't feel bad at all about his hatred for God. "The gates of hell are locked from the inside."
None of these thoughts/spikes are "signs". The broken fire alarm in your head is what's making them feel or seem ominous. It's very hard to ignore those fight or flight emotions. We instinctually do the following things when we feel them. We either fight against the obsessions/spikes or we try to get away from them. Both reactions trick our brains into thinking that these thoughts are of extreme urgency and must be attended to right now. Treating OCD means doing the exact opposite of the instinctual response.
Picture your OCD thoughts like ghosts that pop into your head from time to time,(or all the time when OCD is bad), and attempt to scare the wits out of you. Nothing makes a ghost happier than to see us freak out about it's presence. But if you look the ghost straight in the eye, (or eye holes if your ghost happens to have a sheet over it's head), offer it a seat and tell it that you aren't going to let it spook you anymore because you have a life to live, then it will eventually give up on it's scare tactics. OCD thoughts will only die down and lose their punch if we starve them to death. Giving them attention feeds them. Ignoring them starves them. Although this concept is simple actually doing it is extremely hard. It means feeling like were risking something terrible. It means living with feelings of uncertainty for as long as it takes to extinguish a thought.
More than anything else you have to start treating your OCD as a disorder rather than a spiritual problem. All afflictions test our faith. OCD is a real affliction but it's also a teacher. It teaches us to get over ourselves and and to quit trying to define God by our freaked out emotions. It teaches us that His grace is sufficient for us & that His strength is perfected in our weaknesses. It teaches us to walk in faith even when we can't feel our faith. It teaches us that "obedience is the key to all doors" and though we may not feel close to God during a bad flare of our disorder we can still choose to serve Him. OCD can never rob us of that choice.
Don't give up Caty. God hasn't given up on you, He's not like that. OCD emotions have nothing to do with who He is - to you, for you, in you and through you.
I'm praying for you.
Mitzi

 

[Caty]

To me the signs are these thoughts that I've had and these feelings towards God ( I get kinda bitter every now and then)---but I don't want to have these feelings. I just want to be normal again. I keep wondering if my heart really hates God or if my heart is really that mean and it makes me sick to my stomach. another one of the sigs i think is that i want to go into politics or government and peoplesay that it will be a politican or something like that and now i'm worried that maybe God is telling me to change what i want to go into or he'll make me the Antichrist or something.

 

[kaykay9.0]

To me the signs are these thoughts that I've had and these feelings towards God ( I get kinda bitter every now and then)---but I don't want to have these feelings. I just want to be normal again. I keep wondering if my heart really hates God or if my heart is really that mean and it makes me sick to my stomach. another one of the sigs i think is that i want to go into politics or government and peoplesay that it will be a politican or something like that and now i'm worried that maybe God is telling me to change what i want to go into or he'll make me the Antichrist or something.

Caty, please listen to gracealone posted earlier. What she wrote pertains to properly handling this and any other OCD fear. This whole thing is OCD. You kinda see how one OCD fear morphed to another, can't you? Like keryakos wrote you, it's pretty Biblically clear that the anti-Christ will be a man. I know what you mean about the Bible saying sometimes just "man" when it means mankind, including women and children etc. but the Bible so clearly mentions "he" when discussing the anti-Christ that I think it's clear this is not one of those cases. I think it's clear "he" means a man in this case.

Some OCD fears just have to be rejected for what they are, and this is clearly one of them. If we let it, our OCD can have us fearing all kinds of things. At some point, we just have to say, "no, this is OCD." OCD fears are lies and exaggerations which may contain a grain of truth, but they can't be "argued out" generally because our OCD mind will find some way to say "yes, but..." Hope this makes sense.

 

[Stephen Kendall]

If you take Christ's commands seriously and obey them, then the love that you would practice would cast out fear. Your concern and seeking of God is indicating that you have a heart and fear for God. I use to be afraid as you about the Anti-Christ being even myself, because my understanding of God was poor and my heart was doing things my way, without concern to moralities. Through confessions and repentance, as well as serious studies of the Bible and Christian history, I came to understand things well. It is good to realize that we, as humans can turn from God. Wasn't Peter called Satan by Jesus? If you repent and confess, God is faithful to forgive you and love you. If you forgive and love, even your enemies, then God is faithful likewise. As you do to others, God will also do to you. I believe that the unforgivable sin, mortal sin, is the one that kills the conscience and soul. If you still seek God and ask for forgiveness, I believe that you are still alive and in grace. As you practice Jesus' teachings, you will love and forgive. It is good to realize the potential of sin, as Peter was called Satan, we should be realistic to our weaknesses and vulnerableness. Being honest and confessions help a lot. Listen closely to Jesus & follow him alone. Love you sister.

 

[Caty]

Thanks guys, I'm really trying and today my app. it makes me sick just thinking about it because I don't know where to start with her today either, But I'll just go with it. I really do want to thank you all cause I know it can be frustrating dealing with someone who will not just 'get it' cause I've been there..but i know that most of you have also been in my place so I know you understand, so thanks a bunch. today is pretty good and so was last night i'm taking a few steps ahead.