If you missed it: More than 50% of Americans now live in states where SSM is legal.

[TLK Valentine]

It never had a chance anyway. They couldn't muster enough support to pass it in 2004 when gay marriage was the signature issue. Only a cynical politician trying to cobble together a loose association of fanatics to fund-raise would come up with that one.

You called?

 

[Joykins]

When people are being told to either: "Give up their religious beliefs, or give up their business." Then that is persecuting someone based on their religious beliefs.

What religion, or lack thereof, are people being forced to convert to or from to keep their businesses?

You could bake a cake and stick it in a display and someone could buy it and use it in some child molesting criminal orgy and you would never know. But to celebrate a marriage between two adults...horrors.

 

[MachZer0]

Actually it kinda is what you are suggesting, Vylo.

The fact some homosexuals consider themselves to be Christian, doesn't change the fact that according to the religion they claim to be a part of, homosexual behavior is considered sinful.

If the baker refused to bake say cookiees for some generic celebration because the person making the request happened to be gay, then the baker would be practicing discrimination towards gays.

However, this is over the baking of a cake to be used for a specific event that celebrates and "legitimizes" a behavior that the baker considers to be sinful due to his religion. So by not finding fault with how the baker was treated, you are essentially saying that African American bakers should be forced to bake cakes for KKK induction ceremonies.



Okay back up a second, is Atheism a religion or isn't it, cause I've heard people try to have it both ways.



Then I guess African American bakers need to start baking cakes for KKK induction ceremonies. You can't have it both ways, Vylo.

The intolerance demonstrated by some of those in the homosexual community is astounding. They successfully established anti-bullying campaigns in the public schools yet use the government to bully those who don't support their lifestyles and choices. Absolutely astounding

 

[Armoured]

*eyeroll*

 

[MachZer0]

What religion, or lack thereof, are people being forced to convert to or from to keep their businesses?

You could bake a cake and stick it in a display and someone could buy it and use it in some child molesting criminal orgy and you would never know. But to celebrate a marriage between two adults...horrors.

But would you force someone to specifically bake a cake meant to celebrate a child molesting orgy?

Disclaimer: The argument is not being made that homosexuality is comparable to child molestation

 

[MikeCarra]

When people are being told to either: "Give up their religious beliefs, or give up their business." Then that is persecuting someone based on their religious beliefs.

This is actually a very good question. And quite troubling in a modern nation that values personal freedom.

Personally I think the gay couple should have simply gotten the word out that this baker is a bigot and therefor don't support them. But to use the courts to force the baker to act against their own bigoted religious beliefs is actually NOT an American value.

The Free Market is, in this case, a very strong tool.

When I think of how many companies actually use religion to mask evil fiscal policy (like HObby Lobby's fake religious conviction...they won't allow birth control in their coverage for employees but they are heavily invested in companies that make birth control, they also lie to customers --recent AG decision in NY state-- and they support repressive atheist regimes like Communist China) I think that these companies have given honestly held, albeit vile, religious beliefs a bad name.

The key being "honestly held".

If the baker honestly believes that God thinks gays are an abomination then it would be wrong to force that baker to serve them.

The true test of "faith" will come if the baker loses sufficient business.

When you tell someone that they have to do something that violates their core religious beliefs, or they have to give up their business, then that persecution.

Agreed. The Free Market can do this much more efficiently.

 

[Armoured]

But would you force someone to specifically bake a cake meant to celebrate a child molesting orgy?

Always nice to see the classics get a go. When in doubt, liken homosexuality to paedophilia.

 

[MachZer0]

Always nice to see the classics get a go. When in doubt, liken homosexuality to paedophilia.

Just for the record, someone else introduced child molestation into the discussion

 

[Joykins]

I wouldn't force anyone to do anything

 

[MachZer0]

I wouldn't force anyone to do anything

Yet that is exactly what the homosexual bullies do

 

[Armoured]

Diddums.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

The intolerance demonstrated by some of those in the homosexual community is astounding. They successfully established anti-bullying campaigns in the public schools yet use the government to bully those who don't support their lifestyles and choices. Absolutely astounding

You feel that having to abide by the law means you are "bullied"?

 

[MachZer0]

You feel that having to abide by the law means you are "bullied"?

Do you mean abiding by the laws than ban same sex marriage?

 

[AirPo]

Do you mean abiding by the laws than ban same sex marriage?

That's not the law anymore.

 

[OlduvaiGeorge]

You feel that having to abide by the law means you are "bullied"?

What about all those Homosexual wedding planners, cake designers and florists? When was the last time one of them sued so they wouldn't have to serve a heterosexual wedding because of their religious beliefs? Should they be "forced" to do their job open to the public rather than discriminate?

 

[OlduvaiGeorge]

The intolerance demonstrated by some of those in the homosexual community is astounding. They successfully established anti-bullying campaigns in the public schools yet use the government to bully those who don't support their lifestyles and choices. Absolutely astounding

Question: do you support their "lifestyles and choices"?

 

[MachZer0]

That's not the law anymore.

It is in some states. In most others, it is no longer the law due to bullying

 

[Armoured]

You feel that having to abide by the law means you are "bullied"?

I'm sure that for most of his life, his general attitude to the bullying of homosexuals by, well, everyone, pretty much was "meh, they deserve it". But one baker is legally compelled to do something he publicly advertises as his business? "Oh Noes! The homosexual bullies are coming!"

 

[Archaeopteryx]

It is in some states. In most others, it is no longer the law due to bullying

Bullying? I'd say it's representative of progress.

 

[MachZer0]

Bullying? I'd say it's representative of progress.

"progress" by bullying.