If you Love Me - KEEP My Commandments

[BobRyan]

______________________________________________________________________

Now, back to the Law of the New Covenant:

Galatians 5:14
For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” nkjv
​

Why does Scripture state that all the law is fulfilled when you "love your neighbor as yourself" (Lev 19:18 JUST as had been the case back before the cross in Matt 22:34-40?

It is because the last 6 commandments are kept by keeping that one Lev 19:18 law.

Is it not true that it is God who must be foremost in every person's life and esteemed above every person or thing? It is true that God must be foremost, but Scripture shows us that unless a person loves his neighbor as himself, he cannot possibly love God above himself.

1 John 20
If someone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen, how can he love God whom he has not seen? 21 And this commandment we have from Him: that he who loves God must love his brother also. nkjv​

And at the same time - cannot love God unless we KEEP God's Commandments. Not just the last 6.


1 John 5:1-4 (NKJV)
Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves Him who begot also loves him who is begotten of Him. 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

Luke 14:26
“If anyone comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and his own life also, he cannot be My disciple. nkjv

Romans 13:9-10
For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not bear false witness,” “You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law. nkjv

​

 

[Jan001]

Not according to the Bible.

Is 66 speaks of the New Earth - long AFTER the cross and says "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to worship" -- instead of 'forever ended' - it is to be "forever continued" and instead of 'Just jews' it is "all mankind".

​

New Covenant requirements: "This is the New Covenant I will make... I will write My LAWs on their mind and on their heart" Jer 31:31-33 - Heb 8:6-10.

Romans 2:27
And will not the physically uncircumcised, if he fulfills the law, judge you who, even with your written code and circumcision, are a transgressor of the law? nkjv
​

The Law is to be fulfilled not trashed - by the saints.

"Do we then make VOID the Law of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we ESTABLISH the Law of God" Rom 3:31

The Law toward our neighbor which every Christian must fulfill in order to inherit eternal life:

Galatians 5:14
For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” nkjv

That means all of the TEN Commandments dealing with man's relationship to man "Honor your Parents, do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not lie, do not covet" - all that deal with loving your neighbor - must be kept.

"Love your neighbor as yourself" Lev 19:18

What that does NOT mean is that we may ignore those commandments dealing with Love for God.


1John 20
If someone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen, how can he love God whom he has not seen? 21 And this commandment we have from Him: that he who loves God must love his brother also. nkjv

And of course Love To God can only be expressed by keeping God's Commandments according to 1 John 5
(As we saw on page 1 of this thread)

1 John 5:1-4 (NKJV)
Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves Him who begot also loves him who is begotten of Him. 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.​

_____________________________________________________________________

Sabbaths , Not taking God's name in vain and feasts are not listed among the requirements in some NT text.

Can we then "ignore" those commandments of God?

James 2 -- says NO! They cannot be ignored.

(as we saw on page one of this thread)


James 2
8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well;
9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by THE Law as transgressors.
10 For whoever shall keep the whole Law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of THE Law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty

"the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12

We will never agree on these things.

 

[BobRyan]

Possibly - but agreement is not necessary between us on all topics. I just enjoy the subjects as I am sure you do as well.

 

[Bob S]

______________________________________________________________________

Now, back to the Law of the New Covenant:

Galatians 5:14
For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” nkjv
​

Why does Scripture state that all the law is fulfilled when you "love your neighbor as yourself" (Lev 19:18 JUST as had been the case back before the cross in Matt 22:34-40?

It is because the last 6 commandments are kept by keeping that one Lev 19:18 law.

Is it not true that it is God who must be foremost in every person's life and esteemed above every person or thing? It is true that God must be foremost, but Scripture shows us that unless a person loves his neighbor as himself, he cannot possibly love God above himself.

1 John 20
If someone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen, how can he love God whom he has not seen? 21 And this commandment we have from Him: that he who loves God must love his brother also. nkjv​

And at the same time - cannot love God unless we KEEP God's Commandments. Not just the last 6.


1 John 5:1-4 (NKJV)
Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves Him who begot also loves him who is begotten of Him. 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

Luke 14:26
“If anyone comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and his own life also, he cannot be My disciple. nkjv

Romans 13:9-10
For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not bear false witness,” “You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law. nkjv

​

1 John 5:1-4 (NKJV)
Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves Him who begot also loves him who is begotten of Him. 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

John in 1Jn 3 answers what the commandments are that Christians are to live by. Notice here is no 10 in the equation.

19 This is how we know that we belong to the truth and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence: 20 If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything. 21 Dear friends, if our hearts do not condemn us, we have confidence before God 22 and receive from him anything we ask, because we keep his commands and do what pleases him. 23 And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us. 24 The one who keeps God’s commands lives in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us.

Believe and love, no wonder there are no New Testament requirements for observing the Israelite only Sabbath of the Old Covenant, we have no requirement. We live under an new and better covenant, praise the Lord.

 

[BobRyan]

And -- James 2. The Apostles did tell us that to "break one is to break them all" because the obligatory element is based on the "HE WHO SAID" aspect of the commandments James 2

AND that the 5th commandment is the FIRST commandment in the still valid UNIT OF TEN -- with a promise

AND "what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God" 1 Cor 7:19

AND that "the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12

AND that there REMAINS a SABBATH rest for the people of God - JUST as in David's time Heb 4[/QUOTE]

AND Rom 13
8 Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law. 9 For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,”
“You shall not murder,”
“You shall not steal,”
“You shall not bear false witness,”
“You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely,
“You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” Lev 19:18
10 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.

AND Eph 6:2 as we saw on page one of this thread.

AND of course Matt 22 - all the Law on the Prophets based on "Love God with all your heart" Deut 6:5 and "Love your neighbor as yourself" Lev 19:18

AND - "Sabbath was MADE for mankind" Mark 2:27
from "Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL mankind come before Me to worship" Is 66:23 (for all eternity in New Earth)
"there REMAINS therefore a SABBATH rest for the people of God" Heb 4
Rev 14:7 "Worship Him who made the heavens and the earth the seas and the springs of water"
- Sabbath after Sabbath - Gospel services - Acts 13
-Sabbath after Sabbath after Sabbath - Gospel services Acts 17:1-5
-Sabbath after Sabbath after Sabbath - Gospel services Acts 18:1-8

 

[BobRyan]

If you oppose the Commandments of God in NT times - then answer this question -

In Eph 6:2 - "honor your father and mother for this is the first commandment with a promise" -- what Law - what unit of Law is it to be found that 'honor your father and mother" is the FIRST commandment with a promise??

First commandment where??

 

[BobRyan]

1 John 5:1-4 (NKJV)
Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves Him who begot also loves him who is begotten of Him. 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

Jer 31:31-33 NEW Covenant "I will write My LAW on their mind and on their heart"

1 John 5 does not say 'by this we know that we love the children of God - when we Love God AND love God".

As I think we all know.

 

[bbbbbbb]

1 John 5:1-4 (NKJV)
Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves Him who begot also loves him who is begotten of Him. 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

Jer 31:31-33 NEW Covenant "I will write My LAW on their mind and on their heart"

1 John 5 does not say 'by this we know that we love the children of God - when we Love God AND love God".

As I think we all know.

So, can you tell me why it is that you folks have decided to keep only those commandments you want to while ignoring the rest?

 

[BobRyan]

"you folks"??

And by that do you mean --

The Baptist Confession of Faith, C.H. Spurgeon
the Westminster Confession of Faith ,
D.L. Moody,
R.C Sproul,
Matthew Henry,
Thomas Watson
Eastern Orthodox Catechism
The Catholic Catechism.

And of course 7th day groups

Seventh-day Baptists
Seventh-day Adventists
(and 100's of others)

 

[bbbbbbb]

"you folks"??

And by that do you mean --

The Baptist Confession of Faith, C.H. Spurgeon
the Westminster Confession of Faith ,
D.L. Moody,
R.C Sproul,
Matthew Henry,
Thomas Watson
Eastern Orthodox Catechism
The Catholic Catechism.

And of course 7th day groups

Seventh-day Baptists
Seventh-day Adventists
(and 100's of others)

Yep, and the SDA, as well. You legalists are all alike - picking and choosing which of God's commandments fit your agenda and how to spin the commandments without actually obeying God.

 

[BobRyan]

"you folks"??

And by that do you mean --

The Baptist Confession of Faith, C.H. Spurgeon
the Westminster Confession of Faith ,
D.L. Moody,
R.C Sproul,
Matthew Henry,
Thomas Watson
Eastern Orthodox Catechism
The Catholic Catechism.

And of course 7th day groups

Seventh-day Baptists
Seventh-day Adventists
(and 100's of others)

Yep, and the SDA, as well. You legalists are all alike - picking and choosing which of God's commandments fit your agenda and how to spin the commandments without actually obeying God.

The "all Christians are evil if they differ with me" is not a compelling solution.

Thread that BOTH the pro-sunday AND the pro-Bible-Sabbath group agree on the Bible Ten Commandments is because we do some of the basic Bible home work. For example - answer the simple question -

In Eph 6:2 - "honor your father and mother for this is the first commandment with a promise" -- what Law - what unit of Law is it to be found that 'honor your father and mother" is the FIRST commandment with a promise??

First commandment where??

 

[BobRyan]

1 John 5:1-4 (NKJV)
Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves Him who begot also loves him who is begotten of Him. 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

Jer 31:31-33 NEW Covenant "I will write My LAW on their mind and on their heart"

1 John 5 does not say 'by this we know that we love the children of God - when we Love God AND love God".

As I think we all know.

==============================

Another very simple question - what moral law of God would Jeremiah have known about - and so also his readers in Jer 31 - that 'Defines sin' as Paul said in Romans 7, and Romans 3, and as James points out in James 2??

Another very easy Bible detail that both those pro-Sunday and also the pro-Bible-Sabbath groups were willing to admit to.

 

[BobRyan]

As for the Ceremonial Law rich in animal sacrifices - both the "Baptist Confession of Faith" and also the "Westminster Confession of Faith" get the obvious Bible detail in Hebrews 10 that the entire system of animal sacrifices ended at the cross.

Claiming that Hebrews 10 is just another group of Christian-affirmed Bible details that one does not need to pay attention to - would not be a "Compelling solution" at that point.

Heb 10
4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sins.
5 Therefore, when He came into the world, He said:

“Sacrifice and offering You did not desire,
But a body You have prepared for Me.
6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin
You had no pleasure.
7 Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come—
In the volume of the book it is written of Me—
To do Your will, O God.’”

8 Previously saying, “Sacrifice and offering, burnt offerings, and offerings for sin You did not desire, nor had pleasure in them” (which are offered according to the law), 9 then He said, “Behold, I have come to do Your will, O God.” He takes away the first that He may establish the second. 10 By that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Thus the laws related to animal sacrifice ended:

How "obvious" is this point?

It is so obvious that both the "Baptist Confession of Faith" and also the "Westminster Confession of Faith" get the obvious Bible detail in Hebrews 10 which is that the sacrificial-system laws end at the cross, but not the moral law of God.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Bob, that was not the best dodge I have encountered from you, but I will give you credit for attempting it.

Back to my question. Is there a particular reason that the SDA, and yourself, have been deluded into thinking that they actually obey all of God's commands?

 

[Bob S]

You refuse to accept 1Jn3:19 This is how we know that we belong to the truth and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence: 20 If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything. 21 Dear friends, if our hearts do not condemn us, we have confidence before God 22 and receive from him anything we ask, because we keep his commands and do what pleases him. 23 And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us. 24 The one who keeps God’s commands lives in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us.

John is not telling us to observe days. We know we belong to the truth when we keep his commands and do what pleases him. 23 And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us. That is the formula for knowing we belong to the truth. Any church that teaches a different ''truth'' is a false church. Any church that teaches that we must do something, besides believing and loving one another, to be saved is a false church.

 

[Bob S]

You refuse to accept 2Cor3:
7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, 8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? 9 If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness! 10 For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory. 11 And if what was transitory came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!

The ministry that brings death, the 10 written on stone, transitory, the Holy Spirit the Glory that lasts. See it friend. See that we are no longer under the guidance of the 10 commandments. We are under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. Praise the Lord we have the best if only we receive it. Come out of her my friend, come out from the darkness of the old covenant into the Light of the new covenant. Christianity is not and never has been about a day. Christianity is about Jesus period.

 

[Bob S]

You refuse to believe Col 2: 16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.

The reality is Jesus. Jesus is our everything. We rest in Jesus. We accept the gift Jesus gave us, the Holy Spirit into our hearts to guide us into righteousness.

 

[Bob S]

You refuse to believe Gal 3

Galatians 3New International Version (NIV)
Faith or Works of the Law
3 You foolish Galatians!(Sabbath thumpers) Who has bewitched you? Before your very eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed as crucified. 2 I would like to learn just one thing from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by believing what you heard? 3 Are you so foolish? After beginning by means of the Spirit, are you now trying to finish by means of the flesh? 4 Have you experienced so much in vain—if it really was in vain? 5 So again I ask, does God give you his Spirit and work miracles among you by the works of the law, or by your believing what you heard? 6 So also Abraham “believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness.

10 For all who rely on the works of the law are under a curse, as it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.” 11 Clearly no one who relies on the law is justified before God, because “the righteous will live by faith.”

18 For if the inheritance depends on the law, then it no longer depends on the promise; but God in his grace gave it to Abraham through a promise.

23 Before the coming of this faith, we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.

That is the Bible my friend, below is the prophet's rendering of salvation. Choose you this day who you will serve.

ELLEN WHITE WAS CLEAR: SALVATION BY SABBATH OBSERVANCE


"It means eternal salvation to keep the Sabbath holy unto the Lord. God says: "Them that honor Me I will honor." (6T 356.4)


"But if we turn aside from the fourth commandment, so positively given by God, to adopt the inventions of Satan, voiced and acted by men under his control, we cannot be saved. We cannot with safety receive his traditions and subtleties as truth." (RH, July 6, 1897 par. 4)

 

[bbbbbbb]

Wow, Bob S. Thank you for the blast of the clear, cold light of scripture. I don't know how it could be made any clearer.

 

[Bob S]

Wow, Bob S. Thank you for the blast of the clear, cold light of scripture. I don't know how it could be made any clearer.

Your welcome my friend. Keep the faith.