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There is a theology that basically describes the Bible as evil - and that most of it must be deleted to make it "good".
happened in the dark ages too - they simply burned the Bible.
My church teaches that everyone should be vegetarians and that eating blood is bad.
Is this what you were asking?
Does this prove the OT has been deleted?
Eph 2 the dividing wall between the two groups - where one is called the circumcision and the other the uncircumcision - to stand for literal Jews vs literal physical gentiles - had to do with the ceremonies and rituals.
Notice how in Isaiah 66:23 it does not say "all mankind shall be circumcised" but rather "all mankind will come before Me to worship - from Sabbath to Sabbath".
Obviously that is false since both Jews AND Gentiles are required to not take God's name in vain.
Please be serious.
Sacrifices - ordinances - ceremonies that divide Jews vs gentiles.
As opposed to "all mankind will come before Me to worship - from Sabbath to Sabbath". and as we see in Acts 13, Acts 17:4 and even Acts 18:4 "every Sabbath" Jews and gentiles worship together in the synagogues.
Hello Bob.My church teaches that everyone should be vegetarians and that eating blood is bad.
Is this what you were asking?
Does this prove the OT has been deleted?
Not according to anything you have actually posted. In all your posts you show nothing but preference against certain parts of scripture. How is that then "my problem with Acts 15"??
You ignored almost every detail in the chapter that we discussed so far.
On the contrary - Romans 4 says that Abraham receives the promise while uncircumcised so that he can be the father of all believers that are uncircumcised.
Rom 4
9 Is this blessing then on the circumcised, or on the uncircumcised also? For we say, “Faith was credited to Abraham as righteousness.” 10 How then was it credited? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised; 11 and he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while uncircumcised, so that he might be the father of all who believe without being circumcised, that righteousness might be credited to them, 12 and the father of circumcision to those who not only are of the circumcision, but who also follow in the steps of the faith of our father Abraham which he had while uncircumcised.
Nothing in NT or OT demanding that all gentiles be circumcised or they can't be saved - can't go to heaven.
Your efforts so far - only show that you "made that up".
Which is why I ask - why do that? Why not stick with the Bible - instead?
Ok so that is clear - which means that Acts 15 is not deleting some OT imaginary text where circumcision was for all gentiles -- now supposedly change in the NT.
Which is why I requested that you not make that up when appealing to Acts 15.
Eph 2 the dividing wall between the two groups - where one is called the circumcision and the other the uncircumcision - to stand for literal Jews vs literal physical gentiles - had to do with the ceremonies and rituals.
Notice how in Isaiah 66:23 it does not say "all mankind shall be circumcised" but rather "all mankind will come before Me to worship - from Sabbath to Sabbath".
Obviously that is false since both Jews AND Gentiles are required to not take God's name in vain.
Please be serious.
Sacrifices - ordinances - ceremonies that divide Jews vs gentiles.
As opposed to "all mankind will come before Me to worship - from Sabbath to Sabbath". and as we see in Acts 13, Acts 17:4 and even Acts 18:4 "every Sabbath" Jews and gentiles worship together in the synagogues.
This reply of yours is exactly what I was asking for Bob.My church teaches that everyone should be vegetarians and that eating blood is bad.
Correct, there can be no doubt that the apostles in Jerusalem have enforced this rule on blood.
Does your church enforce the decree of the apostles or not, Bob?
Hello Bob.
We are making some progress now, thank you for your honesty.
This reply of yours is exactly what I was asking for Bob.
Though the decree of the SDA church is not what the scripture teaches us Bob.
Here is what the scripture teaches.
Genesis 9
3 Every moving thing that is alive shall be food for you; I give all to you, as I gave the green plant.
4 Only you shall not eat flesh with its life, that is, its blood.
Meat is on the menu (every moving thing), but you must drain the blood before eating it.
.
Non-Christian Jews would not touch Gentiles with even a ten-foot pole. The Gentiles were regarded as "unclean".
Hello Bob.
Thanks for the reply, a reply that I will have to unscramble.
I fully endorse this commandment, though I would exceed this commandment and suggest you love your parents.
You cannot claim to just honor your parents and love everyone else. Love your parents Bob.
Modern-day Jewish rules for the Sabbath:
"Following is a brief summary of some of the Shabbat laws you are most likely to encounter.
Let's start with some basic activities from which we refrain on Shabbat:
- writing, erasing, and tearing;
- business transactions;
- driving or riding in cars or other vehicles;
- shopping;
- using the telephone;
- turning on or off anything which uses electricity, including lights, radios, television, computer, air-conditioners and alarm clocks;
- cooking, baking or kindling a fire;
- gardening and grass-mowing;
- doing laundry;
Does all this mean that Shabbat is somewhat of a miserable affair, where we sit hungry in the dark? Not at all. It simply means that we have to prepare for Shabbat in advance, so that, on the contrary, we celebrate in luxury, without doing any of the actual work, on Shabbat.
For example: Lights which will be needed on Shabbat are turned on before Shabbat. Automatic timers may be used for lights and some appliances as long as they have been set before Shabbat. The refrigerator may be used, but again, we have to ensure that it's use does not engender any of the forbidden Shabbat activities. Thus, the fridge light should be disconnected before Shabbat by unscrewing the bulb slightly and a freezer whose fan is activated when the door is opened may not be used.
Another example: We may not cook or light a fire, so we cook before Shabbat and keep the food warm through special methods that do not violate any Shabbat prohibitions. See Food Preparation on Shabbat for the laws and methods involved.
In addition to those mentioned above, two other important categories which are not permitted are using or touching items that are considered muktzah and carrying outdoors.
Muktzah
Many objects have been designated by our sages as Muktzah--we are forbidden from moving them, in some cases, even for activities permitted on Shabbat. Muktzah may not be moved directly with one's hand or even indirectly with an object (such as sweeping it away with a broom). However, Muktzah may be moved in a very awkward, unusual manner, with other parts of the body, e.g.: with one's teeth or elbow, or by blowing on it.
Some of the categories of Muktzah are:
1. Objects which have no designated use, e.g.: Stones, plants, flowers in a vase, raw food (inedible in its present state, such as beans); an object that has broken and become no longer useful such as a broken bowl, a button that falls off;
Hello Bob.My church teaches that everyone should be vegetarians and that eating blood is bad.
Is this what you were asking?
Does this prove the OT has been deleted?
Here is an interesting way to avoid Eph 6:2 -- but never fear - I will repeat the Eph 6:2 question "again" until you feel comfortable answering the question. I am ok with waiting.
As for Genesis 1 not being in scripture.
Here is what Genesis 1 says -
Gen 1
27 God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28 God blessed them; and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth, and subdue it; and rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over every living thing that moves on the earth.” 29 Then God said, “Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed that is on the surface of all the earth, and every tree which has fruit yielding seed; it shall be food for you; 30 and to every beast of the earth and to every bird of the sky and to every thing that moves on the earth which has life, I have given every green plant for food”
We don't have the same "delete scripture" model that you seem to be using.
Notice that the Genesis 1 command - does not negate or delete Lev 16 - it fully conforms to it by not allowing any case for eating animal blood. Is this why you consider it against scripture?
1 Cor 3
16 Do you not know that you are a temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you? 17 If any man destroys the temple of God, God will destroy him, for the temple of God is holy, and that is what you are.
Eating meat today leads to increase risk for heart disease, obesity, cancer, diabetes.
"Eating meat kills more people than previously thought"
(NewsTarget) There is no more denying it. Meat contains highly toxic substances that are responsible for many deaths and diseases. Heavy meat consumption increases your risk of dying from all causes, including heart disease and cancer, according to a federal study conducted by the National Cancer Institute and featured in Archives of Internal Medicine on Monday.
http://www.naturalnews.com/025957_meat_eating_cancer.html
This is not considered the 11th commandment in the SDA church by any means - but we do not suggest turning a blind eye to the facts of nature or the responsibility you have not to drink or eat poison.
some plants are poison - we don't recommend those either.
Now back to Eph 6:2 - see next post.
Incorrect Bob, eating meat whether it be fish, or even chicken, does not increase any risk of cancer.Eating meat today leads to increase risk for heart disease, obesity, cancer, diabetes.
Hello Bob.My church teaches that everyone should be vegetarians and that eating blood is bad.
Is this what you were asking?
Does this prove the OT has been deleted?
Here is an interesting way to avoid Eph 6:2 -- but never fear - I will repeat the Eph 6:2 question "again" until you feel comfortable answering the question. I am ok with waiting.
As for Genesis 1 not being in scripture.
Here is what Genesis 1 says -
Gen 1
27 God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28 God blessed them; and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth, and subdue it; and rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over every living thing that moves on the earth.” 29 Then God said, “Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed that is on the surface of all the earth, and every tree which has fruit yielding seed; it shall be food for you; 30 and to every beast of the earth and to every bird of the sky and to every thing that moves on the earth which has life, I have given every green plant for food”
We don't have the same "delete scripture" model that you seem to be using.
Notice that the Genesis 1 command - does not negate or delete Lev 16 - it fully conforms to it by not allowing any case for eating animal blood. Is this why you consider it against scripture?
1 Cor 3
16 Do you not know that you are a temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you? 17 If any man destroys the temple of God, God will destroy him, for the temple of God is holy, and that is what you are.
Eating meat today leads to increase risk for heart disease, obesity, cancer, diabetes.
"Eating meat kills more people than previously thought"
(NewsTarget) There is no more denying it. Meat contains highly toxic substances that are responsible for many deaths and diseases. Heavy meat consumption increases your risk of dying from all causes, including heart disease and cancer, according to a federal study conducted by the National Cancer Institute and featured in Archives of Internal Medicine on Monday.
http://www.naturalnews.com/025957_meat_eating_cancer.html
This is not considered the 11th commandment in the SDA church by any means - but we do not suggest turning a blind eye to the facts of nature or the responsibility you have not to drink or eat poison.
some plants are poison - we don't recommend those either.
Now back to Eph 6:2 - see next post.
Hello Bob.
Your not being entirely truthful Bob.
Historically, we have learned that everything is toxic;
it is only the dose that separates the toxic
from the non-toxic. Even water is toxic if a large amount (4–5 liters) is consumed.
meat is only harmful if eaten in 'heavy'
quantities.
You will definitely be throwing up.Hi David - I have to admit I do prefer to think of myself as being entirely truthful.
David -- really. Misdirection again?
What we do know is some plants are edible and others are poison. I think we can take that to the bank - and most school children would agree with us on that point.
If you want to argue that all plants kill and all foods are poison, all are toxic... I will let you start a thread on that topic and wage that lonely war as you wish.
Next you will be telling us that if you drink 20 gallons of fresh water in 5 minutes you will die - so water is also toxic and nothing should be considered off limits since we all drink water.
And yet I eat lunch with a 100 year old man who eats pork right along with me. He claims he was hardly ever sick in his whole life.Hi David - I have to admit I do prefer to think of myself as being entirely truthful.
David -- really. Misdirection again?
What we do know is some plants are edible and others are poison. I think we can take that to the bank - and most school children would agree with us on that point.
If you want to argue that all plants kill and all foods are poison, all are toxic... I will let you start a thread on that topic and wage that lonely war as you wish.
Next you will be telling us that if you drink 20 gallons of fresh water in 5 minutes you will die - so water is also toxic and nothing should be considered off limits since we all drink water.
For now - I am just going to stick with the obvious common sense statements as I have given them.
oh no wait! you just did do that!! hahaha - that is pretty funny!
thanks.
By contrast we have --
http://www.pcrm.org/health/cancer-resources/diet-cancer/facts/meat-consumption-and-cancer-risk
Meat Consumption and Cancer Risk
The World Health Organization has determined that dietary factors account for at least 30 percent of all cancers in Western countries and up to 20 percent in developing countries. When cancer researchers started to search for links between diet and cancer, one of the most noticeable findings was that people who avoided meat were much less likely to develop the disease. Large studies in England and Germany showed that vegetarians were about 40 percent less likely to develop cancer compared to meat eaters.1-3 In the United States, researchers studied Seventh-day Adventists, a religious group that is remarkable because, although nearly all members avoid tobacco and alcohol and follow generally healthful lifestyles, about half of the Adventist population is vegetarian, while the other half consumes modest amounts of meat.
This fact allowed scientists to separate the effects of eating meat from other factors. Overall, these studies showed significant reductions in cancer risk among those who avoided meat.4 In contrast, Harvard studies showed that daily meat eaters have approximately three times the colon cancer risk, compared to those who rarely eat meat.
A number of hypotheses have been advanced to explain the connection between meat consumption and cancer risk. First, meat is devoid of fiber and other nutrients that have a protective effect. Meat also contains animal protein, saturated fat, and, in some cases, carcinogenic compounds such as heterocyclic amines (HCA) and polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PAH) formed during the processing or cooking of meat. HCAs, formed as meat is cooked at high temperatures, and PAHs, formed during the burning of organic substances, are believed to increase cancer risk. In addition, the high fat content of meat and other animal products increases hormone production, thus increasing the risk of hormone-related cancers such as breast and prostate cancer.
In 2007, the American Institute for Cancer Research (AICR) published their second review of the major studies on food, nutrition, and cancer prevention. For cancers of the oesophagus, lung, pancreas, stomach, collorectum, endometrium, and prostate, it was determined that red meat (beef, pork, or lamb) and processed meat consumption possibly increased cancer risk. For colorectal cancer, a review of the literature determined that there is convincing scientific evidence that red meat increased cancer risk and that processed meat, saturated/animal fat, and heavily cooked meat were also convincing of increased risk.5
==============================================
Since you are determined to have a "diet and foods" discussion instead of talking about the Ten Commandments and how Ephesians 6:2 is impossible for you to avoid -- I have started a "Diet and foods" thread for you. We need not derail this thread.
Here is your "food" thread -- 5 minutes ago #1
Enjoy!
Again and again, God only imposed those laws om Israel. Pigs have been eaten by all other nations on Earth since recorded history at least. All of the people ever born are God's children. If he didn't want them to eat pigs I am sure He would ahve communicated that to them. Please explan why everyone else could eat what they wanted and only Israel could not.God did not declare all foods clean, you can find which food are clean in Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14. If anyone come along and declares otherwise they are a false prophet (Deuteronomy 4:2, Deuteronomy 12:32, Deuteronomy 13:1-5). God considers eating the unclean foods an abomination (Isaiah 65:4) and in the future will destroy all who eat unclean meat such as pig and mice (Isaiah 66:15-17)
Until you read the actual Bible in places like Acts 13, Acts 17:4 and Acts 18:4.
The point remains.
Now we return to the actual subject of this thread --- and Ephesians 6:2
=======================================================
Your argument that someone in the Bible would take Lev 19:18 "Love your neighbor as yourself" and Deut 6:5 "Love God with all your heart" as Laws to be used to delete God's spoken Word in Ex 20 where it then says in Deut 5 "And He added no more" -- is pure fiction. So you merely 'quote you'.
And we both know it.
Most impressively - so also do your own pro-sunday scholars know it. They know that the Ten Commandments were not deleted by Lev 19:18 or Deut 6:5 in either the OT or the NT.
Nor is there a NT text saying 'these two laws delete the OT, delete scripture, delete the commandments of God.."
Eph 6:2 the text you keep religiously avoiding "Honor your father and Mother - which is the FIRST commandment with a promise" -- FIRST commandment WHERE??/
in Lev 19:18???? is that where the 5th commandment is the "First commandment with a promise"?? No!!
how about in Deut 6:5?? is that where the 5th commandment is the "First commandment with a promise"?? No!!
How about John 13?? is that where the 5th commandment is the "First commandment with a promise"?? No!!
We can all see this. You and I both know this is true.
1 Cor 7:19 "what matters is keeping God's Commandments" --
God's commandments where the 5th Commandment is the "FIRST commandment with a promise".
"The saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12
God did not declare all foods clean, you can find which food are clean in Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14. If anyone come along and declares otherwise they are a false prophet (Deuteronomy 4:2, Deuteronomy 12:32, Deuteronomy 13:1-5). God considers eating the unclean foods an abomination (Isaiah 65:4) and in the future will destroy all who eat unclean meat such as pig and mice (Isaiah 66:15-17)
God did not declare all foods clean, you can find which food are clean in Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14. If anyone come along and declares otherwise they are a false prophet (Deuteronomy 4:2, Deuteronomy 12:32, Deuteronomy 13:1-5). God considers eating the unclean foods an abomination (Isaiah 65:4) and in the future will destroy all who eat unclean meat such as pig and mice (Isaiah 66:15-17)
Read the context, he's talking about eating with unwashed hands, which is a man made law not found in the Bible:Mark 7:14-20
And he called the people to him again, and said to them, “Hear me, all of you, and understand: 15 there is nothing outside a man which by going into him can defile him; but the things which come out of a man are what defile him.” 17 And when he had entered the house, and left the people, his disciples asked him about the parable. 18 And he said to them, “Then are you also without understanding? Do you not see that whatever goes into a man from outside cannot defile him, 19 since it enters, not his heart but his stomach, and so passes on?” (Thus he declared all foods clean.) 20 And he said, “What comes out of a man is what defiles a man. rsv
A few days ago you declared the Apostle Paul a false prophet and now you have declared Peter a false prophet.
You do realize that Paul was being a good Torah observant Jew when he was persecuting the early Church and while he held the coats of those who stoned Stephen.
Was Stephen also a false prophet who deserved to be stoned?
Does your Bible contain a New Testament or are you a Jew here posing as a Christian?
.
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