If truth is absoluute then why are therre so many different religions?

[cloudyday2]

Not to mince words but it sounds more that you are an "agnostic" ["I don't think it's beyond the realm of possibility "x" exists"], than an atheist. (Or am I taking your words out of context) It sounds as though you are saying God MAY exist but you don't know for sure. There is a world of difference between the two terms. To my understanding, atheism says definitively there is no God [which, in my opinion, takes much more faith than the person who says they believe in God], and agnosticism says I can't know for sure if God exists.

Probably @jacknife will explain his own views, but here are some things I've learned about the "atheist vs. agnostic" question.
What theists call "atheist" many atheists would call a "gnostic atheist". In addition, some definitions of "agnostic/gnostic" make it a separate dimension from "atheist/theist". So you can have an "agnostic theist", "gnostic theist", "agnostic atheist", and "gnostic atheist". Then there is "apatheist", "ignostic", ... Then you can complicate it further by adding weak and strong. So you might have a "strong agnostic weak theist". LOL

 

[willubraptured2]

Probably @jacknife will explain his own views, but here are some things I've learned about the "atheist vs. agnostic" question.
What theists call "atheist" many atheists would call a "gnostic atheist". In addition, some definitions of "agnostic/gnostic" make it a separate dimension from "atheist/theist". So you can have an "agnostic theist", "gnostic theist", "agnostic atheist", and "gnostic atheist". Then there is "apatheist", "ignostic", ... Then you can complicate it further by adding weak and strong. So you might have a "strong agnostic weak theist". LOL

Thanks for the primer. Sounds kind of like why there are of many different denominations in Christianity. Everybody has there favorite axe to grind.

 

[willubraptured2]

But, I don't seek to convert anybody. We don't seek converts. I'm happy if your faith works for you and makes you a better person.

I am curious about something. If Judaism is the true religion, why would Jews want to keep it to themselves and not share it with non-Jews. I realize you can't speak globally but you did state "WE don't seek converts", so the question is fair game. I'm not trying to be argumentative, just trying to understand your perspective.

 

[Job8]

Good post. My perplexion isn't about God's and/or Satan's impact, influence or affect on mankind but rather how mankind (individual people) could accept something that is either full of holes (lies, deceit, etc- as you said/implied), that has no evidence that explains, in detail, its full history and beliefs or that fails to fulfill its prophetic claims.
As Charleston Heston said in the movie Soylent Green, "It's People!" (hahaha)

Rocmonkey,

Here are some of the reasons why people prefer lies over the truth:

1. Religious beliefs worldwide are not based on rationality but on tradition. Most people do not challenge their traditions, and most religions maintain their idolatry. Many love their "religions" more than they love truth and the offer of eternal life.

2. The Bible tells us that all of humanity is born spiritually blind. It is the Gospel of Jesus Christ coupled with the convicting and convincing power of the Holy Spirit that causes the lost to think about their eternal destinies. And some will not even give the Gospel serious consideration.

3. People generally do not turn to Christ on the basis of rationality per se. You could show a Jew how multiple prophecies were fulfilled in Jesus of Nazareth but that person would still refuse to believe. You could show an atheist how Bible truth is confirmed through archaeology, but that would not be sufficient. As Christ said, some Jews would not believe even though one rose from the dead (and that is so true today).

4. Many love their sins and pleasures more than God and His offer of eternal life. Therefore when it comes to the crunch, they walk away from Christ, just like the Rich Young Ruler.

5. Many are afraid of the consequences of abandoning their false religions (including false Christianity) since they may become the subject of ridicule, scorn, hatred, or even death.

 

[LoAmmi]

I am curious about something. If Judaism is the true religion, why would Jews want to keep it to themselves and not share it with non-Jews. I realize you can't speak globally but you did state "WE don't seek converts", so the question is fair game. I'm not trying to be argumentative, just trying to understand your perspective.

Because one doesn't have to be a Jew to be right with the divine. In fact, it is more difficult for us.

 

[willubraptured2]

Because one doesn't have to be a Jew to be right with the divine. In fact, it is more difficult for us.

ok, thanks.

 

[LoAmmi]

ok, thanks.

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/The_Seven_Noahide_Laws.html

A little more info on it.

 

[Job8]

I am curious about something. If Judaism is the true religion, why would Jews want to keep it to themselves and not share it with non-Jews. I realize you can't speak globally but you did state "WE don't seek converts", so the question is fair game. I'm not trying to be argumentative, just trying to understand your perspective.

If you know anything about the history of the Jews, it was never their intent to share the Gospel with others. They maintained the mistaken notion that the true God belonged to them exclusively. Jonah had to be supernaturally convinced to go and preach repentance to Nineveh, and when Nineveh was saved, Jonah was annoyed. The apostle Peter also had to be supernaturally convinced that God was offering salvation to the Gentiles. He would never have gone to the household of Cornelius otherwise.

Coming back to "Judaism". That is really the religion of the Jews after they rejected their Messiah, since there is no Temple and no Levitical priesthood since 70 AD. So it is merely an empty shell without Christ. It is one of the saddest spectacles of history that the nation which had every spiritual privilege rejected their own Savior (who is also the Savior of the world). Even those Gentile magi (wise men) recognized and worshipped the One who was born King of the Jews, and brought Him costly presents after travelling over a great distance, while evil Herod tried to destroy Him!

 

[LoAmmi]

Actually, we were a faith that shared our message. That is where the G_d seekers came from. Gentiles who didn't convert because of what it involved but would go to the synagogues to learn.

Later there was this group that got powerful and decided it would beat us down until we were afraid to share anymore and we stopped hoping to be left alone. You might know who this group was.

 

[smaneck]

I agree with a lot of what you're saying, for sure. But truth is one of those things where it simply can't change. Our view of it (we can learn the truth or refuse to accept it) or knowledge about it can change (and has- a round earth, for example) but I have a hard time believing that truth itself can change. It doesn't sound possible to me. If it was true (really true, not a theory or assumption) then why would it change later on?

Have you ever studied quantum physics?

 

[Aryeh Jay]

If you know anything about the history of the Jews, it was never their intent to share the Gospel with others. They maintained the mistaken notion that the true God belonged to them exclusively. Jonah had to be supernaturally convinced to go and preach repentance to Nineveh, and when Nineveh was saved, Jonah was annoyed. The apostle Peter also had to be supernaturally convinced that God was offering salvation to the Gentiles. He would never have gone to the household of Cornelius otherwise.

Coming back to "Judaism". That is really the religion of the Jews after they rejected their Messiah, since there is no Temple and no Levitical priesthood since 70 AD. So it is merely an empty shell without Christ. It is one of the saddest spectacles of history that the nation which had every spiritual privilege rejected their own Savior (who is also the Savior of the world). Even those Gentile magi (wise men) recognized and worshipped the One who was born King of the Jews, and brought Him costly presents after travelling over a great distance, while evil Herod tried to destroy Him!

 

[smaneck]

If you know anything about the history of the Jews, it was never their intent to share the Gospel with others.

T

Uh, Judaism doesn't have a Gospel.

they maintained the mistaken notion that the true God belonged to them exclusively.

Not exactly. They maintain the Torah belongs to them and to all who choose to abide by it, but they don't deny that God may speak to other peoples via means other than the Torah.

Jonah had to be supernaturally convinced to go and preach repentance to Nineveh, and when Nineveh was saved, Jonah was annoyed. The apostle Peter also had to be supernaturally convinced that God was offering salvation to the Gentiles. He would never have gone to the household of Cornelius otherwise.

Salvation was never a Jewish preoccupation in the first place and nearly all of the early Gentile converts to Christianity had been 'God fearers" or Noahides with ties to the synagogues.

 

[Rocmonkey]

Have you considered that many people want to be spoon fed what they come to believe rather than doing their own homework (which takes some effort) to determine if what they are being told is true. Consequently, In my own limited experience of witnessing to people, I find that some people have no idea why they have the opinions and views they hold, other than someone told them the belief is correct.

Indeed. I, too, have come across numerous people in different religions who profess to believe but don't really know why or what. Some of them are not even familiar with the things their religion taught in times past or they try to make excuses for the teachings or they deny and even reject the things their own church (god?) commanded. It happens more than most think. I've seen Baptists (my faith) deny the Bible in order to live a certain lifestyle choice.

 

[Rocmonkey]

As far as I know, there is no credible evidence that God exists. .

Actually, there is quite a bit of evidence that God exists. What I have found is that when a non-believer, in my case they are usually evolutionist or atheist, ask for proof that God exists what they really want is for me to produce God. While I can't produce God, He is not a puppet to my desires or whims, I can prove that He exists. One clear, undeniable and irrefutable proof that God exists is the fact of Israel's existence today. It was stated many times throughout the Old Testament that God would first scatter the Jews all over the world and second that He would bring them back to the very spot He gave them as their homeland, the Land of Promise, again. No one can deny Israel was scattered for nearly 2,000 years. And, likewise, no one can deny they are back in their homeland as a sovereign nation again.

 

[gord44]

One clear, undeniable and irrefutable proof that God exists is the fact of Israel's existence today. It was stated many times throughout the Old Testament that God would first scatter the Jews all over the world and second that He would bring them back to the very spot He gave them as their homeland, the Land of Promise, again. No one can deny Israel was scattered for nearly 2,000 years. And, likewise, no one can deny they are back in their homeland as a sovereign nation again.

I don't think that's blowing anyone's skirt up as definitive proof that the God of the Bible exists.

 

[Rocmonkey]

Question One: What's with the page-long signature?

I'm pretty sure the reason I do not believe in the Christian God is that I do not have compelling evidence he exists. But rather than have the same argument for the hundredth time on this site where Christians just throw the book at me anyways, I think I'm going to call it quits here.

Carry on.

I'm sorry that some throw the book at you. Aside from the Bible being quoted at you have you seriously studied the Judeo-Christian belief system- both history and prophecies? There are more proofs of its validity than I can quote. Take the existence of Israel as one. Alexander, the Great's actions in Tyre is another. If we were to spend enough quality time researching the various religions we would quickly find the right answer for our search for truth. One such example is an elephant is holding up the earth. Since we have been in space and orbited the earth we can say with great certainty that that belief system has some serious flaws. This is the same for many that I have found in my search for truth.

 

[Rocmonkey]

I don't think that's blowing anyone's skirt up as definitive proof that the God of the Bible exists.

Sure it does. It is so clear and obvious that no one even debates it. But that fact alone tells us the Bible is absolutely true. And, if that prophecy came true then there must be many others- some that have been fulfilled and some that are yet to be. A quick look will tell us which are which. God rarely (but sometimes) tells us 'when' a prophecy will be fulfilled, He tells us 'that' it will be.
Also, the Bible tells us that if even one prophecy fails then the source is not from God. This includes the Bible's prophecies. Show us another prophecy from somewhere else that is as clear and undeniable as that one is from the Bible. It is easy to discount or discredit the Bible when we see the prophecy fulfilled bcuz we can say, 'Well, England and the U.S. made Israel a nation again'. Ah, but who said it would happen? Discounting God's hand is not as easy since it was stated a few thousand years before Israel actually became a nation again. The Bible also says that Israel will never be removed from its/their homeland again. We have 300 plus Million who hate and surround Israel and 7 million Israelis. Who is winning? Ever wonder why that is? One would think, naturally, the almost 40 to 1 would... should...win. But one would be mistaken. Why? God's protection.

I wonder what people said about Israel's chances of becoming a nation again before 1948.

 

[jacknife]

Not to mince words but it sounds more that you are an "agnostic" ["I don't think it's beyond the realm of possibility "x" exists"], than an atheist. (Or am I taking your words out of context) It sounds as though you are saying God MAY exist but you don't know for sure. There is a world of difference between the two terms. To my understanding, atheism says definitively there is no God [which, in my opinion, takes much more faith than the person who says they believe in God], and agnosticism says I can't know for sure if God exists.

Cloud is correct I am what you would call an agnostic atheist I lack belief in any deity is my position however I also can't disprove that deity's exist is a statement of my knowledge. I think you will find most atheist on this site are agnostic atheists.

 

[willubraptured2]

I don't think that's blowing anyone's skirt up as definitive proof that the God of the Bible exists.

No other historical people have continued to exist, despite continued persecution and dispersal thru out the world, along with all of their traditions and customs, just as God said they would. The odds of that happening are astronomical. Where are the Hitites, Jebusites, and other peoples that lived along side of the Jews? None of them exist. Where are the Babylonians. The Jews are a true miracle of God in that they survived and returned to repopulate Israel, just a God said they would do in the Bible (fulfilled prophecy). Would you agree that the survival of the Jews, despite all the pogroms, persecutions, executions (under Hitler, the Romans etc.), is pretty unusual relative to any other group of society that you may name?

 

[Rocmonkey]

The possibility that there is NO God and that everything developed by chance is far more amazing and inspiring than the religious stories IMO.

Maybe it is more interesting but it is also wrong in that there is not a single shred of proof that evolution occurred. In fact, scientists have changed their belief system (evolutionary thought) many times. And, many times scientists have agreed with what the Bible has always taught. For instance, the Bible teaches us that the world, earth, is circular or round. About 500 years ago everyone, including the scientists, said the earth was flat- they couldn't understand gravity. Today, everyone agrees with the Bible- that and we have gone into space so we have seen its circular shape. But that isn't the only agreement science has with what the Bible has 'always' taught. Never trust a man/men over the Bible.