If the beginnings of Genesis aren't literally true, then what way are they true?

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

If the beginnings of Genesis aren't literally true, then what way are they true?

God Bless!

On the contrary!!!

The first days of creation align stunningly with the Big Bang theory of creation, blending spirituality with science in the most poignant way possible.

I have exegeted this in my own studies. YOWM is the word for day in Hebrew and it means 'days' not 'day'. Most words in Hebrew with an M at the end denote plurality, as our S does in English. So creation day 1 can extend over a literal passage of time, and does. Hebrew thought and God's intent is not so much about proper quantification of time or space, but in qualifying that time and space into its proper essence. It is our modern science-mindedness (versus spiritual-mindedness) that makes us think this way by default, which is inaccurate if we want to think in the way of God.


As per evolution: God has made animals and people to evolve. That is a natural and beautiful ability.

But His final human creation is His last creation. And we are not evolved from anything, but are a unique being unto God and created in His perfect image.

 

[Chriliman]

So what part of his will is to keep killing us?

I can't speak for the dead, but I can speak for the living. You and I are still alive for a reason. If you're so against God, why hasn't he killed you yet? Maybe it's because He's a gracious God and his purpose for you is to come to him and experience his true love. Why does it all have to be about killing and death for you? Let the dead be dead and don't worry about why their dead, instead try embracing life. You are alive aren't you? Start asking why you're alive, you might start receiving answers if you're directing the question to God.

We who believe in science are trying to learn more truth.

That's good, just don't ignore sound reasons for beliefs.

You have to pick and choose, or you end up doing evil things or given permission to do them.

I'm sorry, but you have it backwards. It's because you're picking and choosing that you can't see the truth. The Bible never says to pick and choose from it, in order to find truth, yet this is exactly what you're doing.

And the bible says you should kill those against it. How many have you killed?

Nope, killing people against the Bible would be murder and it clearly says in Exodus "You shall not murder.". Have I shown any murderous tendencies while talking with you?

1 Chronicles 28:3
"But God said to me, p‘You may not build a house for my name, for you are a man of war and have shed blood."

Find a verse that clearly says we should kill those against the Bible...

The Quran does say to kill for disbelief.

Quran (2:191-193)
"And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief or unrest] is worse than killing..."

Just stating facts.

Belief as deep as yours, means I have to stop using the power of the brain I was given, nature or god. That denies him.

Well if you truly believe God gave you your brain, then He gave it to you in order for you to love him willingly, not by force.

You don't see that the bible is man made, I can prove over and over with the bible that it was made by men for their own power. It allows murder, slavery, beating wives, children, executions for minor crimes like thinking then saying. Not once but repeatedly, because it's about controlling people them without thinking.

Yes, the Bible was written by the hands of men, but authored by the Spirit of God.

 

[SkyWriting]

Meaning: our god/s created everything and this is how he did it.

Naturally the details may be obscured, but the multiple testimonials from scattered sources and across multiple isolated cultures and time support that it is true. Good summary!

 

[HitchSlap]

Naturally the details may be obscured, but the multiple testimonials from scattered sources and across multiple isolated cultures and time support that it is true. Good summary!

Well, the devil is in the details, as they say.

 

[joshua 1 9]

We aren't accountable now? We aren't held accountable by our friends, family, and community?

I remember a man that killed a policeman. They got him 50 years later. One thing about this life is delayed reward or punishment. Gratification or misery. They say we take our chances but there is no chance at all. Sooner or later people get what they deserve in life. Does not matter if there is a God or not. We all agree on the natural laws that we all have to abide by.

 

[joshua 1 9]

Free will, god given and god punishes us for using it.

Still He can cause all things to work out for the best. He can cause good to come out of whatever we encounter. Would you rather we did not have free will. Or do you think He allows more freedom then He should?

 

[joshua 1 9]

So creation day 1 can extend over a literal passage of time, and does.

Moses and David talks about a day is 1000 years

 

[joshua 1 9]

I asked if you follow the laws of the bible to the letter.

Yes we need to follow the law to the letter. An ounce of prevention requires a pound of cure.

 

[joshua 1 9]

We aren't accountable now? We aren't held accountable by our friends, family, and community?

Some people do not want any friends family or community.

 

[paulm50]

On the contrary!!!

The first days of creation align stunningly with the Big Bang theory of creation, blending spirituality with science in the most poignant way possible.

I have exegeted this in my own studies. YOWM is the word for day in Hebrew and it means 'days' not 'day'. Most words in Hebrew with an M at the end denote plurality, as our S does in English. So creation day 1 can extend over a literal passage of time, and does. Hebrew thought and God's intent is not so much about proper quantification of time or space, but in qualifying that time and space into its proper essence. It is our modern science-mindedness (versus spiritual-mindedness) that makes us think this way by default, which is inaccurate if we want to think in the way of God.


As per evolution: God has made animals and people to evolve. That is a natural and beautiful ability.

But His final human creation is His last creation. And we are not evolved from anything, but are a unique being unto God and created in His perfect image.

That's what I love about blindly religious people, they don't tell the truth.
1 In the beginning, when God created the universe,2 the earth was formless and desolate. The raging ocean that covered everything was engulfed in total darkness, and the Spirit of God was moving over the water. 3 Then God commanded, “Let there be light”—and light appeared. 4 God was pleased with what he saw. Then he separated the light from the darkness, 5 and he named the light “Day” and the darkness “Night.” Evening passed and morning came—that was the first day.

There was no water, it came later, the Earth had form and was covered in a bubbling mass something like lava, there had to be light, the sun was there, there is no separation between light and day. The Earth revolves, So it's light and dark. Depending on the spinning of the Earth.

Read on and see where the flaws are. Such as missing out the big bang, creating the Sun after the Earth, the Moon being part of the Earth, the days being billions of years, the missing millions of animals that came before Man, that Man evolved from Apes, Man starting out as farmers, saying their were tame and wild animals and giving Man control over the Earth.

Man isn't the last creation on Earth. Man now creates life, Man plays with evolution all the time and has done from before we learned to farm. Because it doesn't take creation to make the animals on the Earth, it requires evolution.

That's the biggest lie. We have no control over the Earth, it kills us at will. Either god made it to kill us, or Genesis is a fictional story.

As for his perfect image. What's perfect about Man?

 

[HitchSlap]

Moses and David talks about a day is 1000 years

This is hyperbole, and it was attributed to two people who never actually existed.

 

[ScottA]

This is an interesting view. How do you explain satan and evil? How do you explain these verses in Revelation?

Revelation 20:10
"And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever."

14 "And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death."

15 "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."

Based on your beliefs, will there be eternal torment, if so for who? If there is no real death because life as we know it is an illusion, then why does the Bible say there will be a second death?

Without going into the many details, the short answer, is Satan and evil were given a place. This, is that place.

Like the question of eternal torment, is this question: What describes the timelessness of God: I will be, or I am? The only problem with understanding either question and its correct answer...is time. But that is not a factor when it comes to God and His business.

 

[ScottA]

1 In the beginning, when God created the universe,2 the earth was formless and desolate. The raging ocean that covered everything was engulfed in total darkness, and the Spirit of God was moving over the water. 3 A) Then God commanded, “Let there be light”—and light appeared. 4 God was pleased with what he saw. Then he separated the light from the darkness, 5 and he named the light “Day” and the darkness “Night.” Evening passed and morning came—that was the first day.
There was no water at the beginning of the Earth's life. The Earth had a form, rather than being desolate it was a burning mass before it cooled down.

“Let the earth produce all kinds of plants, those that bear grain and those that bear fruit” Wrong

"So God made the two larger lights, the sun to rule over the day and the moon to rule over the night; he also made the stars." Wrong.

“Let the water be filled with many kinds of living beings, and let the air be filled with birds.” Wrong.

“Let the earth produce all kinds of animal life: domestic and wild, large and small”—and it was done." Wrong.

“And now we will make human beings; they will be like us and resemble us. They will have power over the fish, the birds, and all animals, domestic and wild, large and small.” Wrong.

“Have many children, so that your descendants will live all over the earth and bring it under their control. I am putting you in charge of the fish, the birds, and all the wild animals. 29 I have provided all kinds of grain and all kinds of fruit for you to eat; 30 but for all the wild animals and for all the birds I have provided grass and leafy plants for food”—and it was done." Very Wrong.

Google the evidence.

Dinosaur bones are everywhere, China is revealing a lot now. You can find them in a lump of coal.

You didn't answer my question.

Prove it.

You don't get to have a say in what is right and wrong. You weren't there.

As for dinosaurs, what's your point? They are biblical.

As for the example of this existence being comparable to cyberspace and a make believe virtual world, you have to get the proof directly from the Source (from outside this realm of existence). We who have already done so, can only share the information. I recommend getting it direct.

 

[ScottA]

We have no control over the Earth, it kills us at will. Either god made it to kill us, or Genesis is a fictional story.

That's awesome...you're getting closer! God DID create it to kill us...well, not us, but evil. And He gave us a way out.

And Genesis fictional? That's funny! How about...life as we know it being fictional? That is the truth...and God even said so...every word was given in "parable."

parable
[par-uh-buh l]

• Synonyms
• Examples
• Word Origin

noun
1.
a short allegorical story designed to illustrate or teach some truth,religious principle, or moral lesson.
2.
a statement or comment that conveys a meaning indirectly by the useof comparison, analogy, or the like.

 

[paulm50]

This is hyperbole, and it was attributed to two people who never actually existed.

Religion allowed them to be evil and claim it was gods work.

Without going into the many details, the short answer, is Satan and evil were given a place. This, is that place.

Like the question of eternal torment, is this question: What describes the timelessness of God: I will be, or I am? The only problem with understanding either question and its correct answer...is time. But that is not a factor when it comes to God and His business.

Satan is part of your gods plan. Seems a bit cruel. As for the time thing, Jesus got that 100% wrong. So not the son of god or his Dad wasn't telling him the truth.

You don't get to have a say in what is right and wrong. You weren't there.

As for dinosaurs, what's your point? They are biblical.

Neither was Man there, so they get less of a say because we now have science that tells us the truth. Point to where the bible mentions them and how they died out. The biggest mass extinction on Earth, wasn't a flood, it was an Asteroid hitting the Earth and totally changing the direction of life on Earth.

As for the example of this existence being comparable to cyberspace and a make believe virtual world, you have to get the proof directly from the Source (from outside this realm of existence). We who have already done so, can only share the information. I recommend getting it direct.

No you haven't because you got it wrong. I recommend you get it from the immense library of facts, not a page of words.

That's awesome...you're getting closer! God DID create it to kill us...well, not us, but evil. And He gave us a way out.

no he didn't bad things happen to anyone. As for the promise of Heaven, prove it. With facts not words in a book.

And Genesis fictional? That's funny! How about...life as we know it being fictional? That is the truth...and God even said so...every word was given in "parable."

Then prove it's right, use scientific evidence from various sources to prove your bible is right.

parable

1. a short allegorical story designed to illustrate or teach some truth,religious principle, or moral lesson.

It's not facts, truth, evidence. And most certainly not historical. Your god said so.

Your problem like any other fundamental religious person is you're taught not to question the word of Men who rule over you, if they claim to be speaking for your god. That's the purpose of the bible and it's only been the last 200 years that we have started to free ourselves from these chains. You prefer to be bound by them.

If everyone was like you, we would revert to a time when Churches were regarded in such reverence, they didn't pay taxes, men can claim to have as many wives as they choose, can kill others, can enslave others, can make their wives and children possessions, can send people on suicide missions and get people to pay the church money. I say revert back with a touch of sarcasm. Because it happens still.

Even church leaders can tell you who to vote for. Supporting a President who was a fool, took you to unnecessary wars to line the pockets of his friends, and told you to vote for the white one, because a black one was not right. Yes it happened. The bible belt hates the idea of a black man in the White House, especially after they lost the right to have slaves. A god given right.

 

[paulm50]

You don't get to have a say in what is right and wrong. You weren't there.

A strange statement, seeing as the people who wrote the bible weren't there either. In the life of Man the bible writers were in the last 3500, of a time that stretches back 500,000 years. So not even in 1% of the time.

How do we know this? We can see the proof.

And in all those layers, all around the world, you and I can see for ourselves Genesis is a fictional story. You and I can see how life evolved on Planet Earth. Evidence we can find, touch, own and learn from. Something the bible and priests always want to deny.

And to claim because the bible contains the word serpents, that explains dinosaurs is frankly absurd. As absurd as some say they were put there to confuse us, there is no confusion. So OP if you want to know the truth about Genesis, don's read a Bronze Age book. Google the nearest place you can visit to see the different strata in sedimentary rocks. You may even find fossils for you to own.

And please do watch the TV program "Your Inner Fish". It will scare the Fundamentalists, because it's true to what we have learned so far. Like how embryo prove how we go back to reptiles. And even fish. The bible doesn't have an answer for the truth.

 

[Chriliman]

Without going into the many details, the short answer, is Satan and evil were given a place. This, is that place.

Like the question of eternal torment, is this question: What describes the timelessness of God: I will be, or I am? The only problem with understanding either question and its correct answer...is time. But that is not a factor when it comes to God and His business.

Right, God is timeless, which is why He and only He can say I am. We can never say I am. We will not be gods in the new Jerusalem, we will be like God and be able to see Him for what He truly is.

1 John 2:28-3:2
"And now, dear children, continue in him, so that when he appears we may be confident and unashamed before him at his coming. If you know that he is righteous, you know that everyone who does what is right has been born of him. How great is the love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are…. Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when he appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is."

So God is timeless and able to create us to be in time on earth. Now when God destroys the old and creates the new, we will become immortal, but not as God is immortal, but only "like" his immortality. Essentially our new "time" will be infinite time or eternity, but only eternal in the sense that God created us and allows us to experience eternity. So in short, I believe it's incorrect to say that "time" is an illusion, because God created time to be both time as we know it and infinite time, which is eternity and we can't be God, so we must experience eternity, whereas God does not experience eternity because He is timeless, effectively God is 0 time as well as eternity, infinite. I know you know this, but I'm concerned with your belief that time is an illusion.

Ephesians 1:8-10
"With all wisdom and understanding, he made known to us the mystery of his will according to his good pleasure, which he purposed in Christ, to be put into effect when the times reach their fulfillment—to bring unity to all things in heaven and on earth under Christ."

You even say death and pain are all an illusion. Doesn't this negate what Jesus had to endure to save us from eternal death and pain?

I would really question what Einstein discovered as the greatest spiritual discovery of our time. Weren't his finding based on a deep study of physical light and how it relates to time and space? That's great, but our beliefs should not be based on what man has discovered in this universe, but rather based on what the Bible says and what the Spirit is teaching us through the word of God.

2 Corinthians 11:14
"And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light."

Can this also mean Satan can deceive even using physical light in our universe? He is the god of this world so I wouldn't put it past him. Just some food for thought

 

[ScottA]

Religion allowed them to be evil and claim it was gods work.

Satan is part of your gods plan. Seems a bit cruel. As for the time thing, Jesus got that 100% wrong. So not the son of god or his Dad wasn't telling him the truth.

Neither was Man there, so they get less of a say because we now have science that tells us the truth. Point to where the bible mentions them and how they died out. The biggest mass extinction on Earth, wasn't a flood, it was an Asteroid hitting the Earth and totally changing the direction of life on Earth.

No you haven't because you got it wrong. I recommend you get it from the immense library of facts, not a page of words.

no he didn't bad things happen to anyone. As for the promise of Heaven, prove it. With facts not words in a book.

Then prove it's right, use scientific evidence from various sources to prove your bible is right.


1. a short allegorical story designed to illustrate or teach some truth,religious principle, or moral lesson.

It's not facts, truth, evidence. And most certainly not historical. Your god said so.

Your problem like any other fundamental religious person is you're taught not to question the word of Men who rule over you, if they claim to be speaking for your god. That's the purpose of the bible and it's only been the last 200 years that we have started to free ourselves from these chains. You prefer to be bound by them.

If everyone was like you, we would revert to a time when Churches were regarded in such reverence, they didn't pay taxes, men can claim to have as many wives as they choose, can kill others, can enslave others, can make their wives and children possessions, can send people on suicide missions and get people to pay the church money. I say revert back with a touch of sarcasm. Because it happens still.

Even church leaders can tell you who to vote for. Supporting a President who was a fool, took you to unnecessary wars to line the pockets of his friends, and told you to vote for the white one, because a black one was not right. Yes it happened. The bible belt hates the idea of a black man in the White House, especially after they lost the right to have slaves. A god given right.

I was never taught ANY of what I have been trying to share with you, which by the way I did not have to do, and I am done. You don't deserve it.

But the problem here, is not that we can't bury each other with proof or evidence or the witness of millions of people all throughout history...it is your definition of proof. It's finite, and the subject is infinite...and you don't even admit that you have applied the wrong tools to solving the problem. Good luck with that.

 

[paulm50]

I was never taught ANY of what I have been trying to share with you, which by the way I did not have to do, and I am done. You don't deserve it.

But the problem here, is not that we can't bury each other with proof or evidence or the witness of millions of people all throughout history...it is your definition of proof. It's finite, and the subject is infinite...and you don't even admit that you have applied the wrong tools to solving the problem. Good luck with that.

That you weren't taught the truth about what the bible contains doesn't make it change.

You can try to bury me with proof, just don't quote a flawed book to do so. I have quoted truth you can see. My definition of proof isn't finite, I learned more today about how we evolved after fish. The time we were reptiles. Proof of this is in every mammal embryo. So what tools should I apply other than my brain? Not the heart, it can't think, not my soul because it doesn't exist.

You won't apply your eyes to look past a book. Good luck with that.

 

[paulm50]

This Earth is designed to kill us. Not just in our times. Long before we arrived it has been killing life on Earth. Part of it has adapted some species to need destruction to live. Mass extinctions. All proven with evidence, in the strate of rocks and fossil remains. Who was it who said Fossils reveal nothing?

And while some blame Satan as gods better or punishment, these extinctions happened long before Man arrived and even ensured Man evolved into a superior being.

The saddest thing is some religions and sects of Christianity frown on the one key to stave off the next one. Population reduction by a massive scale through contraception.

Earth on brink of mass extinction event

Earth water reserves.

Is it like the Ice Age, or previous mass extinctions an act of nature or god, or is it us racing toward oblivion. Or going to happen anyway as part of the Earth's cycle and we are just speeding it up? I go for the last one.

Some will say it's gods or satan's plans. Seems it's been like that from the start, so designed to kill, and restart. The next lot might be as clever as we are, and come up with a new set of gods.