If man is evolving, why is there still war?

[TLK Valentine]

Sin cannot be uninstalled except by Jesus.

Only fitting, since without him it wouldn't exist...

 

[dad]

Only fitting, since without him it wouldn't exist...

Better to exist having been freed from something, and learned stuff, then not to live at all!

 

[TLK Valentine]

Better to exist having been freed from something, and learned stuff, then not to live at all!

Well, He is freeing us from the problem He invented, so there's that...

And what exactly have you learned, dad?

 

[dad]

Well, He is freeing us from the problem He invented, so there's that...

I feel I am more than a problem He invented actually. Come on over to the side with a little dignity and self respect!

And what exactly have you learned, dad?

That is legal to say?

 

[TLK Valentine]

I feel I am more than a problem He invented actually.

Such as?

Come on over to the side with a little dignity and self respect!

Demonstrate some, and we'll talk.

That is legal to say?

Let's first find out if it's possible to say; we'll worry about legal later.

 

[stevevw]

Just because a person believes in God and follows the example of Jesus in the bible doesn't mean they are not using their brains and reasoning what is good and what is bad. As a Christian we can look at all the examples of how to live and we can assess all this and make a decision. The only difference is I am choosing to trust that God is telling the truth about what he says. I am believing what Jesus said and following His example. So I have a clear example thats in the bible but I have to trust and believe God thats its the right way compared to other ways.

There are certain things we have to trust God for. God is all knowing so He can know all the outcomes and consequences of certain actions. So He knows best what is good fro us. Jesus said He was the way, the truth and the life. He said He came to give life in its abundance. So there is no better way for us to know life than through Him. But we have to trust and believe that this is the truth.

Humans can only rely on themselves. According to human thought there is no ultimate morality or truth. Humans are fallible and they dont know it all. We have seen this time and time again with the mistakes humans have made in their judgements. Even if we have many agreeing about something good we often see that it ends up being wrong or having some sort of consequence that makes things worse or creates another problem.

The other thing is that humans are subject to being influenced to easily to corrupt or compromise the truth. We also have an evil nature and are susceptible to sabotaging what is good. So even when we know what is the right thing to do we end up throwing a spanner in the works with our evil natures which are tempted to do wrong.

So wouldn't it make sense to be able to have an independent source we can use and rely on to help us find the best way to live. Jesus doesn't change and He is the same forever. If we know that we are fallible and cant be trusted in the end to get it right then why not use something or someone who is infallible and knows what is best for us. Its like a Guru who is giving us the best possible receipt for living a good life that will give us the least problems and the best outcomes. It all comes down to a matter of trust and belief.

 

[JustMeSee]

Nothing much happened before Adam. The bible covers it all.

There is more war now I would think. Notice the world is going nuts?

I imagine that there are fewer wars now, they are just on a larger scale. There are far more people now with much more advanced technology.

 

[stevevw]

I'm not sure there are less wars nowadays and that they are bigger or have modern tech so they kill more. There seem to be 100s of smaller wars around the world that people dont know about. I cant imagine there would be as many wars as there are now ever in the history of mankind. Whether you say there are more or less if you look at the amount of conflicts going on around the world I would say there is more tension than ever before. Counting the dead doesn't really give you the real picture about the level of conflict that humans find themselves in. If there isn't some small country or town in some sort of fight with someone then there's neighbors in conflict with each other or people in conflict with governments. It seems the world is not a happy place at the moment.
Wars in the World » List of ongoing Conflicts

 

[KEBO12345]

Just because a person believes in God and follows the example of Jesus in the bible doesn't mean they are not using their brains and reasoning what is good and what is bad.

I think that the problem is the importance put on good and bad.
In nature all information is neutral and perfect. otherwise it could not be.
It is only the minds of men that seperate themselves from this beauty and
proceed with good and bad duality. It is how the brain measures its difference
between others and the world.

There is another option available where that sort of judgement becomes
observed as false in us by us. Think everything is made of love and wants to Love and be loved.



There are certain things we have to trust God for. God is all knowing so He can know all the outcomes and consequences of certain actions. So He knows best what is good fro us. Jesus said He was the way, the truth and the life. He said He came to give life in its abundance. So there is no better way for us to know life than through Him. But we have to trust and believe that this is the truth.

Think that before you go saying there is no better way, one had better have done their homework on all cosmologies. Its a pretty important question, perhaps the most important.

Mankind cannot go making things up (anymore). The story must be rational
and coherent with nature which is a big stumbling block for the Abrahamic religions. Think you should go shopping properly, and choose carefully before
installing a command religion. Where we are told what to do and how to pray.

I have seen it where people end up 'beyond reach' having built a cage around
their religious thoughts that they can never escape from.




Humans can only rely on themselves. According to human thought there is no ultimate morality or truth. Humans are fallible and they dont know it all. We have seen this time and time again with the mistakes humans have made in their judgements. Even if we have many agreeing about something good we often see that it ends up being wrong or having some sort of consequence that makes things worse or creates another problem.

The other thing is that humans are subject to being influenced to easily to corrupt or compromise the truth. We also have an evil nature and are susceptible to sabotaging what is good. So even when we know what is the right thing to do we end up throwing a spanner in the works with our evil natures which are tempted to do wrong.

So wouldn't it make sense to be able to have an independent source we can use and rely on to help us find the best way to live. Jesus doesn't change and He is the same forever. If we know that we are fallible and cant be trusted in the end to get it right then why not use something or someone who is infallible and knows what is best for us. Its like a Guru who is giving us the best possible receipt for living a good life that will give us the least problems and the best outcomes. It all comes down to a matter of trust and belief.

There you go with good and bad again.
Trust and (false) belief are both structures of the imagination.

 

[dad]

Just because a person believes in God and follows the example of Jesus in the bible doesn't mean they are not using their brains and reasoning what is good and what is bad.

That depends entirely on what they swallow.

As a Christian we can look at all the examples of how to live and we can assess all this and make a decision. The only difference is I am choosing to trust that God is telling the truth about what he says. I am believing what Jesus said and following His example. So I have a clear example thats in the bible but I have to trust and believe God thats its the right way compared to other ways.

No. We also believe a lot of other things like that He created the world and in heaven etc. Jesus did not offer morals, but a choice to believe in Him as the only way..or not.

There are certain things we have to trust God for.

Name something we don't need to trust for??

God is all knowing so He can know all the outcomes and consequences of certain actions. So He knows best what is good fro us. Jesus said He was the way, the truth and the life. He said He came to give life in its abundance. So there is no better way for us to know life than through Him. But we have to trust and believe that this is the truth.

Great. So let's do that. Simple.

Humans can only rely on themselves.

False. They can rely on God and even others to some extent in cases.

According to human thought there is no ultimate morality or truth. Humans are fallible and they dont know it all. We have seen this time and time again with the mistakes humans have made in their judgements. Even if we have many agreeing about something good we often see that it ends up being wrong or having some sort of consequence that makes things worse or creates another problem.

Human thought is not a good thing then. OK.

The other thing is that humans are subject to being influenced to easily to corrupt or compromise the truth. We also have an evil nature and are susceptible to sabotaging what is good. So even when we know what is the right thing to do we end up throwing a spanner in the works with our evil natures which are tempted to do wrong.

Got the preacher's itch?

So wouldn't it make sense to be able to have an independent source we can use and rely on to help us find the best way to live. Jesus doesn't change and He is the same forever. If we know that we are fallible and cant be trusted in the end to get it right then why not use something or someone who is infallible and knows what is best for us. Its like a Guru who is giving us the best possible receipt for living a good life that will give us the least problems and the best outcomes. It all comes down to a matter of trust and belief.

Great so trust is a good thing.

 

[dad]

There you go with good and bad again.
Trust and (false) belief are both structures of the imagination.

Oh? Would you say that is a true saying? If so I guess it is a product of your imagination, by your own words. Hoisted on one's own petard.

 

[stevevw]

I think that the problem is the importance put on good and bad.
In nature all information is neutral and perfect. otherwise it could not be.
It is only the minds of men that separate themselves from this beauty and
proceed with good and bad duality. It is how the brain measures its difference between others and the world.

Nature itself doesn't have any ability to reason and be aware of itself. As humans we have that ability so we can determine if what we do is good or bad. The bible says that we all have Gods laws written on our hearts. So we all know of what is right and wrong and this is determined by our conscience. We also have the ability to change our behavior when we realize we have done wrong. So as humans we are different to nature and this ability is in us whether we like it or not. We cant pretend its not. Our conscience can cause us to be guilty and have remorse. Or it can free us to feel worthy and guilt free when we do the right thing. Its not just about mans laws because people can still feel guilt even when they are innocent according to the laws of man kind.

There is another option available where that sort of judgement becomes
observed as false in us by us. Think everything is made of love and wants to Love and be loved.

But it will depend on what view a person has on love. Because humans views are subjective there may be many versions of what they think love is. For some love may be being cruel so that you teach a person a lesson. Bu doing this you are saving them from a greater harm later. Some may think love is being nice all the time and base it on a feeling. Others will have another view. The bible speaks of love many times. It says that greater love that someone can have is to lay their life down for another.

Think that before you go saying there is no better way, one had better have done their homework on all cosmologies. Its a pretty important question, perhaps the most important.

The only other comparisons I can see will be what other humans say about what is the best way. We here this time and time again. So there are many people telling us what is best. We here it with the latest diets or lifestyle programs. Or how we can become successful and rich or gain freedom in life by becoming a better person through some idea that someone is promoting. These ideas come and go all the time.

Jesus is very specific about what is the way to have a good life and find true peace. He states there is no other way. Its up to the individual to take or leave that. But the fact is we all are willing to try many different things and subject ourselves to tough regimes to find that something in life we are looking for. We will even risk our life's savings or sacrifice many things. So God isn't asking much when you consider this. He is giving something for free and all it takes is faith to accept it.

Mankind cannot go making things up (anymore). The story must be rational and coherent with nature which is a big stumbling block for the Abrahamic religions. Think you should go shopping properly, and choose carefully before installing a command religion. Where we are told what to do and how to pray.

Not really there are many ideas out there that people have come up with that are not tested and coherent that people are willing to try. We here of them all the time. The magazines are always promoting the next fad way to change your life and find happiness or get rich and have your dream life. Many people are trying to sell you a dream. And millions buy into it and get caught out all the time. So God starts to look quite good compared to all this when you consider it doesn't cost a cent. You can only try it and if you find its no good you have lost nothing.

I have seen it where people end up 'beyond reach' having built a cage around their religious thoughts that they can never escape from.

There you go with good and bad again.

I think there are many ways people can build cages around them and religion is only one of them. But religion is a man made institution. It can be deceptive because it adds many human ideas that are not from God. When you look at Jesus and see His teachings and example there is nothing wrong with this. It is plain and simple. It promotes love of others as you love yourself and a very good life. There is nothing wrong with this and it cannot be judged as bad. Its when people inject all their own stuff is where it gets bad. Its like a cake receipt. You have the basic ingredients. Then along comes all these other cooks and they start to add their little bits into the mix. They make adjustments to the receipt and before you know it the cake doesn't turn out. To many cooks spoil the broth.

There you go with good and bad again.
Trust and (false) belief are both structures of the imagination.

I would think that we need to trust. Its not something of the imagination. As I pointed out before we all have this awareness of good and bad or right and wrong. We all ask the big questions, where do we come from, where do we go when we die, is there more to life than what we see. No one can know for sure that these are not valid questions and that there is something beyond what we see. The fact is we have this inside us and we are searching for answers. So it is a very real part of us whether we believe or not.

Yes we can fool ourselves into believing all sorts of things that are untrue. But that doesn't discount the fact that there may be something real beyond this reality that we can know about that can add something to our lives. We have to also use our brains and reason to check things out. But there may be times when all the logic and evidence in the world is not going to help you make that decision. You have to have a little faith and trust sometimes when someone says trust me I can show you the way. Not everything in life is based on the things we can only see and touch. We have other dimensions to us. Its important to acknowledge our spiritual sides as well. Other wise we are incomplete and will miss out on being a whole person.

 

[HonestTruth]

They do claim that mutations are beneficial, no? They do claim species evolve and get better..no? There is more war today than in Adam's day. Funny, that.

Dunno that I have an answer to your question but, it never ceases to amaze me how people can call themselves worshipers of the Prince of Peace while calling for more war and supporting the military industrial complex. Then, many (certainly not all) pretend that endorsing war is the most Christian thing one can do while condemning war is supposedly communist inspired or some other such nonsense.

I will never stop wondering how this type of thinking persists when the Bible's instructions to make peace is so clear.

 

[AV1611VET]

Dunno that I have an answer to your question but, it never ceases to amaze me how people can call themselves worshipers of the Prince of Peace while calling for more war and supporting the military industrial complex. Then, many (certainly not all) pretend that endorsing war is the most Christian thing one can do while condemning war is supposedly communist inspired or some other such nonsense.

I will never stop wondering how this type of thinking persists when the Bible's instructions to make peace is so clear.

Thanks to those who think differently, you could say this in English, rather than German or Japanese.

 

[dad]

Dunno that I have an answer to your question but, it never ceases to amaze me how people can call themselves worshipers of the Prince of Peace while calling for more war and supporting the military industrial complex.

I am wondering the same thing. Perhaps one of them will dare to try to explain here. I do not see how I could explain to a child that got droned or bombed and lost their mom and dad, and arms..how it was Jesus that wanted that done! I do not believe it is.

From the scriptural support for that sort of thing I have seen so far, it is weak, and twisted. Things like 'obey the power' or whatever. That sure doesn't mean joining terrorist armies.

Then, many (certainly not all) pretend that endorsing war is the most Christian thing one can do while condemning war is supposedly communist inspired or some other such nonsense.

Exactly. Which side do they feel God is on...and is it OK for the guys fighting on the other side to do the same or just them?

I will never stop wondering how this type of thinking persists when the Bible's instructions to make peace is so clear.

I agree. Especially in this modern age where civilians are the main casualties....

 

[dad]

Thanks to those who think differently, you could say this in English, rather than German or Japanese.

Ha. I knew we would not agree on everything. If they Germans did win and ruled still would you support joining their army? If you prefer not to 'argue' that is fine, cause I intend to defend my position tooth and nail Nothing personal.

The way I see it, I can agree with Christians 80% - 90% or even 95%, and still have things I disagree on. A good example of this is John MacArthur. (and other radio preachers) I agree with most things they say, and enjoy learning from them. However, when John for example get's into Calvanist nonsense like 'if one falls they were never reaaallly saved to begin with' I tune out fast.

 

[AV1611VET]

Ha. I knew we would not agree on everything.

If they Germans did win and ruled still would you support joining their army?

No, sir!

If you prefer not to 'argue' that is fine, cause I intend to defend my position tooth and nail Nothing personal.

 

[dad]

No, sir!

That is the way I feel about the US army and other armies.

 

[AV1611VET]

That is the way I feel about the US army and other armies.

Draft dodger!

How's the weather in Canada?

 

[dad]

Draft dodger!

How's the weather in Canada?

If I was drafted I would dodge, and recommend to any kids who asked to do the same.

Maybe someone will try to make a bible case for it. I could be wrong.