If lying is a sin, then how come....?

[Outspoken]

If it's not part of your doctrine, then why do you have the need to state it? If it's not part of your beliefs, then there was no point in your stating it in the first place.

I don't concede to your agrument, but for the time being I will no longer debate this with you, because you can't even see or admit to the fact that you are doing exactly what you condemn others of doing. You accuse liberal Christians of taking things out of context and adding things that aren't there, yet you are doing the same thing. You cannot prove anything and even admit that this is your best guess. There is no point of debating this with you any longer.

Blessings,

Tim

LOL. Because I was asked a question. Again, you need to go back and read the posts. It sounds like you came in with some bias and wasn't ready for the replies.

"I don't concede to your agrument"

I have disproven your assurtion, I made no assurtion, so there is nothing for you to concede over.

"You accuse liberal Christians of taking things out of context and adding things that aren't there"

Per the definition of liberal in the context of theology.

"You cannot prove anything and even admit that this is your best guess."

why would I need to prove a defintion...oh by the way, I'm still waiting for you to prove your assurtion that immature means immperfect..or do you admit you were wrong on that issue?

 

[MuAndNu]

"Haven't we already gone over that?"

Yes, we have and I showed how you were in error. He was forbidding the fruit because of the consequence of eating it, not the mode. I showed you that clearing in his reaction and the real temptation by satan.

"you can infer that he meant more, but you can't show that he did."

Noooooo, I showed it clearly.

"You see, hermeneutics is an attempt at methodological interpretation. It's not a science."

finally decided to look the word up huh?

"If you can't show me by the text itself"

LOL, I showed you by the text itself. If you want to cover your eyes and think its not there that's fine, just don't say its not there.

I taught the Bible for many years. If you want to kid yourself about me not knowing such a basic term as "hermeneutics," have a ball. I shouldn't be surprised. You seem to enjoy kidding yourself.

But you're not kidding me or anyone else here. That's obvious enough by reading the other posts. Your primary argumentative tactic seems to be browbeating. That's always a sign of someone unsure of himself. The fact is, you write as someone who is not stupid. You're capable of better. I've got to wonder what you're afraid of.

But, until you get that figured out, I think I'll avoid Outspoken. Yes, you've browbeaten me into submission. You've exhausted me. Go back to your church and testify as to how you've vanquished the infidel. Everyone will be edified thereby.

Good luck.

 

[Outspoken]

I taught the Bible for many years. If you want to kid yourself about me not knowing such a basic term as "hermeneutics," have a ball. I shouldn't be surprised. You seem to enjoy kidding yourself.

But you're not kidding me or anyone else here. That's obvious enough by reading the other posts. Your primary argumentative tactic seems to be browbeating. That's always a sign of someone unsure of himself. The fact is, you write as someone who is not stupid. You're capable of better. I've got to wonder what you're afraid of.

But, until you get that figured out, I think I'll avoid Outspoken. Yes, you've browbeaten me into submission. You've exhausted me. Go back to your church and testify as to how you've vanquished the infidel. Everyone will be edified thereby.

Good luck.

As far as browbeating, I'm answering the posts that are addressed to me, nothing more. If you're talking about how he forbid the fruit, I addressed that with scripture showing it was the aquision of knowledge that was the concern, not the meduim it was gained through (ie eating). Sorry if you can't rebutt that but don't accuse me of being unsure when I proved it quite clearly.

 

[Mr. Fields]

I taught the Bible for many years. If you want to kid yourself about me not knowing such a basic term as "hermeneutics," have a ball. I shouldn't be surprised. You seem to enjoy kidding yourself.

But you're not kidding me or anyone else here. That's obvious enough by reading the other posts. Your primary argumentative tactic seems to be browbeating. That's always a sign of someone unsure of himself. The fact is, you write as someone who is not stupid. You're capable of better. I've got to wonder what you're afraid of.

But, until you get that figured out, I think I'll avoid Outspoken. Yes, you've browbeaten me into submission. You've exhausted me. Go back to your church and testify as to how you've vanquished the infidel. Everyone will be edified thereby.

Good luck.

Amen and Amen!

 

[aagard]

God's law says lying is a sin but God is not a fool,(KJV, I kings 22:20-22) even God in the old testament used lies to cause israel to do something that He wanted in order to bring judgement on them.there r extreme times that a person can lie and God will not hold them accountable for it , like someone hiding the jews during the time when hitler wanted to kill them.

 

[Outspoken]

God's law says lying is a sin but God is not a fool,(KJV, I kings 22:20-22) even God in the old testament used lies to cause israel to do something that He wanted in order to bring judgement on them.there r extreme times that a person can lie and God will not hold them accountable for it , like someone hiding the jews during the time when hitler wanted to kill them.

Noo, lying is always a sin. God allowed people to lie. In Hebrew culture what happened was attributed to God. Sin happens because God allowes it, he does not cause it.

 

[wayfaring man]

What I want to know is why God put it there in the first place...

Not quite a pefect scenario. Put people who are capable of disobeying in a garden with a tree with fruit that looks good to eat, and tell the people not to eat it? What was the point of that? If God intended man to remain in the garden, in the midst of his "perfect" creation, surely he knew that mans natural curiousity would get the best of him, sooner or later?

Free will , man had to have the option of disobeying , or else he / she could not truly be in The Father and The Son's image .

There are other plausible reason's , but that's the most evident one .

Sincerely , wm

 

[Mr. Fields]

Free will , man had to have the option of disobeying , or else he / she could not truly be in The Father and The Son's image .

There are other plausible reason's , but that's the most evident one .

Sincerely , wm

Interesting idea, but it seems to me "in our image" means just that.

If God wanted us to be so much like him that he went as far as allowing us to be tempted by evil, which is what you have just explained, then he should have just made us equal with him (Gods). Otherwise, he should have known we were doomed to fail, being lesser than Gods.

Again, interesting theory, but doesn't add up to me...

 

[Outspoken]

"Otherwise, he should have known we were doomed to fail, being lesser than Gods."

We are exactly like him in that aspect. We have free will

 

[Angelajt]

Interesting idea, but it seems to me "in our image" means just that.

If God wanted us to be so much like him that he went as far as allowing us to be tempted by evil, which is what you have just explained, then he should have just made us equal with him (Gods). Otherwise, he should have known we were doomed to fail, being lesser than Gods.

Again, interesting theory, but doesn't add up to me...

I don't know the whole purpose of the disobedience, but I do know that Jesus while on this earth thought it not robbery to be called equal with God and since we are joint-heirs with Christ being equal....that would mean that God does not think it robber for us to be called equal with Christ, who is equal with God.
I don't understand it....I just read it in the bible and believe it....

How often do we look at others who are not up to our level in knowledge, or looks, or money or prestige and truly call them equal with ourselves.....

Our children are equal to us, but while they are children, we have authority over them....when they reach the age to be own their own....they are called equal even though we are older......

The bible says God made us to walk with him and talk with him and to be his friend....you can't do that as an underling or a slave...but as a child that grows up in the things of God. I love little winkie dude.

 

[Mr. Fields]

I don't know the whole purpose of the disobedience, but I do know that Jesus while on this earth thought it not robbery to be called equal with God and since we are joint-heirs with Christ being equal....that would mean that God does not think it robber for us to be called equal with Christ, who is equal with God.
I don't understand it....I just read it in the bible and believe it....

How often do we look at others who are not up to our level in knowledge, or looks, or money or prestige and truly call them equal with ourselves.....

Our children are equal to us, but while they are children, we have authority over them....when they reach the age to be own their own....they are called equal even though we are older......

The bible says God made us to walk with him and talk with him and to be his friend....you can't do that as an underling or a slave...but as a child that grows up in the things of God. I love little winkie dude.

OK, this is all very interesting, but obviously we are not equal to God, or we wouldn't need, as most Christians believe, a savior to rescue us from the pits of hell. Get where I'm at with this? In other words, there are millions upon millions, if you believe what most Christians believe, that are dying and frying. If humans were equal with God they could save themselves from dying and frying. If humans were equal with God no one would die and fry.

So again, with that in mind, the whole concept of man in a garden, with the potential to fall and cause the entire human race to die and fry unless they find the grace of God somehow, doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

 

[Angelajt]

OK, this is all very interesting, but obviously we are not equal to God, or we wouldn't need, as most Christians believe, a savior to rescue us from the pits of hell. Get where I'm at with this? In other words, there are millions upon millions, if you believe what most Christians believe, that are dying and frying. If humans were equal with God they could save themselves from dying and frying. If humans were equal with God no one would die and fry.

So again, with that in mind, the whole concept of man in a garden, with the potential to fall and cause the entire human race to die and fry unless they find the grace of God somehow, doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

It is Christ who makes us equal with God. without Christ you are only made in his image......as a spirit....able to create.....

 

[wayfaring man]

Interesting idea, but it seems to me "in our image" means just that.

If God wanted us to be so much like him that he went as far as allowing us to be tempted by evil, which is what you have just explained, then he should have just made us equal with him (Gods). Otherwise, he should have known we were doomed to fail, being lesser than Gods.

Again, interesting theory, but doesn't add up to me...

It depends on what kind of " Math " one is employing ...To this mortal being , God is still in the process of " just making me into what I will ultimately become " ; not that , it takes God years to accomplish this , but that , it takes me years , to fully submit to His Life Changing Power .

Also , God's sense of time is on a whole other scale , than is ours .

To God , Christ was just crucified and raised from the dead , a couple of days ago .

So , when you say " Why doesn't God , just ' do it ' ? "

Have you considered that in God's sense of Time - He Is !

Or do you expect The Supreme Ruler of The Universe to cater to your miniscule sense of celestial turnings ?

Talk about something which " doesn't add up " !!!

wm