If Evolution were true...

[AV1611VET]

In school Opossum's should only be taught one thing. To stay out of the road.

Survival of the Fastest?

 

[Hespera]

In school Opossum's should only be taught one thing. To stay out of the road.

i do wish they'd learn.

 

[rjc34]

Hespera, I'm going to ask you nicely to stop propagating this.

At one time, I believed there was no evidence whatsoever of the Flood; but I have changed my stance on that.

Telling people I'm [still] admitting there is no evidence is only going to confuse them.

Does this mean you contradicted yourself and set yourself back 5 years?

 

[AV1611VET]

Does this mean you contradicted yourself and set yourself back 5 years?

No

 

[rjc34]

No

You had a certain view then, and you have a differing and incompatible view now. By very definition of the law of contradiction you have violated it. You contradicted yourself, by your own admission.

 

[sandwiches]

Posted by Tiberius:

"That's all evolution is. It's not striving to be more highly evolved."

Thus one of the central tenets of evolution. Man is nothing special, simply an accident of nature.

Yep. Am I correct in assuming that one of the reasons you reject evolution is because you don't like the idea that we're not special?

 

[sandwiches]

Okay. I can see how some believe in evolution rather than Creation.
If Evolution is correct, and Creation is wrong, I will have lost nothing by living a good clean life - believing there is a Father in Heaven who loves me. No harm there. But for arguments sake, I've provided a partial list of scientific discoveries supporting Divine Design/Creation.

Unless you're worshiping the wrong god and you end up in the same pile as us atheists.

A partial list of evidences/discoveries supporting Creation:

Fine Tuning Parameters for the Universe[/B]

The universe is as finely tuned for life as a hole in the ground is perfectly tuned for a puddle of water inside it. In other words, if the universe didn't have the properties it does, then it either would've yielded a very different kind of life or none at all. So what? How does the fact that life as we know it would not have existed, if the universe had been different, support the idea that it was finely tuned?

 

[AV1611VET]

How is the fact that life as we know it would not have existed, if the universe had been different, support the idea that it was finely tuned?

We are made in the image and likeness of God; thus the puddle analogy falls apart.

Otherwise, it would be of the most incredible coincidence.

 

[Tiberius]

Do you believe in God or are you strictly an evolutionist? I am only asking so that I can understand better where you're coming from. Again, I apologize. I'm usually not like that. Don't know what got into me.

I'm an atheist.

A jillion fossils -- the earth, if scanned by aliens from space, should appear to be one big graveyard.

And you think that every single fossil should be in a place where humans can find it? And you think that every single fossil has survived?

Posted by Tiberius:

"That's all evolution is. It's not striving to be more highly evolved."

Thus one of the central tenets of evolution. Man is nothing special, simply an accident of nature.

Does it bother you to think that humans might not be the intended end product of evolution?

Fossilized or not then -- my opinion is that one should find a jillion of them.

You expect to find a fossil that wasn't fossilised?

Okay. I can see how some believe in evolution rather than Creation.
If Evolution is correct, and Creation is wrong, I will have lost nothing by living a good clean life - believing there is a Father in Heaven who loves me. No harm there. But for arguments sake, I've provided a partial list of scientific discoveries supporting Divine Design/Creation.

Ah, here we go, Pascal's wager.

What if the Father in heaven is a different god to the one you believe? Aren't you just making him madder and madder for believing in the wrong religion? And in any case, aren't you just believing to hedge your bets?

A partial list of evidences/discoveries supporting Creation:

Non of these things has anything to do with evolution. I am talking about biological evolution of life here, people!

 

[Hespera]

Yep. Am I correct in assuming that one of the reasons you reject evolution is because you don't like the idea that we're not special?

We've never seen a reason that was based on anything other than emotion and religion.

 

[Hespera]

Unless you're worshiping the wrong god and you end up in the same pile as us atheists.



The universe is as finely tuned for life as a hole in the ground is perfectly tuned for a puddle of water inside it. In other words, if the universe didn't have the properties it does, then it either would've yielded a very different kind of life or none at all. So what? How is the fact that life as we know it would not have existed, if the universe had been different, support the idea that it was finely tuned?

and if it turns out that we were supposed to worship allah... joke is on the girls then!


maybe i should wear a scarf...

this is what you get if you dont!

 

[sandwiches]

We are made in the image and likeness of God; thus the puddle analogy falls apart.

We're not. So, it works.

Otherwise, it would be of the most incredible coincidence.

Not really. Much more incredible coincidences happen every single day. But people only like to acknowledge them as coincidences when it's significant to them or they simply don't understand probability.

 

[rjc34]

We are made in the image and likeness of God; thus the puddle analogy falls apart.

Otherwise, it would be of the most incredible coincidence.

Since everyone looks different, who does god look like?

 

[AV1611VET]

Not really. Much more incredible coincidences happen every single day. But people only like to acknowledge them as coincidences when it's significant to them or they simply don't understand probability.

For this entire universe to be tuned in such a way that, when man arrives -- created in the way that he is -- he is able to live within the parameters of said universe; should he also be in the image and likeness of God, that would constitute a coincidence so outstanding, that it would fall under the mathematically-impossible range (i.e. 10[sup]50[/sup] and up).

 

[sandwiches]

For this entire universe to be tuned in such a way that, when man arrives -- created in the way that he is -- he is able to live within the parameters of said universe; should he also be in the image and likeness of God, that would constitute a coincidence so outstanding, that it would fall under the mathematically-impossible range (i.e. 10[sup]50[/sup] and up).

First off, there's no such thing. The only probability that is "mathematically impossible" would be 0 ("zero"). Anything above 0 probability is possible.

Second, the probability of any other universe existing or any other kind of life existing is the exact same as this universe and this life existing. We simply choose to ascribe significance to this arrangement of the universe because we're in it.

 

[Freodin]

For this entire universe to be tuned in such a way that, when man arrives -- created in the way that he is -- he is able to live within the parameters of said universe; should he also be in the image and likeness of God, that would constitute a coincidence so outstanding, that it would fall under the mathematically-impossible range (i.e. 10[sup]50[/sup] and up).

Err... no. Double no, in fact.

If humans evolved, it is not the universe that is "tuned" to humans... it is humans that are "tuned" to the universe.

And if humans were created - rather, the universe was created for humans to live in - each and every "tuning" would work.

I just can't understand why creationists imagine God checking the lasted "Graw-McMountain" Bible to find out just how he would have to tune a universe for humans to live in.

 

[sandwiches]

For this entire universe to be tuned in such a way that, when man arrives -- created in the way that he is -- he is able to live within the parameters of said universe; should he also be in the image and likeness of God, that would constitute a coincidence so outstanding, that it would fall under the mathematically-impossible range (i.e. 10[sup]50[/sup] and up).

To use the good ol' rolling dice probability example, if we roll 100 six-sided dice, the probability of any specific arrangement of the dice is 6.5331862350007090609669026715806e+77, way beyond what you claimed to be "mathematically impossible." Yet it's perfectly easy to do.

My point is that you're misunderstanding how probability works.

 

[AV1611VET]

First off, there's no such thing. The only probability that is "mathematically impossible" would be 0 ("zero"). Anything above 0 probability is possible.

Second, the probability of any other universe existing or any other kind of life existing is the exact same as this universe and this life existing. We simply choose to ascribe significance to this arrangement of the universe because we're in it.

Then let's test your theory, shall we?

Take a jackhammer, encase it in a huge block of ice, turn it on and let it run awhile, then turn it off and see if it -- by coincidence -- hammered out a cavity that, when filled with plastic (or some other pliable material), would solidify and, after the ice melts, there stands a statue in your image and likeness.

(Or the image and likeness of Joe down the street, or Jorge, or anyone.)

In fact, do it 10[sup]50[/sup] times or more -- I'll wait.

 

[AV1611VET]

Err... no. Double no, in fact.

If humans evolved, it is not the universe that is "tuned" to humans... it is humans that are "tuned" to the universe.

And if humans were created - rather, the universe was created for humans to live in - each and every "tuning" would work.

I just can't understand why creationists imagine God checking the lasted "Graw-McMountain" Bible to find out just how he would have to tune a universe for humans to live in.

We're both just repeating our stances, are we not?

 

[AV1611VET]

To use the good ol' rolling dice probability example, if we roll 100 six-sided dice, the probability of any specific arrangement of the dice is 6.5331862350007090609669026715806e+77, way beyond what you claimed to be "mathematically impossible." Yet it's perfectly easy to do.

My point is that you're misunderstanding how probability works.

And here we go -- let's latch on to a side-issue and run it into the ground, until the main point is long-forgotten.

Science at its best.