If Christ took the curse of the law away, does the curse still apply?

[SavedByGrace3]

specifically with regard to pain in childbirth? can christian women
pray for no pain?

thanks for your thoughts

I just had a Great Granddaughter two days ago. Mommy was not having any pain! It was so minor that she had to call the nurses because the baby was "crowning" and on it's way into this world!
"Excuse me!!! The Baby is COMING!!"
Little or no pain...

 

[Yahu]

I just had a Great Granddaughter two days ago. Mommy was not having any pain! It was so minor that she had to call the nurses because the baby was "crowning" and on it's way into this world!
"Excuse me!!! The Baby is COMING!!"
Little or no pain...

I'm willing to bet it wasn't a first child for her.

 

[TasManOfGod]

I have been around Christian circles long enough to know that there are those in ministry who hold onto doctrines that will ensure that their knowledge and actions will be appreciated and even necessary and that apart from Jesus their "ministry" is the best thing that ever happened to them. Having said that I too wondered (in my early years) about christians who were bound up and couldnt seem to get free from satan's influences and desired to help as much as I could. Knowing that Wof were very word based I was prompted by the Lord (another story) to learn at a Rhema based college. There I was surprised to find that not a whole lot was spoken about dealing with the demonic in others but rather understanding the fullness of the Cross. Now I understand that such teaching is for those who are within the movement and unless embraced does not do anything for those outside of that understanding and so other methods need to be put in place.
So there are those who leave out the "wholeness of Calvary" message and remain sick and sometimes demonisednd basing their understanding on circumstances claim that the wof message is not appropriate.
Now if you are a proponent of Wof and want to be effective in ministry you have to deal with people who dont or wont for one reason or another pick up on being set free by the Word alone. This then entails the faith of the "elders" and ministry along the lines of James 5:13-16. For this reason not only have I studied the most perfect way but I have also been a student of non Wof "deliverence church" to gain further understanding of the demonic and what is required to help people get set free.
The bottom line is that you cannot convince a woffer to give up on his faith of the "completed" work of Christ and opt out for a life of continual battling with a defeated enemy nor is it possible often to break down the effects of falsehoods levelled against wof and its understanding .

 

[Frogster]

The Law of reaping and sowing is still in effect. If we sow to the flesh, we still reap corruption. Our salvation does NOT invalidate that law.

Those 'in Christ' are those with wisdom (and a fear of Yah) that follow the guidance of the Spirit and don't fall into error thus are free from the consequences but we are never totally 'in Christ' until we are in the eternal kingdom.

If you commit adultery, I guarantee there will be a curse on your life that opens the door to attack by the enemy that is allowed by Yah.

fusion here, you take the sowing and reaping verse outta galatians 5, after Paul just said we are not under law in 5:18, while you try to validate the law.

no more law condemnation for the seed of Abraham, the law was abolished in his flesh for a reason, eph 2:15, and here>>>>>>>>


Rom 8:8 There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death. 3 For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh,

 

[Frogster]

The Law of reaping and sowing is still in effect. If we sow to the flesh, we still reap corruption. Our salvation does NOT invalidate that law.

Those 'in Christ' are those with wisdom (and a fear of Yah) that follow the guidance of the Spirit and don't fall into error thus are free from the consequences but we are never totally 'in Christ' until we are in the eternal kingdom.

If you commit adultery, I guarantee there will be a curse on your life that opens the door to attack by the enemy that is allowed by Yah.

walk in the Spirit, we won't be in the flesh, or under law. Do u see how the scriptures put flesh and law, in the same box?


Gal 5:16 But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the desires of the flesh are against the Spirit, and the desires of the Spirit are against the flesh, for these are opposed to each other, to keep you from doing the things you want to do. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

 

[Yahu]

walk in the Spirit, we won't be in the flesh, or under law. Do u see how the scriptures put flesh and law, in the same box?

Gal 5:16 But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the desires of the flesh are against the Spirit, and the desires of the Spirit are against the flesh, for these are opposed to each other, to keep you from doing the things you want to do. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

To be 'led by the Spirit' is the have the law written upon your heart, not tablets of stone. The law was given on the 1st Pentecost. The Holy Spirit was also given on Pentecost. To be 'led by the Spirit' is to follow the law. Law or Torah is better defined as 'instructions'. To follow the instructions of the Holy Spirit is to follow the living law.

I agree IF you walk in the Spirit, you are fine. That IS following the law. The LAW isn't the book of Leviticus. That was the priestly law for nation of Israel. All of the Torah is Yah's instructions. Some is given in parable or story form. The Holy Spirit will draw upon the scripture to bring to mind those scriptures pertaining to your current situation.

The point is if you DON'T follow the Spirit but yield to the flesh, you still have to face the consequences of your disobedience even after salvation. If you live in sin as a Christian, you will die younger. If you start to harm other spiritual babies with your actions, you are better off tying a millstone around your neck and jumping into the sea.

 

[Frogster]

To be 'led by the Spirit' is the have the law written upon your heart, not tablets of stone. The law was given on the 1st Pentecost. The Holy Spirit was also given on Pentecost. To be 'led by the Spirit' is to follow the law. Law or Torah is better defined as 'instructions'. To follow the instructions of the Holy Spirit is to follow the living law.

I agree IF you walk in the Spirit, you are fine. That IS following the law. The LAW isn't the book of Leviticus. That was the priestly law for nation of Israel. All of the Torah is Yah's instructions. Some is given in parable or story form. The Holy Spirit will draw upon the scripture to bring to mind those scriptures pertaining to your current situation.

The point is if you DON'T follow the Spirit but yield to the flesh, you still have to face the consequences of your disobedience even after salvation. If you live in sin as a Christian, you will die younger. If you start to harm other spiritual babies with your actions, you are better off tying a millstone around your neck and jumping into the sea.

here is the weak spot to your fusion of law and grace.

Why oh why, would paul continually fight off those, who wanted to add law for sanctification? isn"t that really what galatians is all about?

why wouldn't Paul want his church to be all wrapped up in law, since after all, they would have to know law, to follow the Spirit?

high time we hear about the cross...

 

[Frogster]

To be 'led by the Spirit' is the have the law written upon your heart, not tablets of stone. The law was given on the 1st Pentecost. The Holy Spirit was also given on Pentecost. To be 'led by the Spirit' is to follow the law. Law or Torah is better defined as 'instructions'. To follow the instructions of the Holy Spirit is to follow the living law.

I agree IF you walk in the Spirit, you are fine. That IS following the law. The LAW isn't the book of Leviticus. That was the priestly law for nation of Israel. All of the Torah is Yah's instructions. Some is given in parable or story form. The Holy Spirit will draw upon the scripture to bring to mind those scriptures pertaining to your current situation.

The point is if you DON'T follow the Spirit but yield to the flesh, you still have to face the consequences of your disobedience even after salvation. If you live in sin as a Christian, you will die younger. If you start to harm other spiritual babies with your actions, you are better off tying a millstone around your neck and jumping into the sea.

u also forget, that the law commands the flesh, they were for the most part, negative restraint.

so lets not bind law here...

 

[Frogster]

look how they received the Spirit, not by law! Why?


Gal 3:2 Let me ask you only this: Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law or by hearing with faith?

then he goes on to use Abraham, to ward off law, becaue abe did not have the law, and he was justified pre law.

the just live by faith, juxdtaposed to law in gal 3:11-3:12, the law is not a principle of faith, the faith of Abraham contextually.

Everywhere Paul used Abe, it warded off judaism, law, circumcision, racism, etc.

 

[Yahu]

here is the weak spot to your fusion of law and grace.

Why oh why, would paul continually fight off those, who wanted to add law for sanctification? isn"t that really what galatians is all about?

why wouldn't Paul want his church to be all wrapped up in law, since after all, they would have to know law, to follow the Spirit?

high time we hear about the cross...

No, Galations is countering following the written and oral law (traditions of the pharisees) for salvation. Following the commandments is the sanctification process. Yeshua said if you love me, follow my commandments. Scripture equates lawlessness to evil.

 

[Frogster]

No, Galations is countering following the written and oral law (traditions of the pharisees) for salvation. Following the commandments is the sanctification process. Yeshua said if you love me, follow my commandments. Scripture equates lawlessness to evil.

really, oral law?

So the book of the law was oral, and Christ redeemd fro the oral law in 3:13?

10 For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, “Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.”

hate to break it to u, but he quotes lev 18:5 in 3:12, just like romans 10:5.


Gal 3:12 But the law is not of faith, rather “The one who does them shall live by them.”

 

[Frogster]

No, Galations is countering following the written and oral law (traditions of the pharisees) for salvation. Following the commandments is the sanctification process. Yeshua said if you love me, follow my commandments. Scripture equates lawlessness to evil.

oral law bound all under sin, the sin? it says SCRIPTURE. No?


Gal 3:22 But the Scripture imprisoned everything under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.


I have more, if u would like.

 

[Frogster]

yahu


perfecting through the flesh 3:3, adding law, the sanctification theme is there, if u know where to look, but just a quickie..

if they got snipped, would it just mean the would be under law for just 1 day, or for the years ahead?

see what i mean? there was more at stake in Galatia, than just the original imputation, what we call justification, he was really fighting law sanctification, even though the sanctification word is not used.

There is text to show it too.

But for the most part, paul built his argument of of 3:3.

 

[Frogster]

No, Galations is countering following the written and oral law (traditions of the pharisees) for salvation. Following the commandments is the sanctification process. Yeshua said if you love me, follow my commandments. Scripture equates lawlessness to evil.

oral law?

so in 3:17 when i says THE LAW that came 430 years after abraham, was the oral law, from the pharisees who weren't even born yet?

17 This is what I mean: the law, which came 430 years afterward, does not annul a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to make the promise void.