If an afterlife exists

[pc_76]

That should sound unfair to everybody.

To create a being for whom the known outcome is unspeakable suffering... thats monstrous. No two ways around it.

There is the case this outcome specifically isn't determined at birth, but through growing in life it forms the path you take.

But yeah, that some people and perhaps the majority of people living now should go to a place of unspeakable suffering that I or anyone else won't wish upon their worst enemy should sound unfair for everybody. This is anything but love, and any person who believes it is fair that God does that bluntly lacks some empathy.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

For the same reason he would have died on the cross if evolution is not true. Didn't they teach you that in Sunday School?

I know why Jesus died on the cross. I was asking you for your opinion, seeing that you don't seem to believe in a literal Adam and Eve.

 

[Speedwell]

I know why Jesus died on the cross. I was asking you for your opinion, seeing that you don't seem to believe in a literal Adam and Eve.

Why should I have to? That we are sinners in need of redemption is fact of our present experience, not something we only learn about by assuming a literal interpretation of the "Garden" story.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Why should I have to? That we are sinners in need of redemption is fact of our present experience, not something we only learn about by assuming a literal interpretation of the "Garden" story.

In your opinion, why do we need redemption if there is no Adam and Eve and therefore nothing to be redeemed from?

 

[Tinker Grey]

I have a question. If evolution is true, even Theistic Evolution believed by many Christians, then why did Jesus die on the cross?

Not because Adam sinned, but because everyman sins.

 

[stevil]

In the unlikely event of there being an afterlife what will it be like? Would we be the same people we are here on earth or totally different? If someone passes into the afterlife as a child, will they stay as such, not growing into an adult? If a person has a disability or illness will they continue to suffer from it?

What do others think?

All very unanswerable questions, except that there is no evidence or mechanism in support of the concept. Why would we assume an afterlife, assume children and adults, assume "growing up" or not "growing up", why would we assume time, why assume health or sickness?

 

[Dan1988]

That should sound unfair to everybody.

To create a being for whom the known outcome is unspeakable suffering... thats monstrous. No two ways around it.

It may seem 'monstrous' or unfair from our narrow, corrupt human stand point.
Fallen, wicked mankind is in no position to question anything a perfectly righteous and good God.
It's actually a very grievous sin, to even accuse God of unrighteousness.

 

[durangodawood]

It may seem 'monstrous' or unfair from our narrow, corrupt human stand point.
Fallen, wicked mankind is in no position to question anything a perfectly righteous and good God.
It's actually a very grievous sin, to even accuse God of unrighteousness.

Is it a sin to accuse God of wickedness? It seem to me thats what youre doing.

 

[Rajni]

It may seem 'monstrous' or unfair from our narrow, corrupt human stand point.
Fallen, wicked mankind is in no position to question anything a perfectly righteous and good God.
It's actually a very grievous sin, to even accuse God of unrighteousness.

It seems that statements like this often come up when one is faced with having
to examine such things.

Any religion worth its salt can stand up to such scrutiny, so attempts to shut
down critical thinking with commentary on how grievous a sin it is to question
is disingenuous at best.

Not to mention that it's questioning a god-concept, not the god itself, the
existence of which isn't even absolutely certain.

Again, any god-concept promoting a belief in a deity that would create people
who that deity knows -- in advance through omniscience -- will end up
suffering in 'hell' for eternity is not based upon a god of love.

Such a god-concept doesn't even deserve the term 'god' it its title, as far as I'm
concerned. There's a word for it, but it's not 'god'.


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[Speedwell]

It seems that statements like this often come up when one is faced with having
to examine such things.

Any religion worth its salt can stand up to such scrutiny, so attempts to shut
down critical thinking with commentary on how grievous a sin it is to question
is disingenuous at best.

Not to mention that it's questioning a god-concept, not the god itself, the
existence of which isn't even absolutely certain.

Again, any god-concept promoting a belief in a deity that would create people
who that deity knows -- in advance through omniscience -- will end up
suffering in 'hell' for eternity is not based upon a god of love.

Such a god-concept doesn't even deserve the term 'god' it its title, as far as I'm
concerned. There's a word for it, but it's not 'god'.


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Ah, but think of how much enjoyment can be gotten by contemplating the eternal torture of one's enemies.

 

[Dan1988]

It seems that statements like this often come up when one is faced with having
to examine such things.

Any religion worth its salt can stand up to such scrutiny, so attempts to shut
down critical thinking with commentary on how grievous a sin it is to question
is disingenuous at best.

Not to mention that it's questioning a god-concept, not the god itself, the
existence of which isn't even absolutely certain.

Again, any god-concept promoting a belief in a deity that would create people
who that deity knows -- in advance through omniscience -- will end up
suffering in 'hell' for eternity is not based upon a god of love.

Such a god-concept doesn't even deserve the term 'god' it its title, as far as I'm
concerned. There's a word for it, but it's not 'god'.


-

Thank you for affirming my point, that wicked evil fallen man hates a perfectly righteous loving God. So it's only right that He should hate them and cast them into hell.
It's only natural for evil wicked sinners to accuse God of unrighteousness, Satan does this and all those who serve him do the same.

 

[Dan1988]

Is it a sin to accuse God of wickedness? It seem to me thats what youre doing.

Jesus warned us about scoffers and mockers, in the last days. He said they would call evil good and good evil, we can see this clearly in our days so we know the end is near.

 

[durangodawood]

Jesus warned us about scoffers and mockers, in the last days. He said they would call evil good and good evil, we can see this clearly in our days so we know the end is near.

You are the one turning good and evil upside down if you contend that creating a being for whom the known outcome is unspeakable suffering is somehow "good".

 

[Dan1988]

You are the one turning good and evil upside down if you contend that creating a being for whom the known outcome is unspeakable suffering is somehow "good".

Yes I believe that everything God does is good, even if it doesn't appeal to the most wicked creatures in the universe.
We will never understand God or His ways, because our hearts are wicked above all things and His is Holy above all things. Try to connect the dots if you can, but it's OK if you can't He can still forgive you if you fall on your face and repent.

 

[Rajni]

Thank you for affirming my point, that wicked evil fallen man hates a perfectly righteous loving God. So it's only right that He should hate them and cast them into hell.
It's only natural for evil wicked sinners to accuse God of unrighteousness, Satan does this and all those who serve him do the same.

Way to completely miss the point.
Kudos for trying, anyway.

 

[durangodawood]

Yes I believe that everything God does is good, even if it doesn't appeal to the most wicked creatures in the universe.
We will never understand God or His ways, because our hearts are wicked above all things and His is Holy above all things. Try to connect the dots if you can, but it's OK if you can't He can still forgive you if you fall on your face and repent.

You have outsourced your own moral compass to your particular reading of the Bible.

 

[Dan1988]

Way to completely miss the point.
Kudos for trying, anyway.

I didn't miss the point, I was just trying to explain why we shouldn't ever question anything God does.
If I answered the question, you wouldn't be able to process the answer because God's ways are infinitely higher then ours.

It would be something like a person who knows nothing about microsoft excel, asking a programmer to answer how they created a computer game, and the creator shows them the excel formula which has about 200 strange characters, which make no sense at all to them.

 

[Dan1988]

You have outsourced your own moral compass to your particular reading of the Bible.

God deliberately wrote the Bible, in a way that is foolishness to unbelievers. nobody can make any sense of it, unless God gives it to them.
There are many who think they have it figured out, but they have deceived themselves because they're carnal and the God's Word is spiritual.
If the Holy Spirit doesn't reveal the meaning of Holy Scripture, then it's impossible for anyone to understand it especially the highly educated 'smart people'.
God gave the Holy Scriptures to His chosen people only, it's foolishness to the reprobate.

 

[Speedwell]

God deliberately wrote the Bible, in a way that is foolishness to unbelievers. nobody can make any sense of it, unless God gives it to them.
There are many who think they have it figured out, but they have deceived themselves because they're carnal and the God's Word is spiritual.
If the Holy Spirit doesn't reveal the meaning of Holy Scripture, then it's impossible for anyone to understand it especially the highly educated 'smart people'.
God gave the Holy Scriptures to His chosen people only, it's foolishness to the reprobate.

Lucky you.

 

[Rajni]

I didn't miss the point, I was just trying to explain why we shouldn't ever question anything God does.

If you had gotten the point, you wouldn't have tried to
explain why we shouldn't ever question anything god
does.

Let me repeat: People here aren't questioning a god,
they're questioning a god-concept. Yes, Virginia, there
is a difference.

And even if you can't explain why the concept of god you
have chosen to believe includes the creation of people he
knows in advance will end up in hell forever, the fact
that you are comfortable not questioning it but instead
make it a firm belief to which you hold is concerning.
Why would that concept of divinity be preferable -- to
the point of not bothering to question it -- over another
concept of divinity whose ways truly would be higher
than man's ways? Why settle for "Good News" when
"Great News" might (and does) await further down
the road?

One will never know for sure if one gives up learning, figuring
they've got The Truth™ and there's nothing else to know.
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