I want to see timeline charts.....

TribulationSigns

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What does that have to do with what you said about extended 62 weeks....and skipping the cut off of the Messiah? The Cross was Messiah being cut off....and that is there in CG's illustration.

CG's illustration is not correct.

Daniel 9:26 KJV
[26] And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

The 69th week [7+62=69] ends with Messiah being cut off, not baptism. That is to say "After threescore and two weeks" shall Messiah be cut off. Nothing is said about baptism!

Anyway...let cut the chase and answer the question below per YOUR interpretation as you see why you have placed the confirmation of a covenant (verse 27) Before the fulfillment of Daniel 9:26.

1.) What year did Messiah the Prince cut off (Daniel 9:26a)? __________
2.) What year did the People of the Prince come and destroy the city (Daniel 9:26b)? ________
3.) What year did "he" confirm a covenant (Daniel 9:27a)? _________
 
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jgr

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Really, show me the example that God did both ways. Scripture, please.

Galatians 3
8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Fulfilled both physically and spiritually in Abraham and Christ.
 
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TribulationSigns

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Fulfilled both physically and spiritually in Abraham and Christ.

The problem is that some people just cannot get past today's geopolitical ideologies that pass for Christianity. They just can't get national Israel out of their mind. But the world cannot be blessed by a nation or kingdom that is so obviously antichrist, and has been for 2000 years. The world is blessed by a spiritual Israel, which is the true kingdom in Christ. And those who curse that Israel, are those God will curse.

Mark 11:9-10
  • "And they that went before, and they that followed, cried, saying, Hosanna; Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord:
  • Blessed be the kingdom of our father David, that cometh in the name of the Lord: Hosanna in the highest."

That's God's word. The Kingdom of Israel had come, and it is in Christ. He is the Blessed Israel of God.

One more time in case you missed it last time...
Consider the scriptures carefully, and without any preconceived ideas about people being blessed by a Physical Nation, and it is clear where the real blessings of the Children of God come by.

Hosea 11:1
  • "When Israel was a child, then I loved him, and called my son out of Egypt."

What Israel, as a Child, called out of Egypt, did this prophecy prefigure? Let scripture interpret scripture and the answer is, Christ, the "true" Israel of God, the true Son called out of Egypt. eg:

Matthew 2:15
  • "And was there until the death of Herod: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt have I called my son."

Is this word of prophesy fulfilled "true," or is it all something Christians made up? The Sword (which is the word of God) protrudes out of "what Israel's mouth?" Is it Christ, or the nation in the middle east?

Isaiah 49:2-3
  • "And he hath made my mouth like a sharp sword; in the shadow of his hand hath he hid me, and made me a polished shaft; in his quiver hath he hid me;
  • And said unto me, Thou art my servant, O Israel, in whom I will be glorified."

What Israel was God glorified in, that has a sword protrude from His mouth? We need to listen to the word of God and forsake Premillennialist / Dispensationalist teachers who contradict God. The fact is, the Kingdom of Israel has come, not will come. And Christ is the King and ruler of that Kingdom.

John 1:49
  • "Nathanael answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God; thou art the King of Israel."

Not will be, He was, is and will be the ruler of Israel, and we (true believers) are all the servants in this glorious kingdom of His. If you are waiting for Christ to establish a kingdom, you are missing out. Clearly, the Israel in view, in whom the nations of the world would be blessed, is Christ. It is not a country in the middle east. And the Israel of whom the nations will be cursed, who curse Him, is Christ. Not a nation in the middle east. He is the true Son, the Israel of God in whom the nations are blessed or cursed.

Matthew 25:39-40
  • "Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
  • And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me."
Matthew 25:44-46
  • "Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
  • Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
  • And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."

Bless Christ Israel, and be Blessed, curse Him and be cursed. Therein is the truth of the word.

Galatians 3:10
  • "For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them."
Galatians 3:8
  • "And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed."

Blessed and cursed through the Seed of Abraham. He is the Israel, which is Christ! In Him shall all the nations be Blessed.

Galatians 3:16-17
  • "Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
  • And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect."

The Covenant with Israel is with Abraham's Seed, which is Christ, in whom it is also confirmed.

Alot of Scripture for you to chew, huh?!
 
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jgr

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Nope.

These scriptures do not say that all the people of all nations will turn to Christ, nor does it speak of a golden age or of dominion theology. We really don't have to speculate. God has already revealed to us how all nations will be blessed in Christ. Not by becoming Christian nations, it "WAS" fulfilled in the gospel making Christians in all nations.

Galatians 3:8
  • "And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed."
It's not a mystery anymore. The nations are not deceived now because Christ was bound so that they could come into the house of faith.

Of course. It is fulfilled spiritually in those who come to Christ, as a result of Christ who came physically.

Both spiritual and physical fulfillments.
 
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jgr

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TribulationSigns

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Like in Daniel 9:24-27.

Time for me to take a break for the 4th of July weekend. I am done with this thread now that I can see that this thread is nothing but blind leading the blind. See ya!
 
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jgr

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Time for me to take a break for the 4th of July weekend. I am done with this thread now that I can see that this thread is nothing but blind leading the blind. See ya!

Come by anytime for more "things which become sound doctrine" (Titus 2:1).
 
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mlepfitjw

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I just believe what Jesus Christ told his disciples when He told the. They would not reach every house of Israel before he returned. Matthew 10:23. I also He came back spiritually, reinstating the world back to an edenic stage. (like the in the beginning with Adam and Eve) Which means we can have ease of access to God our father, in and through our belief in the Lord Jesus Christ because of his sacrifice for the whole world.

After the destruction of Jerusalem in 70ad. My belief is established in the fact of what Jesus Christ had said, and the letters of the revelation to the seven churches from revelation.

All the historical points are there if you look deep enough, I can’t go over them myself with you here. God bless, friend! Jesus Christ is the truth!
 
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claninja

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Well, go ahead, quote them. Prove it.

I bet that the verses you may quote won't even prove exactly how you think the New Covenant itself was confirmed. Take your time.

****there is not 1 proof text in all of the NT that declares Jesus fulfilled the 70th week at his first advent OR that a future antichrist will make a covenant for 1 week***

Daniel 9:27 And he shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week he shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come one who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on the desolator.

***There is only 1 proof text in the NT that quotes from daniel. and yet this "proof text is also highly debated*****

Matthew 24:15 “So when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand),

The evidence of the AOD points to the destruction of the 1st century temple based on the context of the olivet discourse.

Matthew 24:1-2 Jesus left the temple and was going away, when his disciples came to point out to him the buildings of the temple. But he answered them, “You see all these, do you not? Truly, I say to you, there will not be left here one stone upon another that will not be thrown down.”

However, the olivet discourse makes no mention of a 1 week or 7 year covenant in association with the destruction of the temple.



So we have to look at 2 things:
1.) the broader context of the 70 week prophecy
2.) evidence from the NT that declares anything from Daniel 9 as fulfilled or to be fulfilled in the future even if it doesn't directly quote daniel

Since I believe it fulfilled I will be posting from that position

1.) Broader context of 70 week prophecy:

the 70th week not only fulfills the 1 week covenant, but also puts and end to the sacrifices for the people of God. By the fulfillment of the 70th week, 6 other things have also been fulfilled: 1.) finish the transgression 2.) put an end to sin 3.) atone for iniquity 4.) bring in everlasing righteousness 5.) seal up vision and prophecy 6.) anoint most holy

Daniel 9:24 Seventy weeksc are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

Daniel 9:27 And he shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week he shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come one who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on the desolator.

2.) does the NT testament declare a confirmed covenant? Does the NT declare that animal sacficies are no more? Does the NT testament declare that the 6 points of daniel 9:24 have been fulfilled? Does the NT declare the AOD associated with a certain event

Yes.

Jesus confirmed the new covenant in his blood (Matthew 26:28)

Hebrews confirms animal sacrifices ended with Christ (hebrews 10:1-10, Hebrews 10:18)

The NT testament declares that the 1.) transgressions of the old covenant were removed for God's People (Hebrews 9:15) through Christ, 2.) that sin was put away (hebrews 9:26) through Christ, 3.) that sins were atoned for through Christ (hebrews 2:17-18), 4.) that Christ brought in everlasting righteousness, which has been imputed on those in Christ (romans 8:1-10), 5.) that vision and prophecy were fulfilled by Christ (Luke 24:44, Acts 3:24), that Jesus, the most holy, was anointed (acts 10:38).

The olivet discourse associates the AOD with the destruction of the 1st century temple. The destruction of the 1st century temple is not required for the fulfillment of the 6 points of Daniel 9:24, and therefore I would argue that it destruction falls outside of the 70th week.

Again, these are not proof texts, as there is not 1 single passage that delares the 70 weeks of daniel fulfilled or yet to be fulfilled in the future. This is only evidence in support of a fulfilled 70 weeks.


Can you provide NT evidence that declares a future 1 week covenant with an antichrist? can you provide evidence that sacrifices have not yet been done away with for God's peopel? Can you provide evidence that the 6 points of Daniel 9:24 are not yet fulfilled? Can you provide evidence that the AOD of of the olivet discourse is not in regards to the destruction of the 1st century temple?

 
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