....between a Jew who believe in Yeshua [aka Jesus] and follows the Christian faith and one who believes in Yeshua the Messiah, and keeps His Judaism.
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I think there is a big difference
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In this little corner of the world, there are two professing, yet worship differently and with different groups do they identify with. To these I speak of.
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Wesley1982
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The closest thing I would resemble would be a messianic jewish orthodox Christian.
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Wesley1982
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Basically, a Bible-believing Christian who confesses Jesus as Lord and Savior.
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HannibalFlavius
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I would say that one is a Jew and the other is not.
I hope that doesn't offend anyone too much, but I think about a scripture in Revelation.
Revelation 3:9
I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars--I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you.
I consider this scripture to be about both gentiles and Jews who claim to be Jews but are not.
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Pertaining to belief only, excluding the outcomes such as following Christianity or keeping Torah, what would be the difference between a Jew believing in Jesus as opposed to a Jew believing in Yeshua?
Don't both beliefs hold that Jesus or Yeshua had to die in order to atone and redeem their souls due to sin?
If not, why would it be necessary for the Jew to believe in Yeshua rather than just keep Torah and his or her Judaism?
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HannibalFlavius
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There is a difference between a Babylonian Messiah and a Jewish Messiah.
There is a difference between the Messiah/King of Jerusalem and the Messiah of another chosen city.
There is a difference between Babylonian Holy days and the Holy days of God.
There is a difference between a Messiah that is against the law of God and a Messiah who is for the law of God.
I say that Jesus is the head of a religion that is based on Gods law. I say his Holy city is Jerusalem. I say that Jesus is for the law and he never taught anyone not to keep the law. I say Jesus has traditions, Sabbaths, and rituals that are the same as God's traditions, Sabbaths, and rituals.
But some people would claim that Jesus is the head of a religion that is against God's laws. Some would say that Jerusalem is not God's Holy city and they would name another. Some would say that Jesus is the Messiah that has Babylonian Sabbaths, Traditions and rituals.
These two Messiahs do not act the same, they do not look the same, they do not have very much in common at all.
One is biblical and one is not.
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This could only be answered on an individual basis, but since people prefer to shove others into little boxes and label them, the question would never be posited that way.
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So then what is it about Yeshua's death that the Jew must believe on? Is it for redemption reasons? Yeshua was a first century Jew who followed Torah. Why shouldn't the Jew just follow his example by being Torah observant?
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Of course he does, but your question is loaded. You are judging the observance of the law by a standard that you have decided works for you. This has been flogged to death on this forum but at the end of the day, if a person is following the law as they understand it applies to them, you really can't judge them- they are another's servant, after all.
Rather than slag off at Jews who aren't "Jewish enough" for you by insinuating that they don't keep the law (which could well be a false assumption) try understanding that no one on this forum or elsewhere keeps all 613 mitzvot, including yourself.
Are we not sick of perpetually discussing the law? It looks to me that this forum has always been rather confused about it.
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