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I need help understanding this..

IDontKnow10

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:help:

I have seen time and time again people who are against gay marriage, say that gays shouldn't be allowed to marry because they can't have children. But if a man who cannot have children marries a woman (or vice versa), that is okay. If the purpose of getting married is to have a family then why are men and women who cannot have children allowed to marry? Could someone please explain this to me? :sigh:
 

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It's usually given as a generalization. A specific man and woman might not be able to have a child, but in general a man and a woman could have a child.

Whereas, in general a man and a man cannot have a child.

So a heterodox couple can be considered to be a family, and not a same sex couple.

Of course, I don't define a family by whether or not a couple can have a child but rather by emotional attachment, so that entire argument doesn't really work so well.
 
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KellyLeigh

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Actually more people are against gay marriage because marriage is a term derived from religion, and in Christianity along with other religions im sure, it clearly states that homosexuality is wrong. I'm against gay marriage because marriage is a religious term used for a man and a woman. They can go and have all the same tax rights as a married couple but call it something else. Marriage is a word for man and woman.


that's my opinion anyway.
 
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Q2004

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SparklnQTPrncess said:
Actually more people are against gay marriage because marriage is a term derived from religion, and in Christianity along with other religions im sure, it clearly states that homosexuality is wrong. I'm against gay marriage because marriage is a religious term used for a man and a woman. They can go and have all the same tax rights as a married couple but call it something else. Marriage is a word for man and woman.


that's my opinion anyway.

Terms Change.
 
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Electric Sceptic

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SparklnQTPrncess said:
Actually more people are against gay marriage because marriage is a term derived from religion, and in Christianity along with other religions im sure, it clearly states that homosexuality is wrong. I'm against gay marriage because marriage is a religious term used for a man and a woman. They can go and have all the same tax rights as a married couple but call it something else. Marriage is a word for man and woman.
Please provide some support for this claim (that 'marriage' is a term derived from religion).

Regardless of its origins, marriage today is NOT (exclusively) a religious term. If it were, atheists wouldn't be considered married. Marriage is a LEGAL term.
 
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SparklnQTPrncess said:
Actually more people are against gay marriage because marriage is a term derived from religion, and in Christianity along with other religions im sure, it clearly states that homosexuality is wrong. I'm against gay marriage because marriage is a religious term used for a man and a woman. They can go and have all the same tax rights as a married couple but call it something else. Marriage is a word for man and woman.


that's my opinion anyway.
What marriage has traditionally been throughout cultures and time spreads across a wide spectrum. What you're against is same-sex marriages that are condoned by your specific belief system. But the problem is that not everyone goes by your system, so we shouldn't have to play by your belief system's rules, and neither you ours. If gays are allowed the right to marry, nothing at all happens to your version of what marriage is/should be.
 
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Merlin

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Hi,

Marriage isn't about children.
Marriage came about after God created Adam.
Adam was in a perfect, sinless world.
God personally fellowshipped with Adam.
And God said:

Gen 2:18 The LORD God said,
"It is not good for the man to be alone.
I will make a helper suitable for him."

God designed woman to be that helper, not another man.
Children came later.

 
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Spherical Time

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SparklnQTPrncess said:
Actually more people are against gay marriage because marriage is a term derived from religion, and in Christianity along with other religions im sure, it clearly states that homosexuality is wrong. I'm against gay marriage because marriage is a religious term used for a man and a woman. They can go and have all the same tax rights as a married couple but call it something else. Marriage is a word for man and woman.


that's my opinion anyway.
It's interesting that you're pro-civil union.

I could agree with you, if only the government got out of the marriage game altogether, and left the term marriage completely to churches. "Separate but equal" never really seems to work out that way.
 
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Electric Sceptic

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Merlin said:
Hi,

Marriage isn't about children.
Marriage came about after God created Adam.
Adam was in a perfect, sinless world.
God personally fellowshipped with Adam.
And God said:

Gen 2:18 The LORD God said,
"It is not good for the man to be alone.
I will make a helper suitable for him."

God designed woman to be that helper, not another man.
Children came later.

That's nice. However, that's your religious opinion, and in a country NOT run by religion, it has no relevance to the question of legality whatsoever.
 
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stumpjumper

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I have personally never understood why Christians do not make a distinction between a legal marraige and a Christian marraige. '

When my wife and I got married we wanted to go to the Caribbean and have it performed on the beach. "No, you have to get married in a Church says her mom."

I agree with my mom-in-law now and I am glad we were married in a Church because it is something that I will always remember but that would be what I would call a Christian marraige. I honestly don't think you could really support a same-sex marraige from the Bible. It just is not something that you will find within.

Civil marraiges or unions are perfectly fine as far as I'm concerned.
 
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CCGirl

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Wow! Talk about revisionist history!:help:

Marriage is a legal term, not religious!

Marriage has been around for thousands and thousands of years.

It was usually done to preserve bloodlines or join familial allegiances.

"Love" within marriage is a relatively new concept.

Same-sex unions have been recorded for thousands of years, in every culture.




Luckily, I live in a country that believes in equality of all peoples, and thus we have equal marriage under the law!:)
 
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Harlan Norris

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IDontKnow10 said:
:help:

I have seen time and time again people who are against gay marriage, say that gays shouldn't be allowed to marry because they can't have children. But if a man who cannot have children marries a woman (or vice versa), that is okay. If the purpose of getting married is to have a family then why are men and women who cannot have children allowed to marry? Could someone please explain this to me? :sigh:
Mine was the generation that decided there was no need of marriage at all.Still,people got married.But with no spiritual authority guiding them,they were quickly divorced,usually with children.Now we have a real nightmare,with a 50% divorce rate.Men have children with two or three women,and no one cares for the children.The social upheaval,we caused by just saying that a couple ought to be able to do whatever they want,without considering God.Goes beyond anything anyone thought possible back then.No one knows now what will come out of gay marriage.However I feel this Godless act will be at least as bad.But that is just my opinion.
 
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Q2004

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Harlan Norris said:
Mine was the generation that decided there was no need of marriage at all.Still,people got married.But with no spiritual authority guiding them,they were quickly divorced,usually with children.Now we have a real nightmare,with a 50% divorce rate.Men have children with two or three women,and no one cares for the children.The social upheaval,we caused by just saying that a couple ought to be able to do whatever they want,without considering God.Goes beyond anything anyone thought possible back then.No one knows now what will come out of gay marriage.However I feel this Godless act will be at least as bad.But that is just my opinion.

Thanks for expressing your opinion. Now please watch as every non-christian ignores it.
 
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seebs

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I think it's mostly just ahistorical. Marriage predates any of the world religions, and is a thing people add to religions that don't have it. Church marriages as we know them today are an innovation; I think they only became widespread in the 1100s.

The problem is not people not thinking about God, the problem is people making more and more excuses for divorce. Honestly, one of the prime offenders would have to be the various Christian groups that have huge lists of reasons for which a marriage would be invalid, which are used as excuses to get out of it. Spouse having a crisis of faith, or lost it entirely? Dump him.
 
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outlaw

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IDontKnow10 said:
:help:

I have seen time and time again people who are against gay marriage, say that gays shouldn't be allowed to marry because they can't have children. But if a man who cannot have children marries a woman (or vice versa), that is okay. If the purpose of getting married is to have a family then why are men and women who cannot have children allowed to marry? Could someone please explain this to me? :sigh:

Well that is “DIFFERENT”





Just how it is different or why t should be different is never actually explained….but I have been assured multiple times it is actually different.
 
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outlaw

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Harlan Norris said:
Mine was the generation that decided there was no need of marriage at all.Still,people got married.But with no spiritual authority guiding them,they were quickly divorced,usually with children.Now we have a real nightmare,with a 50% divorce rate.Men have children with two or three women,and no one cares for the children.The social upheaval,we caused by just saying that a couple ought to be able to do whatever they want,without considering God.Goes beyond anything anyone thought possible back then.No one knows now what will come out of gay marriage.However I feel this Godless act will be at least as bad.But that is just my opinion.
Which doesn’t explain why conservative Christians have the highest divorce rates and Atheists the lowest.

Baptists – 29% divorce rate

Mainline protestants - 25% divorce rate

Athiest/agnostic – 21% divorce rate



Barna Research Group 1999-DEC-21 http://www.barna.org/cgi-bin/



BTW the Barna research also shows the 50% divorce rate is a fabrication the average divorce rate is less than 25 %.
 
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Harlan Norris

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outlaw said:
Which doesn’t explain why conservative Christians have the highest divorce rates and Atheists the lowest.

Baptists – 29% divorce rate

Mainline protestants - 25% divorce rate

Athiest/agnostic – 21% divorce rate



Barna Research Group 1999-DEC-21 http://www.barna.org/cgi-bin/



BTW the Barna research also shows the 50% divorce rate is a fabrication the average divorce rate is less than 25 %.
Just being part of a congegation does not make one a believing Christian.The ability to say one thing and do another is the result of a failier of faith.Back when I was a kid,people did fear God.They stayed married come hell or high water.They raised up their kids from birth,all the way out the door.This looked pretty ugly to my generation.We said no way am I going through that.This outbreak of homosexuality is the direct result of what we did.Men used women like harlots then discarded them.Women in turn became feminists, saying "a woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle".In time the sexes literally hated one another.No one could trust anyone.No relationship had any credibility.People still got together and had children.They were placed in day care and raised by television.They looked at our example and said, No way am I going through that.
 
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Spherical Time

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Harlan Norris said:
Just being part of a congegation does not make one a believing Christian.The ability to say one thing and do another is the result of a failier of faith.Back when I was a kid,people did fear God.They stayed married come hell or high water.They raised up their kids from birth,all the way out the door.This looked pretty ugly to my generation.We said no way am I going through that.This outbreak of homosexuality is the direct result of what we did.Men used women like harlots then discarded them.Women in turn became feminists, saying "a woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle".In time the sexes literally hated one another.No one could trust anyone.No relationship had any credibility.People still got together and had children.They were placed in day care and raised by television.They looked at our example and said, No way am I going through that.
If I understand this post, it indicates that while atheists say they are against God, they are actually more God-fearing than the bulk of the population.

Further, homosexuality is somehow the result of heterosexual sex.
 
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seebs

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For what it's worth, many Christians do in fact distinguish between civil and church marriage. I think it's the only way to be true to our teachings. The government cannot create a "marriage" in the religious sense, and nor can they keep people from creating one.

My church does not consider all legal marriages relevant, nor are all marriages my church recognizes legally binding.
 
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