I may give evolution a shot.

[Arikay]

Oh, I also find it ironic that someone who has the 10 commandments in their sig, especially the 9th one, quotes AIG for evidence.

 

[Jaci Fan]

I think it's pretty safe to conclude that Jacy Fan has no idea what biological evolution actually is.

Jacy Fan, you're welcome to your beliefs, but do you really think it is wise to reject a large facet of modern biology without understanding what it is first? Doesn't the Bible say something about willful ignorance?

hey whats up

 

[Jaci Fan]

Oh, I also find it ironic that someone who has the 10 commandments in the sig, especially the 9th one, quotes AIG for evidence.

silly goose

 

[Arikay]

Yep your right, they are a silly goose.

 

[Jaci Fan]

Yep your right, they are a silly goose.

hehe

 

[Pete Harcoff]

Wait a second...

Are Arikay and Jacy Fan... the same person?!?

I think we've all been had... darn you Arikay.

 

[Jaci Fan]

Wait a second...

Are Arikay and Jacy Fan... the same person?!?

I think we've all been had... darn you Arikay.

lol say what? silly silly

 

[Arikay]

LoL, I wish. That would mean my connection was fast enough that this forum didn't take ages to load a page.

Wait a second...

Are Arikay and Jacy Fan... the same person?!?

I think we've all been had... darn you Arikay.

 

[MoonlessNight]

what do people benefit from the false religion of evolution?
well they are left stumped with the silly notion their ancesters were vine swingers, and they left with a theory that has never, can never, and will NEVER be proven

God has already proved himself Real

Evolution hasn't!

I can't understand why anyone believes the theory of gravity either. After all science hasn't prooved it and can't proove it. Obviously, God is holding us down to make sure we aren't flung off the planet. Do you believe in the religion of Christianity or the religion of gravity?

 

[Jaci Fan]

Ok I gotta go now God Bless guys I had fun really
stay out of them trees ya here!

One Love in Jesus!

seriously give God a chance! do it tonight! seek him with all your heart and strengh, cry out to the Almighty! I promise you if you seek him you will find him, I did

God promises you will find him in the Bible!
seek and you will find, ask and you shall receive, knock and the door will be opened

but you gotta do those things! and start tonight!

Peace out! God Loves ya!


in all seriousness.. Creation itself shows us that we have a creator

it takes more faith to believe Nothing created us !!

God has proven himself to us through creation and through us personally if you come before God and humbly ask him to come into your heart and show you he is real, he will!

believing in God and his creation is to believe the obvious
to believe in theorys of evolution is to hurt your brain

People benefit from God and see how Real he is when he Becomes Real to them and supernaturally changes them. In turn people have no more doubts in their mind the God created the world

what do people benefit from the false religion of evolution?
well they are left stumped with the silly notion their ancesters were vine swingers, and they left with a theory that has never, can never, and will NEVER be proven

God has already proved himself Real

Evolution hasn't!

Here are some wise words from some respected men of science: "Evolution is a fairy tale for grown-ups. This Theory has helped nothing in progress of science. It is useless." (Professor Louis Bounoure, Director of Research, National center of scientific Research). Evolution is unproved and unprovable." (Sir Author Keith, he wrote the foreword to the 100th edition of, Origin of the species). "Scientists who go about teaching that evolution is a fact of life are great con-men, and the story they are telling may be the greatest hoax ever." (Dr. T. N. Tahmisian, Atomic Energy Commission, USA).


You can't prove evolution. It is something you have to accept by "faith." You have believed what you have heard. You have seen and had faith in evolutionary drawings of reverse osteoporosis. Charles Darwin (the founding father of the faith) said: "I was a young man with unformed ideas. I threw out queries, suggestions, wondering all the time over everything; and to my astonishment the ideas took like wildfire. People made a religion out of them!" They still do. Their language is the language of faith. The use words like ?believing, assuming, surmising, suspecting, possibly..." Evolution can only be accepted on blind faith...because it cannot be proven.

On the other hand, You can prove God's existence. A building is proof that there was a builder. A painting is absolute proof that there was a painter. You don't need to see him to see he exists. His painting is all the evidence you need. It wouldn't be there if he didn't exist. Creation proves absolutely that there was a Creator. there wouldn't be a creation if there wasn't a Creator. A child could understand that.

You can also prove that the bible is Gods supernatural revelation to man. All you have to do is study the irrefutable evidence of the bible prophecy (see Matthew 24, Luke 21, 2 Timothy 3, Ezekiel 38-40, Joel 2, ect.).

Who Then made God

God (like space) has neither beginning or end. He created time and subjected man to it and because we are subjected to time, logic demands that everything must have a beginning and a end. However, God dwells outside of time, in "eternity." Again, you can prove this by studying Bible prophecy, and seeing how God knows the beginning of time from the end.

The theory of evolution of the Coca Cola can.

Billions of years ago, a big bang produced a large rock. As the rock cooled, sweet brown liquid formed on its surface. As time passed, aluminum formed itself into a can, a lid, and a tab. Millions of years later, red and white paint fell from the sky, and formed itself into the words "Coca Cola 12 fluid ounces."

Of course, my theory is an insult to your intellect, because you know that if the Coca Cola can is made, there must be a maker. If it is designed, there must be a designer. The alternative, that it happened by chance or accident, is to move into an intellectual free zone.

Albert Einstein said,

"Everyone who is seriously interested in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that a spirit is manifest in the laws of the universe?a spirit vastly superior to man, and one in the face of which our modest powers must feel humble."

Charles Darwin said,
"To suppose that the eye could have been formed by natural selection, seems I freely confess, absurd in the highest degree."

If man cannot begin to make a human eye, how could anyone in his right mind think that eyes formed by mere chance? In fact, man cannot make anything from nothing. We don't know how to do it. We can re-create, reform, develop . . . but we cannot create even one grain of sand from nothing. Yet, the eye is only a small part of the most sophisticated part of creation-the human body.

If the Bible is Gods Word, you have a big problem. It maintains that God has set aside a Day in which He will judge the world in righteousness. The standard with which he will judge the world is the Ten Commandments. Let's see if you have broken any of then: 1.Is God first in your life? Do you love Him with all your heart, mind, soul and strength? 2.Have you made a God in your own image to suit your self? 3. Have you ever used Gods holy name in vain (substituting it for a four-lettered filth word to express disgust)? 4. Have you kept the Sabbath day holy? 5. Have you always honored your parents implicitly? 6. Have you hated anyone? Then the Bible says you are a murderer. 7. Have you had sex before marriage? Then you are a fornicator and cannot enter Heaven. Have you lusted after another person? The Bible warns, "Whoever looks on a woman to lust after her has committed adultery with her in his heart." 8. Have you ever stolen something (irrespective of the value)? Then you are a thief. 9. If you have told a lie (including "White" lies), then you are a liar and cannot enter the Kingdom of God. 10. Have you ever desired something that belonged to someone else? Then you have broken the tenth commandment. On judgment day you will be found guilty, and end up in hell forever...something God doesn't want to happen.

Each of us stand guilty of breaking Gods law, but because Jesus paid our fine on the Cross 2,000 years ago, God will forgive us on the grounds of his suffering death, "God Commended His love toward us in that while we were yet sinners Christ Died for us," Don't let evolutionists make a monkey out of you. You are of great value to God. Through the Cross, He revealed His great love for us. Then He rose from the dead, and defeated death. If you repent, and trust in the savior, God will grant you everlasting life in heaven. Pray something like this now: "Dear God, I have broken your law. Please forgive me. I put my trust in Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior. I will read the Bible and obey what I read. In Jesus Name. Amen."

 

[David Gould]

silly silly

I think that says it all, really.

Any five modern biologists who deny evolution. Or a definition of evolution. Please. Just to be fair. After all, we have tried to answer some of your questions. How about you answer one or two of ours?

 

[dctalkexp]

Isn't it amazing that it would only take a paragraph to do, yet it will be dodged time and time again. Makes you wonder if they really know what they are talking about or if they just want to appear like they know.

Evolutionary theory states that all life has a common ancestor. That by anomalies in the DNA, all life has developed by small changes over millions of years. Some mechanisms proposed by evolutionary theory are mutations shaped by natural selection, genetic drift.. gene flow. It states that since "simpler" or smaller organisms appear at the lower part of strata, and the more "complex" ones at the top, that this is concrete evidence for the theory.

 

[lucaspa]

evolutionist dont believe in God

That is not the case. At least half the evolutionary biologists in history have believed in God, starting with Darwin at the time he wrote Origin of the Species.
1. Look at all the Christian denominations that accept evolution:
http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/articles/4650_statements_from_religious_orga_3_13_2001.asp
2. http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/evolution/religion/faith/discuss_01.html
Panel delivers own faith statements: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/evolution/religion/faith/statement_01.html

Finally, check out the book Finding Darwin's God. Evolution has no more effective defender today than Dr. Kenneth Miller, professor of biology at Colorado U.
"I find a way [at the end of his class on evolutionary biology] to make it clear that I do not regard evolution, properly understood, as either anti-religious or anti-spiritual. ... There are always a few who find me after class and want to pin me down. Usually they ask me point-blank, 'Do you believe in God.' And one-on-one, I carefully tell them, "Yes" Puzzled, they ask what kind of God? Over the years, I have struggled to come up with a simple but precise answer to that question. Eventually I found it.
"I ask my inquiring students to reread the final chapter of Darwin's On the Origin of Species. ... I hope to make the point that my beliefs do not depend upon a flaw of evidence or logic in The Origin. ... What kind of God do I believe in? I believe in Darwin's God." Finding Darwin's God, pg 291-292.

who the heck created all this beautiful world!!

God. He created by evolution. Jaci, evolution is a how God created. Not an alternative to God creating.

Nothing? tke a look around at all the stars, the sun the moon the clouds, trees, mountians, animals, humans, plants, flowers, you name it, its all beautiful, its all perfectly designed, our human features all have a purpose ..

This attitude will get you in trouble. It's why Christians were so happy to dump special creation and embrace evolution in the 1800s. Unfortunately, biological organisms are not "perfectly designed". Including us. To have this attitude ends up in some pretty nasty conclusions as to what God is like.

Take God at his word and see that he is REAL

Taking God at His word does not mean taking a literal interpretation of Genesis 1-3.

 

[lucaspa]

Evolutionary theory states that all life has a common ancestor. That by anomalies in the DNA, all life has developed by small changes over millions of years. Some mechanisms proposed by evolutionary theory are mutations shaped by natural selection, genetic drift.. gene flow. It states that since "simpler" or smaller organisms appear at the lower part of strata, and the more "complex" ones at the top, that this is concrete evidence for the theory.

Pretty close. Evolution is "descent with modification". The modifications that lead to design are done by natural selection acting on variations among individuals. Most of those variations are by sexual recombination. Some are by mutations -- errors in copying DNA.

And yes, that more primitive organisms are found before more derived ones (using the terms simpler and complex is not good) in the fossil record is one area of support for evolution. The transitional series withing the fossil record are even more concrete evidence.

However, most of the evidence for evolution comes from living organisms.

 

[David Gould]

Evolutionary theory states that all life has a common ancestor. That by anomalies in the DNA, all life has developed by small changes over millions of years. Some mechanisms proposed by evolutionary theory are mutations shaped by natural selection, genetic drift.. gene flow. It states that since "simpler" or smaller organisms appear at the lower part of strata, and the more "complex" ones at the top, that this is concrete evidence for the theory.

Hooray! Excellent.

 

[lucaspa]

Jacii, I'm assuming you will come back and check this thread again, so I'm going to spend some time answering you.

seriously give God a chance! do it tonight! seek him with all your heart and strengh, cry out to the Almighty! I promise you if you seek him you will find him, I did

Jaci, EVOLUTION IS NOT ATHEISM. Never has been. I hope you check up on the Christian denominations that have accepted evolution. They make up about 75% of Christians.

Creation itself shows us that we have a creator

No, personal experience of deity shows that there is a deity. For Judeo-Christians, the creation of ancient Israel out of nothing showed them that there was a Creator. It created Israel as a nation.

Speaking purely from science now, that there is a universe shows the possibility that there was a Creator. It doesn't show there was one absolutely. It shows there may be one.

it takes more faith to believe Nothing created us !!

I'm not sure how you quantify "faith", but it certainly does take faith to believe absolutely that the universe was not created.

God has proven himself to us through creation and through us personally

I'd agree to the second. However, that "proof" isn't valid for someone without the personal experience. So you have to cut atheists some slack. Their personal experience shows no experience of God.

But in creation God has not left us indisputable proof of His existence.It is that "proof" that creationists want but can't have.

In turn people have no more doubts in their mind the God created the world

Jaci, this is not about whether God created the world. It's about how. Did God create in 6 days 6,000 years ago? Did God create by zapping species into existence one by one? Or did God create by the material processes discovered by science? Jaci, while wanting people to believe in God, it is ironic that you believe the basic statement of faith of atheism: natural = without God.

what do people benefit from the false religion of evolution?

1. Evolution isn't a religion.
2. Accepting evolution benefits you by:
a. Giving you the truth of how God created.
b. Getting God off the horrible hook of special creation.
c. Letting you read Genesis 1-3 for the theological messages it was meant to convey.

well they are left stumped with the silly notion their ancesters were vine swingers, and they left with a theory that has never, can never, and will NEVER be proven

God has already proved himself Real

Evolution hasn't!

In the way you are using the word "proven", evolution has. We have observed new species arising from old species by natural selection. QED.

Here are some wise words from some respected men of science: "Evolution is a fairy tale for grown-ups. This Theory has helped nothing in progress of science. It is useless." (Professor Louis Bounoure, Director of Research, National center of scientific Research). Evolution is unproved and unprovable." (Sir Author Keith, he wrote the foreword to the 100th edition of, Origin of the species).

This is the problem of using quotes as Argument from Authority. THese are made-up. http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/ce/3/part12.html for Bounoure

I have the 100th Anniversary edition of Origin. Keith didn't write the Foreward. This one was made up out of whole cloth.

You can't prove evolution. It is something you have to accept by "faith." You have believed what you have heard.

No one "believes" scientific theories. You accept them as (provisionally) true based on the evidence.

You have seen and had faith in evolutionary drawings of reverse osteoporosis.

Jaci, I have worked in bone research for 25 years. Do you even know what osteoporosis is? It is a loss of bone with aging, in postmenopausal women, in those with high steroid use, or with disuse of the bones. Reversing that process is one of the hot areas of bone research. It has nothing to do with evolution.

On the other hand, You can prove God's existence. A building is proof that there was a builder. A painting is absolute proof that there was a painter. You don't need to see him to see he exists.

This is the Argument from Design. However, Darwin invalidated the argument when he discovered an unintelligent process that gives design -- natural selection. Humans now use natural selection to design when the design is too tough for them.
"It is unremarkable that a microprocessor can perform such a task--except in this case. Even though the circuit consists of only a small number of basic components, the researcher, Adrian Thompson, does not know how it works. He can't ask the designer because there wasn't one. Instead, the circuit evolved from a "primordial soup" of silicon components guided by the principles of genetic variation and survival of the fittest. "
http://www.newscientist.com/nsplus/insight/ai/primordial.html

The theory of evolution of the Coca Cola can.

Billions of years ago, a big bang produced a large rock. As the rock cooled, sweet brown liquid formed on its surface. As time passed, aluminum formed itself into a can, a lid, and a tab. Millions of years later, red and white paint fell from the sky, and formed itself into the words "Coca Cola 12 fluid ounces."

Of course, my theory is an insult to your intellect, because you know that if the Coca Cola can is made, there must be a maker. If it is designed, there must be a designer. The alternative, that it happened by chance or accident, is to move into an intellectual free zone. [;quote]

The problem is that natural selection is not chance or accident. The selection part of it is the exact opposite of chance; it is pure determinism. In this case we know the Coca Cola can is a manufactured artifact because there is no process in the universe that will make one.

However, for galaxies, planets, life, and the diversity of life we do know there are processes in the universe that will make them: gravity, chemistry, and evolution by natural selection. Therefore we can't infer that they are manufactured artifacts.

Charles Darwin said,
"To suppose that the eye could have been formed by natural selection, seems I freely confess, absurd in the highest degree."

False witness. You must go to the rest of the quote:
"When it was first said that the sun stood still and the world turned round, the common sense of mankind declared the doctrine false; but the old saying of Vox populi, vox Dei ["the voice of the people = the voice of God "], as every philosopher knows, cannot be trusted in science. Reason tells me, that if numerous gradations from a simple and imperfect eye to one complex and perfect can be shown to exist, each grade being useful to its possessor, as is certain the case; if further, the eye ever varies and the variations be inherited, as is likewise certainly the case; and if such variations should be useful to any animal under changing conditions of life, then the difficulty of believing that a perfect and complex eye could be formed by natural selection, should not be considered as subversive of the theory."

So much for trying to abuse Darwin as against his own theory. SHAME ON YOU! You have the 10 Commandments in your signature. Read #9 again. Then go ask God for forgiveness.

If the Bible is Gods Word, you have a big problem. It maintains that God has set aside a Day in which He will judge the world in righteousness. The standard with which he will judge the world is the Ten Commandments.

Then you are the one with the big problem, aren't you, Jaci? However, the Bible also says that God forgives if you ask and you don't repeat the sin. So there's hope for you.

 

[David Gould]

Evolutionary theory states that all life has a common ancestor. That by anomalies in the DNA, all life has developed by small changes over millions of years. Some mechanisms proposed by evolutionary theory are mutations shaped by natural selection, genetic drift.. gene flow. It states that since "simpler" or smaller organisms appear at the lower part of strata, and the more "complex" ones at the top, that this is concrete evidence for the theory.

Okay.

I am assuming that you disagree with the following:

1.) that all life has a common ancestor;
2.) that all life developed by small changes;
3.) that there has been millions of years for the changes to take place in; and
4.) that the fossil record is evidence, concrete or otherwise, for the theory.

Am I correct?

 

[Cantuar]

I thought you could get everday, Facts that all scientists believe in, and is known as a fact to most, creationists, and evolutionists. And see which it would support. You failed to do so(but I did not read the links yet in your above post)

Just go to your local library and look at a few months worth of back issues of Science and Nature. Browse through some Scientific American magazines and some Discover magazines. Have a look at the New Scientist website and read the news that shows up every day. Ditto for the Science-Nature page at the BBC website. Evolution is central and crucial to the biological sciences and creationism is just a political nuisance.

 

[Risen Tree]

Guys, take a look at my post in this thread: http://www.christianforums.com/t37629

Be warned, it's sketchy but should provide you with some nice comic relief.

 

[armed2010]

I think we won the battle