I don't care if you think abortion is wrong.

[LonesomeTexan]

from conception, if given the chance, the single cell will develop into a human being. while it's hard to get emotionally attached to a blob of cells until they start to take on human form, I believe that single cell has the right to naturally develop into it's human form. to medically change or alter it's course of development I believe to be morally wrong.

 

[Tommy2008]

I don't think God regards you as a human being until you are capable of regarding yourself as anything

I don't think God regards you as a human being until you are capable of regarding yourself as anything

You absolutely must be joking with this statement! That is beyond absurd. Please explain.

 

[Lisa0315]

I don't think God regards you as a human being until you are capable of regarding yourself as anything

That is not what Scripture says.

God knew us before the foundation of the Earth.

Lisa

 

[EnemyPartyII]

Yes.

Why is that wrong? That's when a human being begins. When we start to grow as an individual organism.

I don't get why there's any dispute about this, especially coming from the science community. Life begins at conception. This is a truism!

life, yes... but is it a person?

So, does this mean that you believe that all forms of chemical contraception are as bad as abortion?

 

[EnemyPartyII]

from conception, if given the chance, the single cell will develop into a human being. while it's hard to get emotionally attached to a blob of cells until they start to take on human form, I believe that single cell has the right to naturally develop into it's human form. to medically change or alter it's course of development I believe to be morally wrong.

except that naturally... some 80% of them end up spontaneously aborting anyway

 

[EnemyPartyII]

That is not what Scripture says.

God knew us before the foundation of the Earth.

Lisa

so... he regards as people BEFORE we are conceived? That makes the whole matter about naturally aborting embryos really complicated... does God know all of them as people too? Or is it just the ones that are going to go on to be born? But if thats the case, whats different about medical abortion?

Bumper sticker length Bible quotes rarely solve an issue, and in this case, I think you just made it way worse

 

[EnemyPartyII]

I don't think God regards you as a human being until you are capable of regarding yourself as anything

You absolutely must be joking with this statement! That is beyond absurd. Please explain.

What's absurd about it? I don't believe you are a person until you are self aware. I don't believe that God considers you a person until you are self aware either.

Souls? I think they probably grow and develop along with your sentience... I don't think the soul arives as a fully formed, adult thin the instant of conception... but this can all only ever be opinion, of course, since its totally undetectable either way.

 

[Lisa0315]

so... he regards as people BEFORE we are conceived? That makes the whole matter about naturally aborting embryos really complicated... does God know all of them as people too? Or is it just the ones that are going to go on to be born? But if thats the case, whats different about medical abortion?

Bumper sticker length Bible quotes rarely solve an issue, and in this case, I think you just made it way worse

How did I make it worse? Do you know what is one of the most common phrases in Scripture? It is the "slaying of innocent blood". It is one of the 7 things that God hates. It is why as Christians, we must embrace life and find alternatives to death.

I have mixed feelings about contraception from a Spritual pov, but I would listen to a case in which a person was convicted to not use contraception. I would respect someone who had such a great faith.

Abortion has always been with us since the dawn of time. I would like to think that we have progressed to a point where children are our greatest hope and asset rather than as disposable as the diapers they wear. Why do we make it easier to dispose of life rather than make it harder? How is this progress for a society?

Lisa

 

[Lisa0315]

What's absurd about it? I don't believe you are a person until you are self aware. I don't believe that God considers you a person until you are self aware either.

Souls? I think they probably grow and develop along with your sentience... I don't think the soul arives as a fully formed, adult thin the instant of conception... but this can all only ever be opinion, of course, since its totally undetectable either way.

You think? Do you really risk the lives of the unborn on what you think? You have no evidence, nothing. Scripture points to the soul being before the foundation of the world. Even so, at what point that babe gains the soul is unknown. Don't you think it is worth erring on the side of caution? Would you destroy a soul only on the basis of a personal theory?

Lisa

 

[EnemyPartyII]

How did I make it worse? Do you know what is one of the most common phrases in Scripture? It is the "slaying of innocent blood". It is one of the 7 things that God hates. It is why as Christians, we must embrace life and find alternatives to death.

I have mixed feelings about contraception from a Spritual pov, but I would listen to a case in which a person was convicted to not use contraception. I would respect someone who had such a great faith.

Abortion has always been with us since the dawn of time. I would like to think that we have progressed to a point where children are our greatest hope and asset rather than as disposable as the diapers they wear. Why do we make it easier to dispose of life rather than make it harder? How is this progress for a society?

Lisa

you didn't really answer my question there lisa... if God knows us as people from conception or before conception... whats the go with all the millions of naturally occuring abortions occuring every day?

And, if you want to talk about things God hates, I assume you are using the Bible as a source? Then why is it, that the only time the Bible comes even vaguely close to mentioning abortion, it considers it a considerably lesser offence than murder?

 

[EnemyPartyII]

You think? Do you really risk the lives of the unborn on what you think? You have no evidence, nothing. Scripture points to the soul being before the foundation of the world. Even so, at what point that babe gains the soul is unknown. Don't you think it is worth erring on the side of caution? Would you destroy a soul only on the basis of a personal theory?

Lisa

Um... actually the Bible and Talmudic law say you aren't a person until you draw your first breath...

Souls are eternal once they're created, killing someone doesn't destroy their soul, thats rather the whole point OF souls...

And sure I think its worth erring on the side of caution... 've repeatedly said I don't generally approve of abortion. But if the foetus doesn't care about dying, I don't see why anyone else should get so worked up about it.

 

[Lisa0315]

you didn't really answer my question there lisa... if God knows us as people from conception or before conception... whats the go with all the millions of naturally occuring abortions occuring every day?

And, if you want to talk about things God hates, I assume you are using the Bible as a source? Then why is it, that the only time the Bible comes even vaguely close to mentioning abortion, it considers it a considerably lesser offence than murder?

Slaying of innocent blood is murder.

Lisa

 

[Avatar]

life, yes... but is it a person?

So, does this mean that you believe that all forms of chemical contraception are as bad as abortion?

I don't know. I'll be honest.

I believe life begins at conception, all other measures are subjective.

Do other means of birth control result in abortion? I just don't know. If yes, then they too are wrong. They too are killing a human being.

I seriously don't get how any human being cannot believe they began at conception. That's when you became you. That's when you started. And you grew from there.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

I don't know. I'll be honest.

I believe life begins at conception, all other measures are subjective.

Do other means of birth control result in abortion? I just don't know. If yes, then they too are wrong. They too are killing a human being.

I seriously don't get how any human being cannot believe they began at conception. That's when you became you. That's when you started. And you grew from there.

my physical body began growing from there... but "I" did not become an entity until considerably later.

And well, so you know, you now apparently consider something like 80% of Western women as abortionists, since chemical contraceptions works precisely by stopping a fertilised embryo from implanting

 

[Avatar]

my physical body began growing from there... but "I" did not become an entity until considerably later.

And well, so you know, you now apparently consider something like 80% of Western women as abortionists, since chemical contraceptions works precisely by stopping a fertilised embryo from implanting

That's not something that wins an argument with me. Its something that I find crushingly horrific.

Is it true? I thought the pill stopped ovulation, are you saying it stops implantation of a fertilized egg?

 

[Texas Lynn]

I agree, offering free birthcontrol (whether its the pill, patch or condom) along with education, would go along way to reducing the need for abortions.

This is something many individuals who are anti-abortion willingly state and yet it is consistently opposed by the antiabortion groups.

 

[Texas Lynn]

Frankly, I do not understand the opinions of the pro-choicers.

We recognize social problems cannot be solved merely by passing a law against them, and in this case, criminalizing abortion does not solve the problem, it merely makes life more difficult for women who in other circumstances would obtain abortions. Indeed, research indicates abortion rates in the brief period when abortion was criminalized in the United States (FYI, to protect the woman due to the fact the procedure was unsafe for her previously, not due to any belief a fetus was a person) that abortion occurred at basically the same rate as it does now.

What kind of country do we have if we kill our children????? That kind of horrifies me.

Abortion has occurred as long as pregnancy has. It is certainly nothing new. One might as well ask also what sort of country would prohit abortion by civil authority and what kind of government would declare emminent domain over women's bodies? Not a just one, that is for certain.

Jesus Christ Himself would not condone abortion.

One should be circumspect in declaring certain knowledge of "WWJD?". There is certainly no evidence in the Bible for that opinion.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

That's not something that wins an argument with me. Its something that I find crushingly horrific.

Is it true? I thought the pill stopped ovulation, are you saying it stops implantation of a fertilized egg?

yep. As do copper sevens, Implanon, and breast feeding.

 

[Texas Lynn]

could someone please explain to me how abortion is protected under the fourth amendment? the Roe V. Wade decision is perhaps one of the most disturbing supreme court decisions in US history. How our founding document could be interpreted the way the court ruled is beyond me.

If the right to privacy does not include the right to control one's own body it is meaningless.

What is disturbing is that government in a supposedly free society would claim title to a woman's uterus by legislative fiat.

It is no coincidence that two regimes which vigorously enforced legal prohibition of abortion were Nazi Germany and Romania under the Ceaucesceau Regime. In contrast those countries with official pro-choice policies include the most progressive Western democracies.

 

[Avatar]

yep. As do copper sevens, Implanon, and breast feeding.

Ah. Glad to see what consideration this is worth. I've had 6 kids conceived while mom was breastfeeding.