I am curious .........

[CCWoody]

I forgive you......

You forgive me for rembering that you screamed explitives at me via personal messages.

Golly, but that sure is nice of you.

 

[rnmomof7]

MOD HAT



This is a non debate area.. Take it to General Theology or Soteriology

 

[Cajun Huguenot]

All I have ever done is ask you people to back up your religious theories with credible Biblical evidence, none of you have ever done that.....

That is not exactly true, but we can move on anyway. I will repeat what I said above:
"If you want to DISCUSS Calvinism I will be happy to do so (if you can be polite). Read this threads on On Romans 9:14-20, Christians and perseverance, Pa-pa Becnel, Salvation and Theology. I wrote them and will be happy to discuss them with you. You don't have to agree with any of it, but you can['t] just come in HERE and blast away. FOLLOW the RULES."

Dominus vobiscum,
Kenith

 

[mannysee]

There was also a lot of prayer for healing in my church, too. This was not a problem. What was a problem and one of the many things which turned my stomach was that, after prayers were given for one man and a healing was claimed and not delivered by God, it was decided by some that the man was simply possessed and some of them decided to do something about it.

I guess that if God doesn't slink up and do what man commands then it must be because man is possessed. It couldn't be that God's answer was "No!"

Woody,

that is an awful experience, people saying the man must have been possessed.

 

[PropheticEvangelist]

That is not exactly true, but we can move on anyway. I will repeat what I said above:
"If you want to DISCUSS Calvinism I will be happy to do so (if you can be polite). Read this threads on On Romans 9:14-20, Christians and perseverance, Pa-pa Becnel, Salvation and Theology. I wrote them and will be happy to discuss them with you. You don't have to agree with any of it, but you can['t] just come in HERE and blast away. FOLLOW the RULES."

Dominus vobiscum,
Kenith

You keep telling me that I should follow the rules, I have, when I first came to the forums, I came to the forum which is entitled Aska Calvinist, so I aksed a Calvinist, any Calvinist, a simple legitimate question, and for that I was viciously attacked, now I admit I responded in an unChristian like manner, so I take absolute full blame for anything and everything that resulted formn that exchange.

I am willing to be the guilty party in everything and bear the full brunt of any wrongdoing, I am accustomed to being the source of all wrongdoing, have been all my life, so it is certainly nothing new to me.

I want to take this opportunity to submit this as a sincere apology to each and every person here that I have offended, I have been wrong about everything, and I ask your forgiveness.

I am only concerned with these 2 points:

1. The theory of selfish exclusion (you all refer to it as the doctrine of election).

2. And exactly how a Calvinist becomes a true born again Christian outside the acceptable Biblical standard.

I have repeatedly asked for Biblicla evidence to support the Calvinist theories concerning these two points and as yet none has ever been given.

Biblical evidence to support my beliefes has eben repeatedly demanded of me, demands which also accused me of not following the forum rules, demands which also were filled with visious hateful insults, BUT I forgive each and every one of these attacks in Jesus name, I gave the evidence repeatedly, and yet was accused repeatedly of havuing never given the evidence, the posts were all conveniently deleted, so I have NO remainig evidence of this!

IF and when I asked for the same Biblical evidence from a Calvinist to support their claims, the response has alwsays been we do not have to give you that evidence.

Now I amy be stupid as far as you are all concerned BUT is that a fair way to discuss anything

Yes, I do wrong, a lot, more than I should, and I hate myself for it, sometimes I ask myself why bother at all.

As I said I am really sorry I offended you all, if you want to forgive me, that is OK, If Not, that is OK too, I really don't care anymore.......

 

[Cajun Huguenot]

You keep telling me that I should follow the rules, I have, when I first came to the forums, I came to the forum which is entitled Aska Calvinist, so I aksed a Calvinist, any Calvinist, a simple legitimate question, and for that I was viciously attacked, now I admit I responded in an unChristian like manner, so I take absolute full blame for anything and everything that resulted formn that exchange

.

There are lots of non-Calvinists who come here and don't get into the trouble you got into because they are are not ugly and disrespectful of the views held by those of us here. You were very rude and your questions are not questions they are accusations with a question mark behind them. Your questions on the last post are a fine example of what I mean.

Why should any. How do you think a nice lady would respond and said "Hey you big, fat, stupid, harlot why don't you like me? That is basically what you do with your questions. Learn manners and some common courtesy and you will get far better results.

You don't really expect anyone here to think your questions worth responding to the way they are presently written do you?

I am only concerned with these 2 points:

1. The theory of selfish exclusion (you all refer to it as the doctrine of election).

2. And exactly how a Calvinist becomes a true born again Christian outside the acceptable Biblical standard.

Do you see anything wrong with the way you worded these questions? If not you need some help. Your questions are accusations and not true questions. You are free to read the post I've given links to. Perhaps if you read them you can ask a REAL question.

Dominus vobiscum,
Kenith

 

[PropheticEvangelist]

.

There are lots of non-Calvinists who come here and don't get into the trouble you got into because they are are not ugly and disrespectful of the views held by those of us here. You were very rude and your questions are not questions they are accusations with a question mark behind them. Your questions on the last post are a fine example of what I mean.

Why should any. How do you think a nice lady would respond and said "Hey you big, fat, stupid, harlot why don't you like me? That is basically what you do with your questions. Learn manners and some common courtesy and you will get far better results.

You don't really expect anyone here to think your questions worth responding to the way they are presently written do you?



Do you see anything wrong with the way you worded these questions? If not you need some help. Your questions are accusations and not true questions. You are free to read the post I've given links to. Perhaps if you read them you can ask a REAL question.

Dominus vobiscum,
Kenith

It wouldn't matter what I asked you, or how I asked, you would all always consider anything I say as an offensive personal afront.

I am very confused about this thing called Christianity at the present time, and want no part of it anymore.

I really don't care if I go to hell or not, hell is an attitude, and an experience, both of which I have have a great deal of personal; experience in for the majority of my life.

I really tried to be a Christian according to what I believe the word of Gopd teaches, I know you all hate me, and do not believe the things I have said, I have read the Bible, all of it, many times over4 the last 15 years, I have studied Calvins teachings, I am a Graduate, with honors, from Bible College, I was raised in a home where the doctrine of election was very strongly taught and defended, I was a memebr of the Southern Baptist denomination, and Idid truly give myslef to Christ, and I readily admit that I have commited each and every known sin, [ALL OF THEM!] except blaspheming the Holy Ghost!

I have asked, and asked, and asked, for help from all of you, I have sat at my PC with tears streaming down my face, oh of course you will all think that is also a big fat lie, from a sorry no account piece of scum, but it is the truth!

You think I don't hate myself?

I have to fight against killing myself each and every second of my miserable life!

I can't stand to look at myslef in the mirror, only God knows the despicable things I have done in my life time, I killed my own Grandfather! I gave the ok to take him off life support! I killed my own Uncle when I was 14 years old! I placed a shotgun to his head and blew his brains all over our living room wall!

My mother and father divorced because I was a cripple when I was born, I didn't walk until I was 4 years old!

So you don't have to convince me of what a rotten no good piece of scum I am, and always will be.

All I ever wanted from any of you was some help to understand whether or not I could ever hope to have even the slightest assurance of ever being a Christian, but none of you want to offer that help, I am really sorry I asked any of you for it.

 

[Cajun Huguenot]

It wouldn't matter what I asked you, or how I asked, you would all always consider anything I say as an offensive personal afront.

I am very confused about this thing called Christianity at the present time, and want no part of it anymore.

I really don't care if I go to hell or not, hell is an attitude, and an experience, both of which I have have a great deal of personal; experience in for the majority of my life.

I really tried to be a Christian according to what I believe the word of Gopd teaches, I know you all hate me, and do not believe the things I have said, I have read the Bible, all of it, many times over4 the last 15 years, I have studied Calvins teachings, I am a Graduate, with honors, from Bible College, I was raised in a home where the doctrine of election was very strongly taught and defended, I was a memebr of the Southern Baptist denomination, and Idid truly give myslef to Christ, and I readily admit that I have commited each and every known sin, [ALL OF THEM!] except blaspheming the Holy Ghost!

I have asked, and asked, and asked, for help from all of you, I have sat at my PC with tears streaming down my face, oh of course you will all think that is also a big fat lie, from a sorry no account piece of scum, but it is the truth!

You think I don't hate myself?

I have to fight against killing myself each and every second of my miserable life!

I can't stand to look at myslef in the mirror, only God knows the despicable things I have done in my life time, I killed my own Grandfather! I gave the ok to take him off life support! I killed my own Uncle when I was 14 years old! I placed a shotgun to his head and blew his brains all over our living room wall!

My mother and father divorced because I was a cripple when I was born, I didn't walk until I was 4 years old!

So you don't have to convince me of what a rotten no good piece of scum I am, and always will be.

All I ever wanted from any of you was some help to understand whether or not I could ever hope to have even the slightest assurance of ever being a Christian, but none of you want to offer that help, I am really sorry I asked any of you for it.

If any of this is true, you still need to be polite. No one here knows you personally. We do not know and can not tell if what you are saying is the straight scoop or a line of BS.

I've offered to discuss anything you like, but you have to be civil. That is not asking a lot from you. Countless other people are able to do that here. You will not be allowed to be an exception.

I see you are from Arkansas, you are a Southerner like myself, therefore I can assume that you were taught to be respectful( Like most of us were at one time). You know we were taught to be polite and say "sir" and "mam."

Ask an honest question that is not ugly and accusatory in tone, and you will get a response in kind.

THe story you give is interesting, but we have no way of telling if is true or not. The way you've acted here makes me hesitant to accept it at face value. Sorry, but that is part and parcle of this medium. You are welcome to be polite or leave.

BTW: the Southern Baptist, as a rule, are very anti-Calvinistic. What you discribe is very uncommon there.

In Christ,
Kenith

 

[CCWoody]

All I ever wanted from any of you was some help to understand whether or not I could ever hope to have even the slightest assurance of ever being a Christian, but none of you want to offer that help, I am really sorry I asked any of you for it.

I cannot give you assurance, nor can I state that you are not a child of God. I have not been given any kind of knowledge to state prophetically one way or the other. All I can do is show you where you can find such assurance.

Why do you think that you might not be a Child of God?

 

[cygnusx1]

meanwhile back at the ranch .........
how did you come to leave the Pentecostal/Charismatic movement , if you did ?

I am trying to guage the common situation of Christians going from "froth and bubble" type Christianity , to the meat of God's Word.

 

[CCWoody]

meanwhile back at the ranch .........
how did you come to leave the Pentecostal/Charismatic movement , if you did ?

I am trying to guage the common situation of Christians going from "froth and bubble" type Christianity , to the meat of God's Word.

Well, having some members trying to exorcise demons which were causing pain in a man and having the church leadership seemingly do nothing should have been my sign, but, Noooo!!!!

Straw on the camel's back Sunday was when we had "Prophecy camp." That's my affectionate name for having everyone in the church lay hands on someone else and practice prophesying. You see, we need to practice to exercise our spiritual gifts and learn how to "manifest" them. My wife, who is quicker than I, figured it out before I did and managed to get away. I, OTOH, had to practice my prophecy skills before I could leave.

 

[cygnusx1]

Well, having some members trying to exorcise demons which were causing pain in a man and having the church leadership seemingly do nothing should have been my sign, but, Noooo!!!!

Straw on the camel's back Sunday was when we had "Prophecy camp." That's my affectionate name for having everyone in the church lay hands on someone else and practice prophesying. You see, we need to practice to exercise our spiritual gifts and learn how to "manifest" them. My wife, who is quicker than I, figured it out before I did and managed to get away. I, OTOH, had to practice my prophecy skills before I could leave.

seems a nightmare woody , I started to have my major doubts by the standard of "prophecies" ........ ''The Lord would have you know ........... then followed what sounded just like the guess work of the horoscopes.......

I saw a guy once go through the room where everyone was praying , nice and quiet like ....... well this guy lead the prayer , and all of a sudden he announced at the top of his voice "the Lord is waking His people up" he then proceeded to move through the room pushing men off the chairs!!!

I wasn't pushed over , I had my back to the wall , and I wondered if he would have the brass neck to push a fellow elder over ......... he did!

I can still remember a minister , an exceedingly talented minister , announce one Sunday morning , "now close your Bibles and listen to me , cus you will only get confused "
he was preaching around Romans 8 .......... the Arminian version!

So after a while I started asking questions .......... they weren't too keen on that , but at least my old minister (not the one above) believed in the security of salvation , and used to delight in pushing it almost every week

 

[seekingpurity047]

I used to go to a pentecostal church for a while... til I got disgusted by the way the service went. The whole thing seemed like a huge performance to please people. I dunno, it seemed like... there were too many people claiming to be christians but went on the rest of the week doing whatever they wnated to (getting drunk, parties, etc) and I dunno, that made me sick. So... I had to leave. For me, it wasn't so much the spiritual stuff, but the people itself.

Randy

 

[5solas]

meanwhile back at the ranch .........
how did you come to leave the Pentecostal/Charismatic movement , if you did ?

I am trying to guage the common situation of Christians going from "froth and bubble" type Christianity , to the meat of God's Word.

The congregation I attended after "my decision for Jesus" had become more and more charismatic by the time (Toronto etc.) - and some people prophesied things that just did not happen within the timeframe they thought it would (they then said, that they had to learn to prophesy and were allowed to make mistakes; but I was convinced that the Bible calls this just false prophecy/prophets)- and everything became so emotional; almost everyone suddenly had a dream ("a word of God"); some behaved as if they had the mad cow disease and I eventually was so digusted by all of this that I just left (I was an arminian dispi at that time). After I left the place I started to study the Bible very seriously and systematically and I started to read the Institutio and other literature and compared it with the Bible - that's the way God chose me to be what I am today (I was not brought up in a Christian family).

Soli Deo Gloria!

 

[cygnusx1]

interesting , what I am seeing from these few testimonies is God leading people out of confusion and into sound doctrine.


It seems that Calvinism and it's teachings do have a way of feeding the dissilusioned.

 

[CCWoody]

interesting , what I am seeing from these few testimonies is God leading people out of confusion and into sound doctrine.


It seems that Calvinism and it's teachings do have a way of feeding the dissilusioned.

I was a confessing 5-point Calvinist when I was a member of that church.

 

[AndOne]

Here is my story in a very condensed nutshell -

A) Born and baptized an infant in the episcopal church
B) Confirmed at age 12 in the episcopal church
C) At age 15 my parents left the episcopal church to join the "Orlando Christian Center" which was a word-of-faith pentecostal church run by Benny Hinn.
D) At age 17 I completely rebelled against the church and rejected Christianity
E) At age 24 I accepted Christ in a Baptist Church with my wife
F) At age 25 we moved to Connecticut and started attending the Assemblies of God church
G) At age 28 left the AOG church (disagreed with their position on tounges, eternal security among other doctirinal issues) and then started attending another Baptist church
H) at age 30 developed an interest in theology
I) at age 34 accepted Calvinism

 

[cygnusx1]

I was a confessing 5-point Calvinist when I was a member of that church.

hey , so was I ................... that is why I had to leave

 

[cygnusx1]

Here is my story in a very condensed nutshell -

A) Born and baptized an infant in the episcopal church
B) Confirmed at age 12 in the episcopal church
C) At age 15 my parents left the episcopal church to join the "Orlando Christian Center" which was a word-of-faith pentecostal church run by Benny Hinn.
D) At age 17 I completely rebelled against the church and rejected Christianity
E) At age 24 I accepted Christ in a Baptist Church with my wife
F) At age 25 we moved to Connecticut and started attending the Assemblies of God church
G) At age 28 left the AOG church (disagreed with their position on tounges, eternal security among other doctirinal issues) and then started attending another Baptist church
H) at age 30 developed an interest in theology
I) at age 34 accepted Calvinism

interesting behe ....... wonder where you will be in 30 years

 

[AndOne]

interesting behe ....... wonder where you will be in 30 years

If I have learned anything at all - where I wind up in 30 years will be according to God's providence.... So I'm not worried about it....