Hypocrites ?

[timothyu]

Have we of the western culture, especially Christians, ever questioned why we are so quick to condemn an attack on those we consider our own (like the Ukraine), yet say nothing for the million civilians killed in Iraq since Sadam, the millions displaced in the Middle East by oil and religious wars, or the treatment of displaced Palestinians, let alone concern for the goings on in the rest of the world? Perhaps it is a case of it's ok to question the actions of others but not the same actions of ourselves. Even Putin is caught up in it thinking his country's Christianity is real while ours is not, as he wages his holy war guided by a new Rasputin of the Church. Who is right... or perhaps both are wrong. It seems it is the same old story of the choir preaching to the choir. Yet...


Matthew 5: 46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? 47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? 48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

 

[FireDragon76]

I don't think hypocrisy is the best way to understand the situation.

Middle Eastern oil, which at one time was very important for the global economy, is an easy motivator to understand. What is driving Putin is pure ideology.

 

[timothyu]

I don't think hypocrisy is the best way to understand the situation.

Middle Eastern oil, which at one time was very important for the global economy, is an easy motivator to understand. What is driving Putin is pure ideology.

Irrelevant. I am addressing our partisan thinking over bloodshed

 

[Robban]

Have we of the western culture, especially Christians, ever questioned why we are so quick to condemn an attack on those we consider our own (like the Ukraine), yet say nothing for the million civilians killed in Iraq since Sadam, the millions displaced in the Middle East by oil and religious wars, or the treatment of displaced Palestinians, let alone concern for the goings on in the rest of the world? Perhaps it is a case of it's ok to question the actions of others but not the same actions of ourselves. Even Putin is caught up in it thinking his country's Christianity is real while ours is not, as he wages his holy war guided by a new Rasputin of the Church. Who is right... or perhaps both are wrong. It seems it is the same old story of the choir preaching to the choir. Yet...


Matthew 5: 46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? 47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? 48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Rabbi Schneur Zalman explained the Talmud discusses the criteria for a pauper
to be eligable to receive charity.
The section concludes with the warning.

"One who is not in need, but takes.....one who is not lame or blind,
but makes himself as such---will not die of old age until he indeed as such."

In the same vein,
"One who makes of himself more than he is in matters of righteousness and piety,
will eventually find these traits have become ingrained in his character and very being."

For one who heeds this warning there is a reward,

Isaiah 58:8

 

[disciple Clint]

Have we of the western culture, especially Christians, ever questioned why we are so quick to condemn an attack on those we consider our own (like the Ukraine), yet say nothing for the million civilians killed in Iraq since Sadam, the millions displaced in the Middle East by oil and religious wars, or the treatment of displaced Palestinians, let alone concern for the goings on in the rest of the world? Perhaps it is a case of it's ok to question the actions of others but not the same actions of ourselves. Even Putin is caught up in it thinking his country's Christianity is real while ours is not, as he wages his holy war guided by a new Rasputin of the Church. Who is right... or perhaps both are wrong. It seems it is the same old story of the choir preaching to the choir. Yet...


Matthew 5: 46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? 47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? 48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

I think we see this all the time, people will get upset about the deaths of war but not about abortions, people will get upset about a black man being killed by police but those same people will say nothing about all the black people killed by black people, we are very inconsistent on our value of life.

 

[John Bannister]

Humans divide down into sects and fight over minutia while constantly missing the big picture. They also preach one thing and do the other. It seems to be the nature of a man.

Those who instead walk with God are rare, even in the churches, and it seems it has always been so.

 

[xser88]

I think we see this all the time, people will get upset about the deaths of war but not about abortions, people will get upset about a black man being killed by police but those same people will say nothing about all the black people killed by black people, we are very inconsistent on our value of life.

One major reason for seeing the difference between war death and abortion, is many don't see fetuses as human. Many believe after birth makes an individual. And people see a difference between tax paid police officers and a person murdering another person. People in the black community have been protesting for years about crime in their neighborhood. Why compare peace officers that took an oath to serve to violent criminals? The original question is an important one. Christians for years have given the appearance of hypocrisy. The Israeli government has been guilty of murdering Palestinians, but we never hold them accountable. But let a Israeli get injured by a Palestinian, and its a different story. They have been treating the Palestinians like dirt for years and we just don't care. Christians here say no money for Planned Parenthood because a portion might go to fund an abortion. But we give billions to Israel each year, and their government funds and preforms thousands of abortions each years. This is free abortions preformed by the government. This has been happening since the 1970s. We were wrong about Iraq, they didn't attack us on 9/11 and they didn't have WMDs. It was an unnecessary war built on a lie that left close to a million people dead. But we don't care and never repented. One reason we care for some but not others is because of the way they look. Ukrainians look white, Iraqis and Palestinians don't. Many Christians have abandoned their biblical principles for their political affiliations.

 

[partinobodycular]

Have we of the western culture, especially Christians, ever questioned why we are so quick to condemn an attack on those we consider our own (like the Ukraine), yet say nothing for the million civilians killed in Iraq since Sadam, the millions displaced in the Middle East by oil and religious wars, or the treatment of displaced Palestinians, let alone concern for the goings on in the rest of the world? Perhaps it is a case of it's ok to question the actions of others but not the same actions of ourselves. Even Putin is caught up in it thinking his country's Christianity is real while ours is not, as he wages his holy war guided by a new Rasputin of the Church. Who is right... or perhaps both are wrong. It seems it is the same old story of the choir preaching to the choir. Yet...

I don't think that there's anything hypocritical about it at all. It's just normal human behavior. There's only a limited number of people that we can form an emotional connection to, and the media and others have a vested interest in plucking at those heartstrings, be it for abused puppies, or innocent schoolchildren in Uvalde, or murdered Ukranians but not Palestinians. It's not that we're cold apathetic people, it's just that we're not psychologically capable of caring about everybody, even though we know in our hearts that we should, but we just can't.

So when you hear that sob story on 'America's Got Talent' keep in mind that life is hard for everybody, and we all need compassion sometimes. But don't be disappointed if you're moved by one person's story but not by another's, because that's just part of being human. But remember, just as you're disproportionately moved to respond compassionately to some people, you're disproportionately moved to respond negatively to others, and perhaps we should try to apply a little more of the former and a little less of the latter. Maybe simply doing that would be enough.

 

[disciple Clint]

One major reason for seeing the difference between war death and abortion, is many don't see fetuses as human. Many believe after birth makes an individual. And people see a difference between tax paid police officers and a person murdering another person. People in the black community have been protesting for years about crime in their neighborhood. Why compare peace officers that took an oath to serve to violent criminals? The original question is an important one. Christians for years have given the appearance of hypocrisy. The Israeli government has been guilty of murdering Palestinians, but we never hold them accountable. But let a Israeli get injured by a Palestinian, and its a different story. They have been treating the Palestinians like dirt for years and we just don't care. Christians here say no money for Planned Parenthood because a portion might go to fund an abortion. But we give billions to Israel each year, and their government funds and preforms thousands of abortions each years. This is free abortions preformed by the government. This has been happening since the 1970s. We were wrong about Iraq, they didn't attack us on 9/11 and they didn't have WMDs. It was an unnecessary war built on a lie that left close to a million people dead. But we don't care and never repented. One reason we care for some but not others is because of the way they look. Ukrainians look white, Iraqis and Palestinians don't. Many Christians have abandoned their biblical principles for their political affiliations.

I disagree with almost everything in your post, but I especially disagree with this statement

One major reason for seeing the difference between war death and abortion, is many don't see fetuses as human.

When we have abortions authorized up to and including the day of birth, it is obvious that we are killing a human, it was a human from day one.

 

[FireDragon76]

I disagree with almost everything in your post, but I especially disagree with this statement
When we have abortions authorized up to and including the day of birth, it is obvious that we are killing a human, it was a human from day one.

Don't be disingenuous. No hospital does that without legitimate medical reasons.

 

[disciple Clint]

Don't be disingenuous. No hospital does that without legitimate medical reasons.

nothing disingenuous in presenting the truth. 10 States Now Allow Killing Babies Up to Birth in Abortions, Virginia Could be Next - LifeNews.com

 

[John Bannister]

One thing to remember is that all of this noise about things going on in the world is not where you're supposed to be putting your empathy. Far too often people will be very upset about evil in the news which they cannot do anything about, but will step over the homeless in their town, and abuse service staff.
The Holy Spirit is the only weapon in the war to come.

 

[Astrid]

nothing disingenuous in presenting the truth. 10 States Now Allow Killing Babies Up to Birth in Abortions, Virginia Could be Next - LifeNews.com

Your nose is crooked and so are your teeth. Whole face is lopsided.
one ear, and one eye lower than the other!

It's the truth!

It true for me too. True for everyone!

Did I deliberately give a false impression by presenting the truth,
Oh denier of disingenuity,?

 

[xser88]

I disagree with almost everything in your post, but I especially disagree with this statement
When we have abortions authorized up to and including the day of birth, it is obvious that we are killing a human, it was a human from day one.

My spouse and I don't practice abortion and see it as ending a life. But I understand why others might feel different. I can appreciate the multiple perspectives as we wrestle with this complex issue. In Jewish law, although the human soul exists before birth, human life begins at birth, that is, at the time when the child is more than halfway emerged from the mother's body. So the fetus does not attain the status of personhood until birth. I can see someone arguing the bible counted a person days and years alive after birth. Despite the fact that several different events have been shown to take place for several months before birth, a common popular belief is that life begins with the first breath. We count the first day out the womb as the birth date. Some believe it's the time of the first kick, or as some call it, "the awakening". Some use Genesis 2:7 as proof that life begins with breath, as it did with Adam. Genesis 2:7 So the Lord God formed the man from the dust of the ground, breathed life into his lungs, and the man became a living being. Some believe abortion ends life, but also believes the mother’s life takes precedence over the fetus’ life, that can include abortion if there’s a threat to the mother. While most abortions take place in the first trimester of pregnancy, data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention shows that less than 1% of abortions take place after 21 weeks of pregnancy. I can understand why some might not think its obvious abortion is killing humans. I do think it’s obvious we kill humans when we without cause bomb places like Iraq. This includes pregnant women carrying fetuses, but I don't see anti-abortionists protesting that. This gives the appearance of hypocrisy. People wonder why pro-lifers don't fight for people's lives after birth, or why they don't protest unjust wars that kills innocent lives

 

[mama2one]

follow

 

[Homeowner]

When we have abortions authorized up to and including the day of birth, it is obvious that we are killing a human, it was a human from day one.

Still you are apparently fine living in a nation and paying taxes to support a nation that in your opinion basically murders around 900 000 children every year and doing nothing meaningful to stop it ?

You don't find anything hypocritical about this ? You don't perceive that whatever you say you still might not consider fetuses to actually be children as demonstrated by your actions or inaction ?

 

[disciple Clint]

My spouse and I don't practice abortion and see it as ending a life. But I understand why others might feel different. I can appreciate the multiple perspectives as we wrestle with this complex issue. In Jewish law, although the human soul exists before birth, human life begins at birth, that is, at the time when the child is more than halfway emerged from the mother's body. So the fetus does not attain the status of personhood until birth. I can see someone arguing the bible counted a person days and years alive after birth. Despite the fact that several different events have been shown to take place for several months before birth, a common popular belief is that life begins with the first breath. We count the first day out the womb as the birth date. Some believe it's the time of the first kick, or as some call it, "the awakening". Some use Genesis 2:7 as proof that life begins with breath, as it did with Adam. Genesis 2:7 So the Lord God formed the man from the dust of the ground, breathed life into his lungs, and the man became a living being. Some believe abortion ends life, but also believes the mother’s life takes precedence over the fetus’ life, that can include abortion if there’s a threat to the mother. While most abortions take place in the first trimester of pregnancy, data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention shows that less than 1% of abortions take place after 21 weeks of pregnancy. I can understand why some might not think its obvious abortion is killing humans. I do think it’s obvious we kill humans when we without cause bomb places like Iraq. This includes pregnant women carrying fetuses, but I don't see anti-abortionists protesting that. This gives the appearance of hypocrisy. People wonder why pro-lifers don't fight for people's lives after birth, or why they don't protest unjust wars that kills innocent lives

There is no life quite as innocent as an unborn child regardless of how some may try to rationalize killing a child there is no question that life begins at conception and that from conception on that life is a human. this is not a complicated issue some who attempt to complicate it are simply trying to avoid the truth.

 

[disciple Clint]

Still you are apparently fine living in a nation and paying taxes to support a nation that in your opinion basically murders around 900 000 children every year and doing nothing meaningful to stop it ?

You don't find anything hypocritical about this ? You don't perceive that whatever you say you still might not consider fetuses to actually be children as demonstrated by your actions or inaction ?

I am not the subject of this thread.

 

[Tom 1]

Have we of the western culture, especially Christians, ever questioned why we are so quick to condemn an attack on those we consider our own (like the Ukraine), yet say nothing for the million civilians killed in Iraq since Sadam, the millions displaced in the Middle East by oil and religious wars, or the treatment of displaced Palestinians, let alone concern for the goings on in the rest of the world? Perhaps it is a case of it's ok to question the actions of others but not the same actions of ourselves. Even Putin is caught up in it thinking his country's Christianity is real while ours is not, as he wages his holy war guided by a new Rasputin of the Church. Who is right... or perhaps both are wrong. It seems it is the same old story of the choir preaching to the choir. Yet...


Matthew 5: 46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? 47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? 48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

There are a lot of layers to that. For one thing, a lot of people have protested about the wars in the Middle East over the years, set up charities to help and so on. Beyond that there is basic tribalism, we tend to identify with people we see as being more like us, that’s something that affects everyone. There’s also proximity, Ukraine is right here on the edge of Europe, and the fact that it is Europe - the conflict represents the same clash of cultures and political ideas between Russia and Europe that has been going on since before communism. Although not everyone is consciously aware of all these things, they still affect how we think, seeping into awareness through the TV etc.

 

[Homeowner]

There is no life quite as innocent as an unborn child regardless of how some may try to rationalize killing a child there is no question that life begins at conception and that from conception on that life is a human. this is not a complicated issue some who attempt to complicate it are simply trying to avoid the truth.

If it is not a complicated question, if it is indeed the one clear truth, how can people who claim that live in a nation and pay their taxes to support government that allows the murder of around 900 000 children each year and still spend their time on places like ethics & morality board of these forums rather than doing their utmost to stop these murders or indeed move away and stop supporting nation that apparently murders nearly a million of it's own citizens every year.

I have yet to receive an answer to this. All I ever get is platitudes, evasions

I am not the subject of this thread.

or the silence of the grave. Perhaps it is shame.

Nobody ever seems to want to admit that everyone treats a fetus and a child on their knee differently. It is different legally, ethically and morally and everyone acts that way whatever they may speak.

Matthew 7:5