Hyper Calvinism and the Gospel/Missions.

[Apologetic_Warrior]

I should have asked, how is it encouraging if a person possibly has a "chance" of being saved, when by the same token, there is also the possibility of of the same person "falling away" from their salvation? What does that do to witnessing, when there is no confidence, no certainty? It should be most discouraging of all. To think a person can undo, and make null your witnessing, to think their will, can trump the will of God! Why witness with only mere "possibility" and "chance"? Since most of the world rejects Christianity, especially Protestanism, isn't it most "likely" the person being witnessed to will most "likely" turn out to be an apostate?

Our witnessing should never be based on results anyway, it should be based on Scripture.

 

[Apologetic_Warrior]

Sir! You've misunderstood my point. I'm a Calvinist, but have fallen into a hyper-Calvinistic mindset. Whitfield and Edwards are my heroes.

For once it is a blessing to have misunderstood! My apologies!

 

[stenerson]

I should have asked, how is it encouraging if a person possibly has a "chance" of being saved, when by the same token, there is also the possibility of of the same person "falling away" from their salvation? What does that do to witnessing, when there is no confidence, no certainty? It should be most discouraging of all. To think a person can undo, and make null your witnessing, to think their will, can trump the will of God! Why witness with only mere "possibility" and "chance"? Since most of the world rejects Christianity, especially Protestanism, isn't it most "likely" the person being witnessed to will most "likely" turn out to be an apostate?

Our witnessing should never be based on results anyway, it should be based on Scripture.

I'm not sure what you're asking? Are you assuming I believe that a regenerate Christian can fall away? I think there's some confusion here and we're having different conversations.

 

[JM]

Proclaim the Gospel freely to all and you are not a hyper. Period.

 

[twin1954]

Proclaim the Gospel freely to all and you are not a hyper. Period.

Absolutely! Proclaim the Gospel of the free and sovereign grace of God in Christ Jesus alone but don't "offer" what is not yours to give.

Tell them of the love of God in salvation and the mercy of God to sinners by Jesus Christ. Proclaim accomplished redemption by His life and death and resurrection. Call on sinners to believe on Christ. Tell sinners who Christ Jesus is, what He did and who He did it for and why He did it. Tell them that salvation is free and comes only by faith in Christ alone. Tell them about the Fall and what a sinner is. Tell them that salvation is theirs if they want it even.

But don't tell them that God loves them and has a wonderful plan for their lives or offer them salvation as though it is something they have to take part in receiving. Always present the Gospel as something God does for us and in us never as something we do for ourselves.

 

[JM]

Let's not forget, the Marrow Controversy was started by fellas who rejected the discipline of their synod, and insisted God loves everyone or else the preaching of the Gospel doesn't make sense.

 

[stenerson]

Absolutely! Proclaim the Gospel of the free and sovereign grace of God in Christ Jesus alone but don't "offer" what is not yours to give.

Tell them of the love of God in salvation and the mercy of God to sinners by Jesus Christ. Proclaim accomplished redemption by His life and death and resurrection. Call on sinners to believe on Christ. Tell sinners who Christ Jesus is, what He did and who He did it for and why He did it. Tell them that salvation is free and comes only by faith in Christ alone. Tell them about the Fall and what a sinner is. Tell them that salvation is theirs if they want it even.

But don't tell them that God loves them and has a wonderful plan for their lives or offer them salvation as though it is something they have to take part in receiving. Always present the Gospel as something God does for us and in us never as something we do for ourselves.

Sounds good to me. I would also tell them that God commands them to repent and believe.

 

[Skala]

Grace upon their own minds and preaching in an "unwarranted" way.

I think its important for those with a monergistic theological view to let the Gospel breath on us mere mortals in the context of our lowly understandings (in comparison to Gods understanding). Just because there are truths about predestination doesn't mean you can wield it like a kid in a candy store. We experience the world in its "secondary causes"

...

I see it this way.

A man preaches the Gospel knowing God is the cause of whoever is saved. And feels privileged that God uses him for such an endeavor. He knows that his life and the choices he makes are important, however, God is sovereign over his creation.

That's why I like to say: preach like an Arminian, but sleep like a Calvinist

 

[BryanW92]

That's why I like to say: preach like an Arminian, but sleep like a Calvinist

That is the wisest thing I've read on CF in a long time.

 

[JM]

Never preach like an Arminian...

 

[gord44]

oh snap. this is were JM goes berserk!

 

[BryanW92]

Never preach like an Arminian...

Preach like an Arminian is not the same as go preach Arminianism.

 

[Awaken4Christ]

That's why I like to say: preach like an Arminian, but sleep like a Calvinist

Oh yes, sleeping like a Calvinist is the preferred method by far. Though, sometimes I worry about losing my ..... sock. Waking up with one sock is the worst!

 

[JM]

"What you win them with is what you win them to."

Is there any wonder modern, hypo Calvinists have abandoned the Regulative Principle and added guitar solos, "special" solo performers and other means of entertainment? Preach like an Arminian and win free will, seeker sensitive hypo Calvinists. If you mean preach freely to all...that's nothing less than Calvinism. We cannot give ground and allow Arminians to take that away from us. I’m being serious, maybe too serious, perhaps but accuracy is important.

J

 

[stenerson]

"What you win them with is what you win them to."

Is there any wonder modern, hypo Calvinists have abandoned the Regulative Principle and added guitar solos, "special" solo performers and other means of entertainment? Preach like an Arminian and win free will, seeker sensitive hypo Calvinists. If you mean preach freely to all...that's nothing less than Calvinism. We cannot give ground and allow Arminians to take that away from us. I’m being serious, maybe too serious, perhaps but accuracy is important.

J

Marrow Controversy, hypo Calviists, Regulative Principle ? ya got me googling for definitions.
Actually hypo was easy to figure out, must be on the opposite scale of hyper.

 

[JM]

...don't worry, I'm not going berserk.

 

[gord44]

...don't worry, I'm not going berserk.

just a gentle ribbing...

I saw that comment and knew what your response would be before you posted it!

 

[JM]

I know, I know...but after the experience I had recently at a Russian Orthodox church, my vigour for doctrinal battle has waned.

Yours in the Lord,

jm

 

[twin1954]

By all means understand and preach knowing the urgency of damnation with the knowledge that those to whom you preach are not promised another second. But never preach like an Arminian. An Arminian preaches as though it depends on him to convince the sinner.

We proclaim the free grace of God in Christ Jesus the Lord but we do not beg, coerce, or try to win an emotional profession from the sinner. Unlike the Arminian we are not out to get people saved. A true Calvinist doesn't try to get people saved we simply preach the truth of God as it is in Christ Jesus the Lord and leave the rest to God.

In all honesty my heart breaks for those who do not believe and trust the Lord Jesus. I feel the weight of their souls on me every day. I am often brought to tears thinking of those who will end up in Hell knowing that they are no different than I and the only thing that makes me different is the sovereign grace of God. Yet I refuse, God giving me grace, to compromise His truth in order to appeal to lost sinners. I hold the glory of God, the grace of God and the power of the preaching of the Gospel of Christ in the Spirit far more worthy of uncompromising loyalty than to even for a moment consider compromise for the sake of winning souls.

 

[twin1954]

The appeal of compromise is that it is easy to do and it only takes a little. We care about those whom we preach to and it is so appealing to give just a little in order to move them to where we want them to be. We leave out a little or soften the truth just a smidge in order to not offend or to get them to feel something. We are tempted to phrase things in such a way as to let them think it is up to them to believe. We think that we can teach them about the sovereignty of God, that which separates Him from all false gods and the point of rebellion for every sinner, later.

Compromise never starts big. It always begins in small increments and like a snowball builds until it blinds you and you can barely recognize it from the truth. One little thing for the sake of souls soon picks up another little thing and another little thing and so on until you no longer even know that you have forsaken truth. It is easy to justify compromise as well. The more you compromise the more you justify it in your own mind.

OH Lord, guard us from compromise!