husband has been divorced and remarried me and now wants to contact ex wife

[ValleyGal]

8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.

9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

Put away in these verses is not a good translation to English. In v. 8 it should have translated to legal divorce and sending away. In v. 9 the word is apoluo, which is to separate and not give the certificate of divorce. In Jewish law, it was necessary to provide a certificate of divorce, just as it is today. Otherwise, it is just considering sending away without benefit of divorce. This was a cruel thing the men were doing to women at the time - sending them away without divorce so that they could not remarry - and women were reliant in that culture on marriage for survival. So Jesus is actually saying it is okay to send a woman away, but it has to be with a divorce certificate so she is not left without someone to take care of her.

 

[SouthernMama]

You are trying to make a difference between putting away or divorce. They mean the same thing.
apolyō (one of the definitions is)
4) used of divorce, to dismiss from the house, to repudiate. The wife of a Greek or Roman may divorce her husband.
Moses allowed people to put away/divorce their spouse. Jesus said it was NEVER his intention. Look at the people's response to that teaching. Some of them could not handle the truth and turned aside from following him!!

 

[Tropical Wilds]

I don't know you or your situation, or what type of Mennonites that your husband has met. However, I will explain a bit how the conservative Mennonites view divorce and remarriage. Based on scriptures like Matt. 5:32, Matt. 19:9, Mark 10:11, 12, I Cor. 7:11...God joins two people in marriage for life. Divorce is not God's plan. Being married to a second person while your first spouse is living is considered adultery. If you choose to divorce due to infidelity or abuse (for example), you are to remain unmarried (1 Cor. 7) or else reconcile to your first spouse. A person who is living with a second spouse is living in adultery and the way to end the adultery is to end the marriage, hence the clause, "saving for fornication." Your husband may be looking for a way out, or he may be truly trying to find his way in obedience to Christ. I don't know. I just wanted to give you a perspective of what the Mennonites believe. Above all, don't just trust a religion, study the scripture and pray that God would reveal His truth to you, what ever it may be.

I have a friend who's Mennonite, and they don't believe like this at all... Another sin (a second divorce) to correct a previous sin (a first divorce) and put you in the right. She's remarried and they were pretty clear that what happened with the first marriage and divorce happened before she came to the faith and was bound to their doctrine, so her allegiance as it were is to her current marriage. Even if she had, because people in the church divorce and remarry, they don't teach that committing another sin to correct a first sin doesn't fix things. That's where repentance and forgiveness comes into play. This teaching that to right his soul he should divorce his current wife and seek out his ex must be a sect specific sort of thing... Though I will say, it's a big disturbing as it assumes the ending of a marriage and the formation (re-formation, whatever) of a previous marriage... Without actually checking in with the ex-wife. She could be remarried herself, she could have no interest in reconciling, she could never want to talk to him again. The building of a future and pinning a soul's redemption as the responsibility of a person who doesn't even know seems so weird. I mean, if my ex-husband converted and then came to me and told me he wanted to reconcile? LoL! Yeah, right. Even if I was available, I'd have said no. I'm not sure why we're assuming she'd be any different.

 

[SouthernMama]

I have a friend who's Mennonite, and they don't believe like this at all... Another sin (a second divorce) to correct a previous sin (a first divorce) and put you in the right. She's remarried and they were pretty clear that what happened with the first marriage and divorce happened before she came to the faith and was bound to their doctrine, so her allegiance as it were is to her current marriage. Even if she had, because people in the church divorce and remarry, they don't teach that committing another sin to correct a first sin doesn't fix things. That's where repentance and forgiveness comes into play. This teaching that to right his soul he should divorce his current wife and seek out his ex must be a sect specific sort of thing... Though I will say, it's a big disturbing as it assumes the ending of a marriage and the formation (re-formation, whatever) of a previous marriage... Without actually checking in with the ex-wife. She could be remarried herself, she could have no interest in reconciling, she could never want to talk to him again. The building of a future and pinning a soul's redemption as the responsibility of a person who doesn't even know seems so weird. I mean, if my ex-husband converted and then came to me and told me he wanted to reconcile? LoL! Yeah, right. Even if I was available, I'd have said no. I'm not sure why we're assuming she'd be any different.

Divorce is not always a sin; remarriage while a spouse is living, always is. So it is not a sin to divorce and leave an adulterous marriage. That is repenting of adultery. Also for clarification, CONSERVATIVE Mennonites believe that if you married a second person and then separated from that adulterous marriage, you are to remain single for life, not return to your first spouse.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

Divorce is not always a sin;remarriage while a spouse is living, always is.

Weren't you just giving somebody else grief for getting from the Bible something different than what is plainly said?

So it is not a sin to divorce and leave an adulterous marriage. That is repenting of adultery.

I've done a lot of reading, and I'm not seeing where this is standard practice... I'm seeing where some sects do personal interpretation of their beliefs to state that this is what should be done, but there's no Biblical support, and ignores the fact that a second sin doesn't right a previous sin.

Also for clarification, CONSERVATIVE Mennonites believe that if you married a second person and then separated from that adulterous marriage, you are to remain single for life, not return to your first spouse.

That's all ridiculously contradictory.

 

[super mom]

his bishop has told me that he wants myt husband to back off the marriage till he finds out if his ex wife is alive and for him to hold membership to the church if shes alive he has to divorce me. i told him that the Holy Spirit plainly told me to save my marriage no i wont sign the divorce papers i will fight this tooth and nail i wont let it go

 

[Hetta]

his bishop has told me that he wants myt husband to back off the marriage till he finds out if his ex wife is alive and for him to hold membership to the church if shes alive he has to divorce me. i told him that the Holy Spirit plainly told me to save my marriage no i wont sign the divorce papers i will fight this tooth and nail i wont let it go

Good for you. It is a wickedness, imo, on the part of the bishop to encourage a man to discard his wife and children. I pray that your husband comes to his senses very soon.

 

[ValleyGal]

That is really harsh, supermom. I'm so sorry this is all happening. I hope that the one sect of his religion does not turn you off of Christianity altogether. I know if I were in your shoes, I might become really turned off for the way they are treating you. I honestly hope you are able to find a place where you can worship God without being seen as little more than an adulteress. I feel terrible for your children, too, that they may end up in a broken home because of some religious idea that they are nothing but the offspring of adultery. That will wound them all their lives. I hope you have a lot of support around you.

 

[SouthernMama]

Weren't you just giving somebody else grief for getting from the Bible something different than what is plainly said?

I've done a lot of reading, and I'm not seeing where this is standard practice... I'm seeing where some sects do personal interpretation of their beliefs to state that this is what should be done, but there's no Biblical support, and ignores the fact that a second sin doesn't right a previous sin.

Every time the Bible talks about marrying a person who is divorced, it is called adultery. How much plainer can you get?

It is not a second sin. Leaving a life of sin (a second marriage) is not a sin. Staying in the marriage (adultery) is sin.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

his bishop has told me that he wants myt husband to back off the marriage till he finds out if his ex wife is alive and for him to hold membership to the church if shes alive he has to divorce me. i told him that the Holy Spirit plainly told me to save my marriage no i wont sign the divorce papers i will fight this tooth and nail i wont let it go

Even if you don't agree to a divorce, go talk to a lawyer. You agreeing to it or not means nothing if he's getting one for this ludicrous reason, and you need to make sure your assets are protected, not that he pulls the plug on the marriage and takes everything with him. Especially seeing as you have 3 kids. Not signing the divorce papers and ignoring the filing and motion will just push the divorce through faster and give you nothing. And if he files, make sure he puts adultery and fraud as the reasons... After all, if he truly thinks your marriage is adultery, then he should be able to admit as much to the court, take the fault of the divorce, and pay the associated penalties for being the cause for the demise of the marriage.

Something tells me that his belief he's committing adultery with you will wane when has to admit it to the court and take fault for the divorce, taking a hit on what he pays in settlements, alimony, and child support.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

Every time the Bible talks about marrying a person who is divorced, it is called adultery. How much plainer can you get?

It is not a second sin. Leaving a life of sin (a second marriage) is not a sin. Staying in the marriage (adultery) is sin.

But to get out of that marriage, you divorce, breaking the vow you made before God. So in the effort to right the sin of the first divorce, you make the same exact sin again. Sinning again does not right a past sin. Now you're divorced, again, and breaking a vow before God, all in an effort to fix the first divorce (if the first spouse will have you and they probably won't). And if there are kids involved in the second marriage, good God, how ridiculous.

It's a sin you're righting by sinning again, creating the same situation with wife and marriage number two out of a Biblical misunderstanding and a false belief that if you sin, sin again to fix it.

 

[SouthernMama]

But to get out of that marriage, you divorce, breaking the vow you made before God. So in the effort to right the sin of the first divorce, you make the same exact sin again. Sinning again does not right a past sin. Now you're divorced, again, and breaking a vow before God, all in an effort to fix the first divorce (if the first spouse will have you and they probably won't). And if there are kids involved in the second marriage, good God, how ridiculous.

It's a sin you're righting by sinning again, creating the same situation with wife and marriage number two out of a Biblical misunderstanding and a false belief that if you sin, sin again to fix it.

If it is adultery to be married to another person while your first spouse is living, then how do you end that adultery? Just repenting and asking God for forgiveness? Saying I'm sorry is a good start but it doesn't end the adultery. I don't see any other way to stop sinning, but to get out of the marriage.

As far as the children being involved, that is incredible sad and hard, yes. But it is a weak argument because often times when a first marriage ends, no one asks, "what about the children?" I just hear, "They'll be fine. They'll cope. They're better off than in a home where the parents fight." But suddenly when it involves a second marriage, people worry about the children. If more people would worry about the children in the first marriage, we wouldn't have so many broken home. (That's another subject entirely.)

 

[ValleyGal]

If it is adultery to be married to another person while your first spouse is living, then how do you end that adultery? Just repenting and asking God for forgiveness? Saying I'm sorry is a good start but it doesn't end the adultery. I don't see any other way to stop sinning, but to get out of the marriage.

How do you explain 1 Cor 7:28, which says "But if you do marry, you have not sinned; and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned. But those who marry will face many troubles in this life, and I want to spare you this." Where it says "if you do marry, you have not sinned", Paul is talking about those who have been previously married. He then goes on to discuss first marriage "and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned." How can you explain that verse except to say that marriage after divorce is not adultery. Also, when God gave Israel her certificate of divorce, he pursued Judah. If divorce were sin, God would not have done it, and if remarriage were sin, he would not have pursued Judah before going back to Israel. God is holy and without sin. Yet he did both those things.

As far as the children being involved, that is incredible sad and hard, yes. But it is a weak argument because often times when a first marriage ends, no one asks, "what about the children?" I just hear, "They'll be fine. They'll cope. They're better off than in a home where the parents fight." But suddenly when it involves a second marriage, people worry about the children. If more people would worry about the children in the first marriage, we wouldn't have so many broken home. (That's another subject entirely.)

When I asked about the children, it was not out of concern being from a broken home. It was more out of being called "illegitimate" or the "result of adultery" or some other lame excuse by the dad who deserted them. And if he leaves his wife because of "adultery" how is he going to treat his "results of adultery"? Is he going to support them and be their father like he would if they were from a first marriage?

Divorcing a second wife is totally illogical, and it is against the law given to the Jews - not that we are Jewish or need to live under those laws, but if God gave them, he gave them for a reason. You just don't go around playing with people's hearts. To divorce the current wife in order to return to the first is not justification - especially since he married this second wife before becoming a member of whatever sect of Mennonites he's from - which I'm not sure is even Mennonite since this is not Mennonite doctrine.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

If it is adultery to be married to another person while your first spouse is living, then how do you end that adultery? Just repenting and asking God for forgiveness? Saying I'm sorry is a good start but it doesn't end the adultery. I don't see any other way to stop sinning, but to get out of the marriage.

But if the first divorce was a sin, you don't correct the sin of divorce through a second divorce. It'd be like saying me punching you would be a sin, and if I want to correct that sin, I should punch ValleyGirl. Or if I robbed a bank, I should go rob a different bank to give the first bank their money back and call it even. That's not how it works. Sin doesn't correct sin if the belief is that divorce is a sin. It's still breaking vows you made before God, vows that are legally binding, and if that was a sin the first time around, it's a sin the second time around as well.

As far as the children being involved, that is incredible sad and hard, yes. But it is a weak argument because often times when a first marriage ends, no one asks, "what about the children?" I just hear, "They'll be fine. They'll cope. They're better off than in a home where the parents fight." But suddenly when it involves a second marriage, people worry about the children. If more people would worry about the children in the first marriage, we wouldn't have so many broken home. (That's another subject entirely.)

Well yes, sometimes divorce is a solution to a problem and children are better to come from a broken home than live in a broken home. I'd be the first to say that's true. My step-kids are a testament to that, my sister is a testament to that... It's very true.

I also think we can pretty much agree that in a situation where there are kids, if the person is leaving under this false belief that their current marriage is adulterous, to tell the kids (even as adults) that the divorce occurred because their legal marriage to the other parent was adultery, now they're illegitimate and their parent won't lay claim to the relationship that produced them... That's very damaging, pointlessly cruel and hurtful, and not something that can be justified to a child.

Honestly, it's pretty much the most selfish thing I've ever seen.

And we won't get into how stupid it is to say that because others who divorce don't think of the kids, it's no big deal if somebody else does it too. What somebody else does is not your excuse to do what you do.

Like I said, if he really thinks the union is adultery, I hope he has the kahones to put it as the reason for the divorce, along with fraud. And I hope she uses it to get custody and maximum alimony and child support. He ends the marriage that he suddenly believes doesn't exist or is a sin, he should take the consequence.

 

[SouthernMama]

How do you explain 1 Cor 7:28, which says "But if you do marry, you have not sinned; and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned. But those who marry will face many troubles in this life, and I want to spare you this." Where it says "if you do marry, you have not sinned", Paul is talking about those who have been previously married. He then goes on to discuss first marriage "and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned." How can you explain that verse except to say that marriage after divorce is not adultery. Also, when God gave Israel her certificate of divorce, he pursued Judah. If divorce were sin, God would not have done it, and if remarriage were sin, he would not have pursued Judah before going back to Israel. God is holy and without sin. Yet he did both those things.

.

In the beginning of 1 Cor. 7, Paul just said that a woman who separated from her husband was to remain unmarried OR return to her husband. Verse 28 a totally different subject. He is saying because of the circumstances they were living in at that particular time that he though everyone should stay single. If they were married, they should not end the marriage. But if they chose to marry, it was not a sin.

Verse 28 is NOT referring to divorced persons. Paul wouldn't say to remain unmarried and then turn around and say, whatever, ignore what I said, Get married if you wish. Read the verse in its correct context. It's speaking to virgins. A virgin is not a divorce person.

 

[SouthernMama]

But if the first divorce was a sin, you don't correct the sin of divorce through a second divorce. It'd be like saying me punching you would be a sin, and if I want to correct that sin, I should punch ValleyGirl. Or if I robbed a bank, I should go rob a different bank to give the first bank their money back and call it even. That's not how it works. Sin doesn't correct sin if the belief is that divorce is a sin. It's still breaking vows you made before God, vows that are legally binding, and if that was a sin the first time around, it's a sin the second time around as well.

Then how do you correct the sin of living in adultery? (the second marriage)

 

[Hetta]

A virgin is not a divorce person.

A divorced person could be a virgin. Just sayin'

 

[Hetta]

As far as the children being involved, that is incredible sad and hard, yes. But it is a weak argument because often times when a first marriage ends, no one asks, "what about the children?" I just hear, "They'll be fine. They'll cope. They're better off than in a home where the parents fight." But suddenly when it involves a second marriage, people worry about the children. If more people would worry about the children in the first marriage, we wouldn't have so many broken home. (That's another subject entirely.)

I have never seen anyone have an utterly callous attitude towards the children of any broken marriage actually. People are always concerned about the fallout on the kids. But in this particular case - right here, right now - there are no children in the first marriage, but there are children in the second marriage. So, your only thought is that it's "sad" and "hard" for these three children - and that it's a "weak argument" only based upon your understanding that some other people (not the OP) don't care about their children when they divorce? How does it make it a weak argument just because some people act in a certain way? What does that have to do with the OP and her young children?

I would be sorry to be this man. He may cause the little ones to stumble. Who, after all, would believe in a God who took your dad away and said it was okay to do that?

 

[ValleyGal]

In the beginning of 1 Cor. 7, Paul just said that a woman who separated from her husband was to remain unmarried OR return to her husband. Verse 28 a totally different subject. He is saying because of the circumstances they were living in at that particular time that he though everyone should stay single. If they were married, they should not end the marriage. But if they chose to marry, it was not a sin.

Verse 28 is NOT referring to divorced persons. Paul wouldn't say to remain unmarried and then turn around and say, whatever, ignore what I said, Get married if you wish. Read the verse in its correct context. It's speaking to virgins. A virgin is not a divorce person.

Let's take a close look at 1 Cor 7.

v 1-6 - Paul addresses married couples' sexual relations
v 7 - Paul says it's better to stay single and never marry
v 8 - to the unmarried (divorced) and widows: it is good for them to stay unmarried (divorced/widowed).
v 9 - but if they (the divorced and widowed) cannot control themselves, they should marry, for it is better to marry than to burn with passion.
v 10 - To the married I give this command: a wife must not separate (apoluo; leave without benefit of divorce) from her husband.
v 11 - But if she does, she must remain unmarried (because she is separated, not divorced) or be reconciled to her husband. And a husband must not divorce (apoluo; send her away without benefit of divorce) his wife.
v 12-24 addresses unbelieving spouses and remaining in the situation you are in when you are called (and this should be proof enough for the OP in this thread - that he is in this marriage when he becomes a believer, he should remain in that situation according to these verses).
v 25 - About virgins...
v 26 - Are you pledged to a woman? Do not seek to be released. Are you free from such a commitment (via divorce or widowhood, since both frees a person from the marriage contract), do not look for a wife.
v 27 - But if you do marry, you have not sinned, and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned (he addresses those released from the marriage contract separately from those who have never been married). But those who marry will face many troubles in this life, and I want to spare you this.

We can further see the distinction between those who are virgins and those who are UNmarried further down, in v 34.

So as you can see, Paul was indeed talking to people who are UNmarried (divorced) and when he says that a separated woman needs to be reconciled to her husband, it's because she is only separated without the benefit of divorce.

In your interpretation, there are many inconsistencies and contradictions. But when you study and read carefully and know a little about Greek translation, you will know and understand how there are no contradictions in the Word.

God is not a cruel God, to expect people to stay unmarried after divorce. He knows that people burn with passion, and he knows our need for close companionship. But he also does not expect us to stay in marriages where there are hard hearts or adultery or betrayal either. Like I said, if it were sin, God himself would not have given Israel a certificate of divorce and then gone off to pursue Judah.

 

[SouthernMama]

Book of Josephus Chapter 5
"ABOUT this time Aretas (the king of Arabia Petres) and Herod had a quarrel on the account following: Herod the tetrarch had, married the daughter of Aretas, and had lived with her a great while; but when he was once at Rome, he lodged with Herod, (15) who was his brother indeed, but not by the same mother; for this Herod was the son of the high priest Sireoh's daughter.
However, he fell in love with Herodias, this last Herod's wife, who was the daughter of Aristobulus their brother, and the sister of Agrippa the Great. This man ventured to talk to her about a marriage between them; which address, when she admitted, an agreement was made for her to change her habitation, and come to him as soon as he should return from Rome: one article of this marriage also was this, that he should divorce Aretas's daughter"

John lost his head (literally) for telling Herod that he was in sin because he was married to his brother's wife.