hugs and islam

[MercuryAndy]

I realy can't understand why you can not understand what I have posted.

 

[Vaneeza Malkah]

sorry I didn't know I was being judgemental. I was simply saying that the nations that call themself christian in majority or were once christian often do not show affection in the way which is common for muslims (that was what the question was about). Living in the United States I find many people generally less friendly in spite of all of the hugging and kissing. That's just my experience, not a fact

I enjoyed reading your description, but did you have to include the judgemental comment about the 'average western society', whatever that may be?

Would it be appropriate for me to talk about the 'average Asian society', lumping Hindu with Moslem, Korean with Chinese, totally ignoring the fact that there is no such thing, and that cultural differences between faiths, countries and even family groups will have a huge impact on behaviour?

Please, can we all try to lose this way of side sniping at other countries, faiths or customs, particularly when we are not familiar with them personally, and are basing our comments on stereotypical views.

Fyi, some cultures like lots of touching, some do not. But neither is a reflection of how friendly such cultures may or may not be.

Further, I have visited a Moslem country not far from your own, and although handshakes are not the common practice, they are not, as you said, 'not allowed.' Many Moslem gentlemen, who knew that Western people shake hands, shook hands with me. So perhaps a moderation of language all round might be useful. Less black and white, more shades of grey.

 

[Exegete12]

nazis were church-going protestants.

this is far from the truth.

• Christian Identity movement
• Ku Klux Klan (A racist Protestant Christian organization founded during the Reconstruction period in the former Confederate States of America)
  [*]Lord's Resistance Army (1987-present) (Uganda)
  [*]Nagaland Rebels (1948-present) (Nagaland), including:
  [*]God's Army (a rebel faction of the Karen ethnic minority in Burma)
  [*]17 November in Greece,
  [*]RAF and Neo-Nazis in Germany,
  [*]ETA in Spain, Red Brigades in Italy
  
  [*]Freedomites (1902-present) Active in Canada, notable for their longevity
  [*]Nagaland Rebels (1947-present) Active in predominantly Christian state in Hindu majority India. Involved in several bombings in 2004. Goal: Independence from India after annexing parts of neighboring Indian states and Burma if it has Christian majority.
  [*]National Liberation Front of Tripura (1989-present) A group that seeks the independence of Tripura from India to create a Christian Tripura.

not to mension what cromwell did to the irish, let alone the catholics, & all the wars & bloody revolutions in britain, america, france, mexico etc.

Maybe the Nagas need to take a leaf out of the book of Mahatma Ghandi. Still Nagaland is 97% Christian. Thanks to the missionaries – I used to be involved with that team -- indirectly. At one stage I think it was 99% Christian. Many miracles happen in that country. I don't know what it is like now though.

 

[MercuryAndy]

I still don't remember any revolution in briton...

 

[Catherineanne]

I still don't remember any revolution in briton...

One theory is that British revolution was exported to the colonies, and happened there.

 

[Catherineanne]

That's just my experience, not a fact

Fair enough, but you still cannot judge the actual friendliness underneath the behaviour, just by looking at the behaviour and finding it different from your own.

 

[Vaneeza Malkah]

I think you are confusing friendlyness with kindness, friendlyness is the initial behavour and the only thing which can be recognized upon meeting a person, kindness is an attribute within a person shown by good deeds

Fair enough, but you still cannot judge the actual friendliness underneath the behaviour, just by looking at the behaviour and finding it different from your own.

 

[Catherineanne]

I think you are confusing friendlyness with kindness, friendlyness is the initial behavour and the only thing which can be recognized upon meeting a person, kindness is an attribute within a person shown by good deeds

I think there is certainly confusion, but not in me.

However, I am not about to start swapping dictionary definitions. I have already commented twice on this, and if that is not enough to make myself clear, then that is too bad.

 

[peaceinislam]

You may find that in the outside world there is a lot of confusion in people's minds about the difference between a devout Moslem and a radical fanatic who goes over the edge into something else. I personally believe this blurring of the edges is being orchestrated on purpose in order to find a new enemy for the US, now that the Soviet Union is no longer a convenient target.

I think that you do not need to be so defensive on this Forum, however. You are speaking for the most part to people of faith, or at least to people who are exploring issues relating to faith, and we are perfectly well aware that the vast majority of Moslems are God fearing, peaceful, and very family centred and loving people, whatever our media and politicians would prefer us to believe. But to retain this view, I need to find such people, not find people who say that Hitler was a Christian, which is patent nonsense, and who say that Moslem terrorists do not kill in the name of Islam, which is also nonsense.


The challenge to us all, I believe, is to condemn wholeheartedly not the other side's bad behaviour, but our own. As with sin, we are called to convict ourselves, not our neighbours. Christians can be safely left to identify and speak out against abuses in Iraq and elsewhere perpetrated by Western people. But why are such condemnations apparently invisible and unheard by Moslems. Are you really oblivious to the words of the former Pope, or the Archbishop of Canterbury, inter alia?

Where I have a problem is that I do not hear the same voices on behalf of Islam, speaking out against the bombing of Mosques, and the interfactional killing. I hear all the blame going to the US for being there, and Moslems are always shown as the victims, to be pitied.

I really need to see far less victim, more speaking out in favour of what is good, and against what is bad. And a lot more honesty about the rotten bits of Islam. Because, for all the attempts to whitewash, they are most certainly there. Just as they are in Christianity, and are being, albeit slowly, dealt with. And in any other faith. Nobody, and no faith, is perfect, this side of eternity.

And a few more hugs might not go amiss.

u speak of taking responsibility yet u cant even accept what every self-respecting historian has said. that nazis were protestants who went to church. U deliberately twisted my words as if to say I was speaking about Hitler himself. I was talking about the entire german nation. Do u actually deny they were/are westerners & Christians? only 1 german catholic church is on record for ever having spoken out against the jewish genocide. & even after bushs’ blatant lies & killing he was re-elected partly on his ‘christian values’ campaign?! That’s an amazing contradiction.

& most muslims have spoken out. Its not really newsworthy tho.

….Otherwise I wholeheartedly agree with what u said. to be just & take responsibility, even against fellow muslims or fellow Christians.

4:135 O you who believe! Stand out firmly for justice, as witnesses to Allah, even though it be against yourselves, or your parents, or your kin, be he rich or poor, Allah is a Better Protector to both (than you). So follow not the lusts (of your hearts), lest you may avoid justice, and if you distort your witness or refuse to give it, verily, Allah is Ever Well Acquainted with what you do.

-peace.

 

[MahaSudarshanChakra]

not even for comfort? wheres the logic in that?

It is apparently only a cultural difference. I dont personally prefer this hugging. There can be love and affection without touching - a hand shake? Not sure if a religion must forcibly enforce this.

 

[bunnysfriend]

It is apparently only a cultural difference. I dont personally prefer this hugging. There can be love and affection without touching - a hand shake? Not sure if a religion must forcibly enforce this.

if someone is upset, a hand shake is less comfoting than a hug.