HUGE stumbling block for husband

[HumbleBee]

so kbean,

Since you wanna win your hubby to Jesus, recount what you said about his Dad and deceased friends because no one can say for sure exactly where they are. You will be more effective in your witness in demonstrating a loving, merciful God. Certainly, encourage your hubby that he can be thoroughly assured of eternal life as he asks Christ to be his personal Saviour!

John 3:16 For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.

John 10:10 I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full.

John 14:6 Jesus answered, I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

Acts 4:10-12 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole. This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner. Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Ephesians 2:8-10 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God-- not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.

Good works don't earn salvation, but are a by-product of a grateful heart and for the glory of God!

Revelation 21:4-5 He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away. He who was seated on the throne said, "I am making everything new!" Then He said, "Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true."

 

[kbean]

again, thanks Humblebee, I love the lists of scripture you leave in your messages, they are the most helpful thing of all! You are generous with your time and knowledge in Christ and I thank God and you for that.

 

[Alternate Carpark]

He says he can't be bothered trying to picture the expression on his father's face right now as he screams and 'gnashes' his teeth...etc.

I would get your husband to picture his father screaming and gnashing his teeth.
Because I would think one of the main things that causes his father pain is agonising over the possibility that his son will one day be in the same place he is.

I'm sure if his father could contact him, he would tell him to never end up where he is.

Apart from that I would show the reality of God though your life toward your husband, on a consistant basis. Your husband has preconceived ideas about the motives and character of God, blurred over by grief of his father's death and destination.

So we counteract these thoughts with the truth of God and His great love for us.
Remember it's not that God "couldn't" save his father, but God was not "allowed" to save him because of the choice his father made to reject salvation.

Life is cruel sometimes, but it is still life and it must be lived through, not avoided.

 

[desi]

I have never heard that before. What it sounds like you are saying is that deeds or works get us to Heaven, not simply by grace and faith? What do you mean by "your ticket is punched" by being nice?

Matthew 25: 31-46 explains how what we do determines our fate in eternity.

 

[Yitzchak]

It is God's right and priviledge to decide the eternal fate of everyone...... Of course we like to think we know about our friends and loved ones....but only God knows who made it and who didn't.....
I could sit here and make a list of those I think made it to heaven such as Billy Graham and mother teresa or whoever.....but we might all have a slightly different list......Your husband is entitled to his list and you are to yours as long as it is kept in mind that God doesn;t check our lists to see who gets in or not.. So the question is not whether his father made my list or your list or any person's list....no matter how good we think our reasoning is and how biblical we think it is........Bottomline , God decides......Romans chapter 9 has a verse in it which is a quote of a passage in Exodus which records the lord speaking to Moses when God showed Moses his glory.....in the verse, the Lord says "I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy and compassion on whom I will have compassion" I think this verse answers both questions your husband has quite well.
Maybe the fact that some die of cancer should give us all puase and make us think that perhaps we don't have God figured out quite as well as we think we do. And if our logic fails us about that issue, is it not possible that our logic could fail once again concerning who gets to heaven......
The bottomline is it is ultimately in the hands of God. However frustrated we get at God's decisions, we still all have to deal with God sooner or later.....Our part is to decide what to do concerning that now. I know my choice to be asking for mercy for myself and as many as I can intercede for.

 

[Rage4Christ]

kbean, i used to struggle with skepticism-- perhaps I can give you a different perspective. I don't know if it will help, but, if I were in your husband's shoes (while I was a skeptic) and heard what you've said to him, I would be very disapointed and hurt.

The one phrase, where you said he's in denial of reality.. is really a sticking point to me. The thing here is to understand that the Problem of Evil is a significant one. All good Christians should struggle with this concept. To brush it off, as a "denial of reality" does a disservice to the ethical, metaphysical and moral implications of an all powerful God that either "allows" or "causes" (there is no distinction when you consider God has infinite power) evil or suffering.

He needs to come to grips with his sense of Justice, and the unconditional love of Christ. This is alot of work. Though I sense you do genuinely feel Christ's love-- I fear you haven't completely contemplated the moral and ethical choices that you made, when you accepted Christ. Its as if you have accepted Christ not fully aware of the powerful philosophical consequences. Christ can change one's heart, but the turning of the mind depends completely on the individual. From the hard work of self-reflection on: what is it to be human? What is it to punish? What is it about natural conseqences vs. imposed consequences and can we use those same standards to evaluate God. Where does Christ's love fit into a burning hell story?

Your walk with Christ should always be a struggle. If for some reason you feel secure in your faith, that you have the answers and no longer need to contemplate things.. that is a dangerous place to be. You're no longer living the active, thinking, feeling, loving path of Christ, but you're glowering down from the high throne of judgement.

You should really listen to your husband, explore his feelings and his rationale. Pray and reflect. You must answer the Problem of Evil question for yourself, rather than blame your husband for "stumbling" on this issue-- while you ignore the fact it has already caused you to trip as well.

 

[Sketcher]

I would get your husband to picture his father screaming and gnashing his teeth.
Because I would think one of the main things that causes his father pain is agonising over the possibility that his son will one day be in the same place he is.

I don't know about that. I would only do that if God Himself told me to at the time.

I'm sure if his father could contact him, he would tell him to never end up where he is.

That I do agree with.

Kbean, I would just pray for him faithfully and intensely. Surrender your husband to God, who loves him more than you do and wants him saved more than you do. This is a problem that only God can overcome. If God draws him into His family, your husband will eventually make peace with his father's death.

 

[kbean]

kbean, i used to struggle with skepticism-- perhaps I can give you a different perspective. I don't know if it will help, but, if I were in your husband's shoes (while I was a skeptic) and heard what you've said to him, I would be very disapointed and hurt.

The one phrase, where you said he's in denial of reality.. is really a sticking point to me. The thing here is to understand that the Problem of Evil is a significant one. All good Christians should struggle with this concept. To brush it off, as a "denial of reality" does a disservice to the ethical, metaphysical and moral implications of an all powerful God that either "allows" or "causes" (there is no distinction when you consider God has infinite power) evil or suffering.

He needs to come to grips with his sense of Justice, and the unconditional love of Christ. This is alot of work. Though I sense you do genuinely feel Christ's love-- I fear you haven't completely contemplated the moral and ethical choices that you made, when you accepted Christ. Its as if you have accepted Christ not fully aware of the powerful philosophical consequences. Christ can change one's heart, but the turning of the mind depends completely on the individual. From the hard work of self-reflection on: what is it to be human? What is it to punish? What is it about natural conseqences vs. imposed consequences and can we use those same standards to evaluate God. Where does Christ's love fit into a burning hell story?

Your walk with Christ should always be a struggle. If for some reason you feel secure in your faith, that you have the answers and no longer need to contemplate things.. that is a dangerous place to be. You're no longer living the active, thinking, feeling, loving path of Christ, but you're glowering down from the high throne of judgement.

You should really listen to your husband, explore his feelings and his rationale. Pray and reflect. You must answer the Problem of Evil question for yourself, rather than blame your husband for "stumbling" on this issue-- while you ignore the fact it has already caused you to trip as well.

Hi again....
I am not sure where I specifically said my husband is in "denial of reality" can you show me? Don't worry I am not defending my position at all, in fact I am willinging to admit I am lost on this subject, which is why I asked for advice. So don't worry I won't argue your points, but I do have to admit I am not sure where they apply to this situation, probably from my own limited understandings I am sure. I am sorry but I feel like you've spoken another language to me that I can't decipher, no matter how many times I read with an open mind your message to me....Problem of Evil issue? I think you may have read more into my question than I anticipated. But thanks for your thoughts anyway

 

[James Barnett]

He does Believe !

He wants to know how he could possibly believe in a God who:
1. didn't save his dad from cancer,

He does Believe !

. how could he possibly enter a faith in which he has to believe

He does Believe !

because he would have to accept this painful reality and that is just way too much for him.

He does Believe !

he says everyone else that has died that he has been close to was not a Christian either, so they are all in hell burning forever....his dear friends.

He does Believe !

He says he can't be bothered trying.

He does Believe !

Reality for him is that his father is just resting in peace.

He does Believe ! He is angry, but Amen Brothers and Sisters, He does Believe !

 

[kbean]

I don't get it. He doesn't believe. Trust me. Not sure how you came to this. My husband is not debating whether to believe or not, he is stating that I shouldn't belong to a faith that has these 'conditions' (hell etc.). And he is stating that that is why he could never belong to a faith like this.

Update....my DH has stuck to it. He said last night our marriage is pointless and he's only here for the kids...I'm just too different now that I'm a CHristian and I am not the woman he married (when we married I was lost and thought pornography was okay, a 'guy' thing. Now I won't be intimate with him because he insists that sex is still based on porn type mentality, and not spiritual...and I insist that porn is not allowed in the house and want to explore a spiritual approach to sex.. he won't have that...things are getting bad and he is even more dead set against Christians .)

 

[James Barnett]

Wow, I thought I was helping. I am sorry about your life. The way the world exploites women, I'll be amazed if any of us get to heaven. Also, I just thaught he believed in Hell, if so, then he believes in Heaven, thus God. I am very, very sorry for thinking I could help.

 

[kbean]

James, no hard feelings brother. You were only trying to help and were right in thinking you could try, so no apologies neccessary... don't stop wanting to help others and don't be discouraged!!

 

[TheMainException]

God never wanted things to be this way, God can't help that we humans chose death over life. But to help us out, jesus was sent to take our place and save us from hell. Just keep praying for him. That is the best way, pray that you will know how to minister in the correct ways and that your husband would see the light.