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How to show an atheist the possibility of God

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morse86

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The bible says to not waste time getting into "worldly debates". Most nonbelievers don't even believe in evolution.

People keep talking about the athiest and focusing on them. What about the Hindus? What about the Shintoists? What about the Buddhists? Who is going to give them the gospel?

Who is going to pull them out of the eternel fire?

Romans 10:15:
And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

Isaiah 52:7:
How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace; that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation; that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth!
 
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Givemeareason

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Go ask a recent immigrant whether they believe people came from monkeys. They will laugh at you.

If you said that I would laugh at you too. I thought you were talking about non-believers. If you were looking at all non-believers I would suspect most don't even know what science is much less evolution.
Go ask a recent immigrant whether they believe people came from monkeys. They will laugh at you.
 
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morse86

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If you said that I would laugh at you too. I thought you were talking about non-believers. If you were looking at all non-believers I would suspect most don't even know what science is much less evolution.

Please don't group evolution, which is a religion, with science. Evolution is a science falsely called.

The wisdom of the world if foolishness unto God. The wisdom of God is foolishness unto the world.

Evolution is mandated in the indoctrination system called "education". If you repeat it 9000 times, you will also believe it is true.

Outside of the US, people don't care about evolution nor do they believe it.
 
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Givemeareason

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Go ask a recent immigrant whether they believe people came from monkeys. They will laugh at you.
All I have ever heard is that we have a common lineage with monkeys. Are you aware we have a common lineage with amoebas as well?
 
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morse86

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All I have ever heard is that we have a common lineage with monkeys. Are you aware we have a common lineage with amoebas as well?

No, at what point did God breath the breath of life into amoeba? At what point did God say to the amoeba, this is my only begotten son?!?!?!?!?!?!

I don't care about the amoebas or the monkeys. Look, God created us. I don't try to look for "commonality". Just like I don't look for "commonality" between a Jaguar Mark II and a nonstick frying pan.

Jesus said after he is gone, we are to be the light of the world. I don't want to be engaged in "Neverending Worldly Debates"....I want to pull people out of the fire...be profitable on to Christ.

So what if a bunch of athiests want to be "wise men" according to the world.
 
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Givemeareason

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No, at what point did God breath the breath of life into amoeba? At what point did God say to the amoeba, this is my only begotten son?!?!?!?!?!?!

I don't care about the amoebas or the monkeys. Look, God created us. I don't try to look for "commonality". Just like I don't look for "commonality" between a Jaguar Mark II and a nonstick frying pan.
I don't know because I wasn't there. But since amoebas are alive he must have. Science which includes evolution often looks for commonalities.
 
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morse86

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I don't know because I wasn't there. But since amoebas are alive he must have. Science which includes evolution often looks for commonalities.

I can find several commonalities between a Jaguar Mark II and a nonstick frying pan. Look a piece of aluminium metal in the ground. Obviously, the Mark II evolved into a frying pan. Let's publish in the scientifical journals so the Satanic process...I mean the Peer Review process will approve it.

Yeah I found a piece of aluminium, it's a Mark II and a frying pan, it's science!
 
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Davian

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I can find several commonalities between a Jaguar Mark II and a nonstick frying pan. Look a piece of aluminium metal in the ground. Obviously, the Mark II evolved into a frying pan. Let's publish in the scientifical journals so the Satanic process...I mean the Peer Review process will approve it.

Yeah I found a piece of aluminium, it's a Mark II and a frying pan, it's science!
Do you have anything to contribute towards the title of this thread?
 
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Davian

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Okay guys, here's another analogy that I believe is very strong in showing the truth of the Bible. This is based on the question of greater importance, seeking God first or seeking Truth first.

Lets imagine that God is like the physical sun that brings all biological life to earth and God's Word the Bible can be thought of as sunscreen.

Man has observed and experienced the power of the sun for as long as we've lived on earth. We realized the sun has the power to burn our skin long before we even realized it has the power to give life to all biology on earth. As we became more intelligent we began to realize we can use natural chemicals to create a cream that can protect our skin from being burnt by the sun. This cream is sunscreen and can be thought of as God's Word the Bible. Eventually we became even more intelligent and realized through observing all the properties of the sun that its purpose isn't to burn our skin, but rather, its purpose is to give and sustain all biological life on earth.

Even so, the sun still has the power to burn our skin. (The actual burn can be thought of as evil. Evil is not God's purpose, but He allows it to remind us of His true power.) So we've developed sunscreen using our knowledge of the sun and all its properties. A man can either tell others how to make the sunscreen or simply pass on the original true formula to others because making it is a very long complex process and a man might get the formula wrong (This is a way to think about how so many other religions came from one True source, but they have the wrong formula).

One man who received the true sunscreen applied it completely and thoroughly to his skin and was fully protected when he went outside. This man would realize when he'd been out for too long because he would begin to feel the burn, so he would go back in and reapply the true sunscreen. When the sunscreen is applied correctly, our skin becomes a beautiful golden brown. (This man can be thought of as an honest God seeking man).

The sun rays that contact the skin can be thought of as the Holy Spirit. When a man reads the Bible and is focused on listening to God's Holy Spirit, he will be blessed.

Another man received the true sunscreen and didn't apply it completely to his skin, but he honestly thought he did. When he went outside he was burnt severely because he thought he was completely protected, but he wasn't. He may even go back inside and reapply the sunscreen, but again not completely. When he goes back out he will get burnt severely again in the same spot and the burn will be even deeper. If he continues doing this the burn will be so focused and deep that it may threaten his very life and he will be forced to realize the power of the sun first hand. If the man is wise he will realize the true power of the sun, but not because he knew the suns power and was fully protected by the sunscreen, but because he honestly thought he was fully protected, but the sun showed him its true power. He will then realize he needs to apply the sunscreen completely and thoroughly in order to fully protect himself from getting burnt again. He will be driven to apply the sun screen very thoroughly and completely because he now has a deep understanding of sun's power that he may not have realized had he applied the sunscreen completely in the first place (This man can be thought of as an honest Truth seeking man).

Yet another man may have received a sunscreen with the wrong formula. When he went outside he was also burnt severely, but continued using the same sunscreen and continued to get burnt. This is a foolish man who would be better off leaving the wrong sunscreen off and then going outside and experiencing the burn of the sun on his bare skin in order to realize its true power as the honest Truth seeking man did. This man could apply the correct sunscreen, but this would be even more difficult since he was already using a sunscreen that had the wrong formula (Men and women of other religions need to honestly seek Truth instead of their "god" in order to find the one True God and His True Word the Bible. If they are using a perverted version of the Bible or a text of a different religion it would be very difficult for them to go from these wrong sources to the true source the Bible, when they already believe their wrong source is the true source).

If one honestly questions Truth to the fullest, he will come to a complete unshakeable belief in the absolute truth. Evil will do everything to stop him (hence the severe focused burn required to realize the true sun's power first hand).

If a man knows about the true sunscreen, but continues going outside without the sunscreen he will continue to get burnt every time. This kind of man would be considered a very foolish man. If a man is so foolish to continue doing this, eventually his skin will become so dark that he will begin to not even notice the burn and when this happens he will now look at the sunscreen as having no value to him at all. However, even though this foolish man doesn't notice the burn, he is still being burnt severely. The burn is just causing his skin to get darker and darker and the severeness of the burn itself becomes more and more unnoticeable. This very foolish man now has no fear of the sun's power and is oblivious to the burns. The burns are the sun's reminder to him of it's power. The burn itself can be thought of as evil. Evil is not God's purpose, however he allows it to be a reminder of His power. Evil only came from the creation of free willed beings who are free to choose a will that is opposite of God's Will. Evil is not God's intended purpose. God's intended purpose is to give eternal life to all spiritual beings. The one True God has sacrificed Himself to save man from evil because He loves us.

Now back to the analogy. Science tells us that the sun will eventually explode into a red giant and engulf the earth in an fiery explosion beyond all comprehension as enormous as the earth's orbit. If we imagine man still being on earth when this happens we can imagine that the wise man has a sunscreen so strong that it might protect him from the harm of this red giant (at least he can hope it will protect him). The foolish man who has never used the sunscreen may still think he doesn't need it because he may not believe that the sun will explode into a red giant, even though many have told him this will happen.

When the time comes for the sun to explode we can imagine it might give some kind of warning that all men on earth could see and feel. This warning might be an intense heat that is a precursor to the real explosion. The wise men who have thoroughly and completely applied their sunscreen will be spared from this intense heat (this can be thought of as the rapture of the Church of Christ). The men who haven't applied the true sunscreen or haven't applied it completely will have to endure the intense heat and realize the true power of the sun. These foolish men will either become wise by applying the true sunscreen thoroughly and completely or they will continue to be foolish and only apply the true sunscreen partially.

The wise man is prepared with his skin completely covered in sunscreen and is ready for the real red giant explosion. The foolish man who hasn't completely applied the sunscreen may think he is ready for the absolute burning heat of the red giant, but doesn't realize that he hasn't correctly applied the sunscreen to his skin. When the unimaginable burning heat of the red giant explosion engulfs the earth, all men still on earth will experience a burning heat never felt by any man on earth before. (This can represent the interpretation of the tribulation time when even wise men of God will be physically tortured by evil to force them to denounce their faith. If they can persevere through this unimaginable physical torture they will be given ever lasting life. The other foolish men will not be able to withstand this physical torture because they don't have true faith and will die a painful death, but even after death the suffering has just begun)

To further illustrate this separation of the foolish man from God after tribulation, lets go back to the analogy. Lets imagine the foolish man was able to somehow survive the red giant explosion. There would be no point for him to continue using the true sunscreen because the sun will now be a white dwarf and have no power to burn him, nor will it have the power to sustain life on earth any longer. The man can still see the faint glimmer of the white dwarf, but it's power is gone from him, it can't even give him light to see. This man will be left separated from the sun in complete darkness, accept for the faint glimmer, which is only a reminder of his separation from the sun. We can imagine this very foolish man would have deep regret so unimagineable for refusing the true sunscreen for so long (This can illustrate how even when man is completely separated from God, they will still be able to see a vagueness of heaven and be constantly reminded of their separation from God).

Just as the sun gives life to all biology on earth, God gives life to all spirituality on earth and in heaven for all eternity. If the sun goes away all life on earth goes away. If God goes away, all hope of an eternal life of joy and happiness goes away and all that's left is an empty life of pure suffering. This is where I believe science has lead many intelligent people. They are seeking truth, but they're not realizing the source of that truth. They are going outside without sunscreen and continuing to get burnt, not realizing that it is the sun's power that burns them.

The sun has the power to burn us but this isn't its purpose, its purpose is to give life to all biology on earth. Even if our skin gets burnt by the sun, our bodies, having been given life by the sun, have developed a way to heal this burn, but we can't let our bodies continue to get burnt, we must use sunscreen. God's Word the Bible is our spiritual sunscreen. The wise will realize this and be promised everlasting life when they completely and thoroughly apply the Truth of the Bible to their lives. Even men who were once foolish will realize this and also be promised everlasting life. Only the very foolish may not realize this in time. They will be given many many chances to change their minds, but not an unlimited amount of chances. Eventually in about 4 billion years the sun will explode into an unimaginable red giant and engulf the earth.

I believe God will return much sooner. A man should use the Bible as his sunscreen to learn how soon God may return and prepare his soul for His return. If he refuses the Bible or thinks he's applied the Bible to his life, yet still puts his will above God's Will then he would be better off honestly seeking Truth instead. I believe science has gotten us to a point of knowledge about our universe that allows a man to honestly seek Truth and God will reveal himself to the man. Science is stuck on the phenomena of quantum physics. It seems they'll come up with anything other than the simple idea of God. In addition, this very analogy would not have been possible to think of before we discovered our sun would eventually explode into a red giant and then become a white dwarf for the better part of eternity. I believe this is a testament to the Trueness of the Bible because if you've read Revelation you'll see the correlation.

Honestly seeking Truth is the more difficult way to realize God's Truth and Power because a man will get burnt severely, but getting burnt severely once and becoming wise from it is better than foolishly getting burnt many times and becoming numb to the burn. If a man can overcome that initial severe burn and become wise from it, he will heal and will know God's Truth deeply because the burn will have gone so deep that it will have threatened his very soul. All he needs to do is realize how powerful God is to have burnt him so deeply. Once he realizes that power and accepts the fact that this all powerful God has sacrificed Himself for him, he will heal and become a new man dressed in the power of Jesus Christ. This new man will have an unshakable faith and will always use the source of Truth the Bible first before living his life and acting on his new Kingdom purpose.

Again, just an analogy, take it or leave it, the truth is in the Bible which is inspired by the Holy Spirit.
"I have the truth, so there!"

I could have saved you all of that typing.
 
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Oafman

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Outside of the US, people don't care about evolution nor do they believe it.
Oh really?
dsg507_500_350.jpg
 
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Cearbhall

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Outside of the US, people don't care about evolution nor do they believe it.
Oh buddy, we are waayy down the list when it comes to acceptance of evolution in first-world countries. The US is very unique in that it's so developed and yet still has such a high rate of religiosity. We wouldn't even be having this discussion in many other first-world countries.
 
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[serious]

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So if you believe objective reality is absolute how can you hold the position of an atheist? I see your faith is non-denominational so maybe you don't claim to be an atheist. Either way, look at this graphic again, it clearly shows that in order to be an atheist you must not believe in absolutes at all, because you must believe nothing exists beyond your own consciousness, in other words to be an atheist you must believe your conscious mind is the only thing to ever exist.

The issue your chart runs into is the excluded middle, or false dilemma fallacy. Absolute consciousness (by way of theism) or nothing (by way of atheism.)

However, lets take a look at a less nihilistic atheism:
an objective reality exists that is purely natural and no supernatural exists. Consciousness exists as a purely natural phenomenon. That is probably a better approximation of the most common atheist viewpoint but is not addressed on your chart.
 
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Chriliman

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The issue your chart runs into is the excluded middle, or false dilemma fallacy. Absolute consciousness (by way of theism) or nothing (by way of atheism.)

However, lets take a look at a less nihilistic atheism:
an objective reality exists that is purely natural and no supernatural exists. Consciousness exists as a purely natural phenomenon. That is probably a better approximation of the most common atheist viewpoint but is not addressed on your chart.

It actually does address the view point that consciousness exists as a purely natural phenomenon because this view point has not been proven or disproven and so requires belief. Just like the existence of God has not been proven or disproven and so requires belief. Even the same can be said for the Big Bang theory or singularity or any other scientific theory regarding the origins of the universe, it has not been proven or disproven and so requires belief. It all comes down to belief, which is also what I've been saying throughout this entire thread.

Besides if you believe consciousness in humans arose as a purely natural "phenomenon" then you must believe that consciousness is absolute. In other words if you believe consciousness is real, then it does not depend on any subjective individual's consciousness to exist. If it does not depend on any subjective individual's consciousness to exist then consciousness is absolute. We can never hope to be able to comprehend absolute consciousness because it would be infinite by our minds definition and we are incapable of understanding infinities. How does the God of the Holy Bible describe Himself? As infinite and all knowing, seems to fit the "description" of absolute consciousness.
 
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Loudmouth

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Okay guys, here's another analogy that I believe is very strong in showing the truth of the Bible. This is based on the question of greater importance, seeking God first or seeking Truth first.

Lets imagine that God is like the physical sun that brings all biological life to earth and God's Word the Bible can be thought of as sunscreen.

Man has observed and experienced the power of the sun for as long as we've lived on earth. We realized the sun has the power to burn our skin long before we even realized it has the power to give life to all biology on earth. As we became more intelligent we began to realize we can use natural chemicals to create a cream that can protect our skin from being burnt by the sun. This cream is sunscreen and can be thought of as God's Word the Bible. Eventually we became even more intelligent and realized through observing all the properties of the sun that its purpose isn't to burn our skin, but rather, its purpose is to give and sustain all biological life on earth.

Even so, the sun still has the power to burn our skin. (The actual burn can be thought of as evil. Evil is not God's purpose, but He allows it to remind us of His true power.) So we've developed sunscreen using our knowledge of the sun and all its properties. A man can either tell others how to make the sunscreen or simply pass on the original true formula to others because making it is a very long complex process and a man might get the formula wrong (This is a way to think about how so many other religions came from one True source, but they have the wrong formula).

One man who received the true sunscreen applied it completely and thoroughly to his skin and was fully protected when he went outside. This man would realize when he'd been out for too long because he would begin to feel the burn, so he would go back in and reapply the true sunscreen. When the sunscreen is applied correctly, our skin becomes a beautiful golden brown. (This man can be thought of as an honest God seeking man).

The sun rays that contact the skin can be thought of as the Holy Spirit. When a man reads the Bible and is focused on listening to God's Holy Spirit, he will be blessed.

Another man received the true sunscreen and didn't apply it completely to his skin, but he honestly thought he did. When he went outside he was burnt severely because he thought he was completely protected, but he wasn't. He may even go back inside and reapply the sunscreen, but again not completely. When he goes back out he will get burnt severely again in the same spot and the burn will be even deeper. If he continues doing this the burn will be so focused and deep that it may threaten his very life and he will be forced to realize the power of the sun first hand. If the man is wise he will realize the true power of the sun, but not because he knew the suns power and was fully protected by the sunscreen, but because he honestly thought he was fully protected, but the sun showed him its true power. He will then realize he needs to apply the sunscreen completely and thoroughly in order to fully protect himself from getting burnt again. He will be driven to apply the sun screen very thoroughly and completely because he now has a deep understanding of sun's power that he may not have realized had he applied the sunscreen completely in the first place (This man can be thought of as an honest Truth seeking man).

Yet another man may have received a sunscreen with the wrong formula. When he went outside he was also burnt severely, but continued using the same sunscreen and continued to get burnt. This is a foolish man who would be better off leaving the wrong sunscreen off and then going outside and experiencing the burn of the sun on his bare skin in order to realize its true power as the honest Truth seeking man did. This man could apply the correct sunscreen, but this would be even more difficult since he was already using a sunscreen that had the wrong formula (Men and women of other religions need to honestly seek Truth instead of their "god" in order to find the one True God and His True Word the Bible. If they are using a perverted version of the Bible or a text of a different religion it would be very difficult for them to go from these wrong sources to the true source the Bible, when they already believe their wrong source is the true source).

If one honestly questions Truth to the fullest, he will come to a complete unshakeable belief in the absolute truth. Evil will do everything to stop him (hence the severe focused burn required to realize the true sun's power first hand).

If a man knows about the true sunscreen, but continues going outside without the sunscreen he will continue to get burnt every time. This kind of man would be considered a very foolish man. If a man is so foolish to continue doing this, eventually his skin will become so dark that he will begin to not even notice the burn and when this happens he will now look at the sunscreen as having no value to him at all. However, even though this foolish man doesn't notice the burn, he is still being burnt severely. The burn is just causing his skin to get darker and darker and the severeness of the burn itself becomes more and more unnoticeable. This very foolish man now has no fear of the sun's power and is oblivious to the burns. The burns are the sun's reminder to him of it's power. The burn itself can be thought of as evil. Evil is not God's purpose, however he allows it to be a reminder of His power. Evil only came from the creation of free willed beings who are free to choose a will that is opposite of God's Will. Evil is not God's intended purpose. God's intended purpose is to give eternal life to all spiritual beings. The one True God has sacrificed Himself to save man from evil because He loves us.

Now back to the analogy. Science tells us that the sun will eventually explode into a red giant and engulf the earth in an fiery explosion beyond all comprehension as enormous as the earth's orbit. If we imagine man still being on earth when this happens we can imagine that the wise man has a sunscreen so strong that it might protect him from the harm of this red giant (at least he can hope it will protect him). The foolish man who has never used the sunscreen may still think he doesn't need it because he may not believe that the sun will explode into a red giant, even though many have told him this will happen.

When the time comes for the sun to explode we can imagine it might give some kind of warning that all men on earth could see and feel. This warning might be an intense heat that is a precursor to the real explosion. The wise men who have thoroughly and completely applied their sunscreen will be spared from this intense heat (this can be thought of as the rapture of the Church of Christ). The men who haven't applied the true sunscreen or haven't applied it completely will have to endure the intense heat and realize the true power of the sun. These foolish men will either become wise by applying the true sunscreen thoroughly and completely or they will continue to be foolish and only apply the true sunscreen partially.

The wise man is prepared with his skin completely covered in sunscreen and is ready for the real red giant explosion. The foolish man who hasn't completely applied the sunscreen may think he is ready for the absolute burning heat of the red giant, but doesn't realize that he hasn't correctly applied the sunscreen to his skin. When the unimaginable burning heat of the red giant explosion engulfs the earth, all men still on earth will experience a burning heat never felt by any man on earth before. (This can represent the interpretation of the tribulation time when even wise men of God will be physically tortured by evil to force them to denounce their faith. If they can persevere through this unimaginable physical torture they will be given ever lasting life. The other foolish men will not be able to withstand this physical torture because they don't have true faith and will die a painful death, but even after death the suffering has just begun)

To further illustrate this separation of the foolish man from God after tribulation, lets go back to the analogy. Lets imagine the foolish man was able to somehow survive the red giant explosion. There would be no point for him to continue using the true sunscreen because the sun will now be a white dwarf and have no power to burn him, nor will it have the power to sustain life on earth any longer. The man can still see the faint glimmer of the white dwarf, but it's power is gone from him, it can't even give him light to see. This man will be left separated from the sun in complete darkness, accept for the faint glimmer, which is only a reminder of his separation from the sun. We can imagine this very foolish man would have deep regret so unimagineable for refusing the true sunscreen for so long (This can illustrate how even when man is completely separated from God, they will still be able to see a vagueness of heaven and be constantly reminded of their separation from God).

Just as the sun gives life to all biology on earth, God gives life to all spirituality on earth and in heaven for all eternity. If the sun goes away all life on earth goes away. If God goes away, all hope of an eternal life of joy and happiness goes away and all that's left is an empty life of pure suffering. This is where I believe science has lead many intelligent people. They are seeking truth, but they're not realizing the source of that truth. They are going outside without sunscreen and continuing to get burnt, not realizing that it is the sun's power that burns them.

The sun has the power to burn us but this isn't its purpose, its purpose is to give life to all biology on earth. Even if our skin gets burnt by the sun, our bodies, having been given life by the sun, have developed a way to heal this burn, but we can't let our bodies continue to get burnt, we must use sunscreen. God's Word the Bible is our spiritual sunscreen. The wise will realize this and be promised everlasting life when they completely and thoroughly apply the Truth of the Bible to their lives. Even men who were once foolish will realize this and also be promised everlasting life. Only the very foolish may not realize this in time. They will be given many many chances to change their minds, but not an unlimited amount of chances. Eventually in about 4 billion years the sun will explode into an unimaginable red giant and engulf the earth.

I believe God will return much sooner. A man should use the Bible as his sunscreen to learn how soon God may return and prepare his soul for His return. If he refuses the Bible or thinks he's applied the Bible to his life, yet still puts his will above God's Will then he would be better off honestly seeking Truth instead. I believe science has gotten us to a point of knowledge about our universe that allows a man to honestly seek Truth and God will reveal himself to the man. Science is stuck on the phenomena of quantum physics. It seems they'll come up with anything other than the simple idea of God. In addition, this very analogy would not have been possible to think of before we discovered our sun would eventually explode into a red giant and then become a white dwarf for the better part of eternity. I believe this is a testament to the Trueness of the Bible because if you've read Revelation you'll see the correlation.

Honestly seeking Truth is the more difficult way to realize God's Truth and Power because a man will get burnt severely, but getting burnt severely once and becoming wise from it is better than foolishly getting burnt many times and becoming numb to the burn. If a man can overcome that initial severe burn and become wise from it, he will heal and will know God's Truth deeply because the burn will have gone so deep that it will have threatened his very soul. All he needs to do is realize how powerful God is to have burnt him so deeply. Once he realizes that power and accepts the fact that this all powerful God has sacrificed Himself for him, he will heal and become a new man dressed in the power of Jesus Christ. This new man will have an unshakable faith and will always use the source of Truth the Bible first before living his life and acting on his new Kingdom purpose.

Again, just an analogy, take it or leave it, the truth is in the Bible which is inspired by the Holy Spirit.

I appreciate the effort, but you can't seem to get past one problem: assertions are just that, assertions. Claiming you have the Truth is not evidence that you have the Truth.
 
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Loudmouth

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It actually does address the view point that consciousness exists as a purely natural phenomenon because this view point has not been proven or disproven and so requires belief. Just like the existence of God has not been proven or disproven and so requires belief. Even the same can be said for the Big Bang theory or singularity or any other scientific theory regarding the origins of the universe, it has not been proven or disproven and so requires belief. It all comes down to belief, which is also what I've been saying throughout this entire thread.

All of the evidence is consistent with our consciousness being the physical property of our brains. When you damage the brain you damage consciousness. You can alter consciousness by altering the chemistry of the brain.

We also have plenty of evidence for the Big Bang, such as the cosmic microwave background.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_microwave_background

Besides if you believe consciousness in humans arose as a purely natural "phenomenon" then you must believe that consciousness is absolute. In other words if you believe consciousness is real, then it does not depend on any subjective individual's consciousness to exist. If it does not depend on any subjective individual's consciousness to exist then consciousness is absolute. We can never hope to be able to comprehend absolute consciousness because it would be infinite by our minds definition and we are incapable of understanding infinities. How does the God of the Holy Bible describe Himself? As infinite and all knowing, seems to fit the "description" of absolute consciousness.

Again, those are a lot of assertions with nothing to back them up.
 
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pshun2404

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Atheism is illogical because...

To know there is no God one would have to know and experience all things, because God could be within an area that they do not know or in which they have not experienced. Even if one were to have all the knowledge and experience of 50% of the Britannica, that would mean that there is 50% they cannot know nor have experienced. So to know God is not, one has to know all.

To know there is no God, one would have to be in all places simultaneously because God could or have revealed Himself in a place where you are not (even to someone now, somewhere else).

You would have to have known all and been everywhere during all of the past, the present, and in all possible futures in case God was revealing Himself when you were not.

Finally, you would have to be aware of all that which is and/or has been known or experienced by all individuals of all times, in case He had revealed Himself to only certain peoples, at certain times.

Now this is rational and logical but only the tip of the iceberg but it should suffice…

So in effect, to know there is no God, you would have to be omniscient, omnipresent, and eternal, and able to experience the experience of all others, for any who may be able to receive illumination or revelation that God is. So to believe with conviction that there is no God, one then has to be exactly what is called God thus proving GOd IS.

Paul
 
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