How to prove that GOD exists from a scientific point of view?

[YahuahSaves]

I used to be a Christian.

Are you talking traditional denomination or a direct relationship?
I understand, I grew up "Christian", but fell away from the Bible as being the explanation for God.

In my 50ish or so years I have had no such revelation, even during the half or so I was a believer. Nor has any one I know closely had such a revelation, believers and non-believers alike.

Well heart posture counts too... but again, it comes down to whether or not you believed in your heart, and spoke to God from your heart (1 on 1). Because of my upbringing I could never quite shake the belief (in my heart) of the Heavenly Father, but I created my own ideas until I entered a dark period in my life and just shut my mind to even thinking about such things...

But one day I cried out with a question to him (in my heart). And was filled in the spirit with a love I can't even describe.. I was so spiritually dead at this point I knew it wasn't from me. I was confused what was happening, and then I realised it was Jesus. (I'd never been taught the truth about the Son of God). But it was as if I always knew him and I wasn't afraid.

You would be surprised that for the creator of everything (seen and unseen) he would care about us, and our lives down here, but he cares so much, not about the things you would think either, but the little things. For example, how do you treat someone when you're having a rough time? Do you set you feelings aside with no complaints to help another? It's stuff like that that really counts to him.

I'm not trying to convince you with my story, but I hope one day you open your heart to seek him (Jesus) for yourself, because there is no one like him.

I lack the arrogance to think the creator of the Universe cares about me. I'm OK with that.

It's not arrogance, it's pride. He really does love you like no other can, for whatever reason we believe love like that isn't possible, but his love is not a human emotion.

It's why I do science, but don't waste your prayer time on me.

There's no such thing as wasted prayer.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Are you talking traditional denomination or a direct relationship?
I understand, I grew up "Christian", but fell away from the Bible as being the explanation for God.

Relationship makes no sense to me. Never did. Never will. How can one have a one-sided relationship?

Well heart posture counts too... [SNIP]

I'm not trying to convince you with my story,

And that's why I deleted it from my post. It wouldn't be convincing to anyone but you. (and that's OK)

It's not arrogance, it's pride. He really does love you like no other can, for whatever reason we believe love like that isn't possible, but his love is not a human emotion.

Pride, arrogance. Don't you people have some sayings about those?

There's no such thing as wasted prayer.

Only wasted time. Got any scientific proof of god? (See thread title.)

 

[YahuahSaves]

Relationship makes no sense to me. Never did. Never will. How can one have a one-sided relationship?

I have struggled with the same question.
The way I see it it's unlike a human conversation where you ask and get an immediate response. God (can) do that but it's our faith (trust) in him that is the key. If you believe in your heart he will answer, then he will but we have to be open to receiving that answer in the way he chooses to reveal it to you and accept what he reveals, even if it's not the answer we were looking for. But as far as relationships go, authentic ones are built on trust, and our relationship with God is no different in that aspect.

Pride, arrogance. Don't you people have some sayings about those?

It's pride to be so sure of Gods love (or lack there of) toward you when you don't even understand the relationship we're meant to have with him in the first place.
It's also pride to believe no God is needed when the very fact you are living and breathing at all is because of him.

Only wasted time. Got any scientific proof of god? (See thread title.)

As I've previously said to others on this forum, I no longer believe it necessary to depend on the ideas or opinions of human beings...
I like to converse with people, but if their statements are against Gods truth, then I set it aside.

You may think me feeble minded but I had a very hard heart not so long ago... God can and will make our hearts one of flesh once more if we ask him.

 

[Hans Blaster]

As I've previously said to others on this forum, I no longer believe it necessary to depend on the ideas or opinions of human beings...
I like to converse with people, but if their statements are against Gods truth, then I set it aside.

Then you are in the wrong thread and sub-forum. This is a thread about scientific evidence for god on a board about science.

 

[YahuahSaves]

Then you are in the wrong thread and sub-forum. This is a thread about scientific evidence for god on a board about science.

Like I said, I was responding to the OP which bought into question the Christian view.

If you take offence to my postings, then perhaps you shouldn't have responded to them. You are on a Christian forum after all.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Like I said, I was responding to the OP which bought into question the Christian view.

If you take offence to my postings, then perhaps you shouldn't have responded to them. You are on a Christian forum after all.

I don't take offense. I just am not interested in "faith". It bores me.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Oh, I don't think Paul was wrong. It's just that we have little or no idea as to what his exact referent was when he was writing to the Roman church.

I thought it was pretty clear: Everybody knows about what god did; everybody should worship him; those that don't are liable to their just punishment.

I'm surmising that, apart from mothers who kill their young, he had something like the following in mind when he said what he said:

View attachment 324350​

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It's just that today, we'd look at this behaviour scientifically and say, "Yep, there's an example of evolution! It's undeniable by definition."

Paul, by comparison and likely thinking according to both the Psalms and any essential philosophy of his own day, would have thought, "Where is God's moral order, you ask? It's THERE!!!" ...and he'd point to the mother duck and her ducklings as they casually waddled on by ...

I think you're trying too hard.

I doubt that Paul had any bits or pieces of Lucretius or Leonard Susskind in mind when he said what he said. Just my guess.

We could all use more Lucretius and less Paul (or just some Les Paul). Susskind, don't be silly.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

I thought it was pretty clear: Everybody knows about what god did; everybody should worship him; those that don't are liable to their just punishment.

Lol! Yeah, it'd be interesting if it was that simple. But it isn't.

I think you're trying too hard.

Still................I do like my "duck" idea and I think Paul could only have referred to concepts that would be fitting to his culture and time. But who knows? Maybe Paul read some Greek and Roman poets along the way; maybe he brushed up on a bite of Aristotle's 'Prime Mover' to say what he said. I mean, what's a guy from Tarsus gonna say when talking to a few Romans?

We could all use more Lucretius and less Paul (or just some Les Paul). Susskind, don't be silly.

Uh, me be silly? Paul had a time-machine, don't you know?

As for "Les Paul," I'm sure I need a lot more Les Paul in my life! So, Stryper song coming right up!!!

[Hey now! I saw you roll your eyes!]

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

... If you can't see that someone all powerful created everything we see around us (or even wondered about it), then you haven't been alive.

Yay! I'm a zombie!!

 

[Estrid]

Yay! I'm a zombie!!

It's the other way around. People who
look at everything and think they are
seeing "god" have their eyeballs looking
back at their own lil brains

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

... one day I cried out with a question to him (in my heart). And was filled in the spirit with a love I can't even describe.. I was so spiritually dead at this point I knew it wasn't from me. I was confused what was happening, and then I realised it was Jesus. (I'd never been taught the truth about the Son of God). But it was as if I always knew him and I wasn't afraid.

Vivid, ecstatic, revelatory, life-changing experiences can be produced in a number of ways, including psychotropic or psychedelic drugs, direct brain stimulation, temporal lobe epilepsy/seizure, and extreme stress or trauma. What we think we know and what is really the case don't always coincide.

Just saying.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

It's the other way around. People who
look at everything and think they are
seeing "god" have their eyeballs looking
back at their own lil brains

Brains!!

 

[Estrid]

Vivid, ecstatic, revelatory, life-changing experiences can be produced in a number of ways, including psychotropic or psychedelic drugs, direct brain stimulation, temporal lobe epilepsy/seizure, and extreme stress or trauma. What we think we know and what is really the case don't always coincide.

Just saying.

Many if not most relogious traditions
involve invoking said state of mind through
stress inducing activities such as fasting
chanting etc. As you are pointing out.
No doubt each, ignorant of the mechanism
and how common it is thru cultures,
thinks it is unique to them and theirs.

 

[SelfSim]

Vivid, ecstatic, revelatory, life-changing experiences can be produced in a number of ways, including psychotropic or psychedelic drugs, direct brain stimulation, temporal lobe epilepsy/seizure, and extreme stress or trauma.

Intentionally induced life-changing experiences don't necessarily have to be quite as extreme as the ones you mention there.
IMO, something deep in our mind happens, (like a trigger effect or something), when largish groups of humans do quite natural, focused things (eg: chanting, singing, openly sharing forums, etc). The end experience can be quite positive, although, it can also easily be steered in the opposite direction (death cults, etc). I liken the trigger as being kind of along the lines of the resonance effect in physics(?)

Perhaps the trigger sets off resonance of deeply inherited psychological aspects in the human mind, (courtesy of evolution) .. Perhaps analogous with, (but related to), birds flocking, fish schooling, wolf pack hunting, etc?

 

[YahuahSaves]

Yay! I'm a zombie!!

The bible talks about spiritual life and spiritual death - that's what I'm referring to. Before coming to Christ we're "dead" in transgressions and sin.

Ezekiel 37:1-14

 

[YahuahSaves]

Vivid, ecstatic, revelatory, life-changing experiences can be produced in a number of ways, including psychotropic or psychedelic drugs, direct brain stimulation, temporal lobe epilepsy/seizure, and extreme stress or trauma. What we think we know and what is really the case don't always coincide.

Just saying.

Of course, all relevant points.
But it was none of the above.
"Seek and you shall find, knock and the door will be opened to you".

Do your own seeking, I guarantee for those with a heart earnestly seeking the Lord, he will reveal himself.

P.s. my experience wasn't "invoked" through religious practices- when the Lord reveals himself it's his decision, it has nothing to do with what we do, it's simply our heart posture toward him. And not to mention at the time, I didn't believe in Jesus as God - I only believed in the Heavenly Father (from my Christian upbringing) I thought Jesus was just a man as I was taught. He isn't, Jesus is the living God. The only reason I mentioned part of my story of coming to Christ, is because I want people to know just how kind, merciful, loving, faithful and true he really is.

 

[SelfSim]

The bible talks about spiritual life and spiritual death - that's what I'm referring to. Before coming to Christ we're "dead" in transgressions and sin.

Ezekiel 37:1-14

.. and perhaps that is just a superficial explanation (and forced agenda) of something which was always deeply embedded in human psychology, written by largely uneducated people, a long time ago(?)
I'm at least prepared to consider the essence of what may be an observation of very human behaviours .. (without the forced overtones/overlays of domination over others ..)

 

[YahuahSaves]

.. and perhaps that is just a superficial explanation (and forced agenda) of something which was always deeply embedded in human psychology, written by largely uneducated people, a long time ago(?)
I'm at least prepared to consider the essence of what may be an observation of very human behaviours .. (without the forced overtones/overlays of domination over others ..)

If you misunderstood then you don't understand spiritual life. Read the passage of scripture I quoted, Ezekiels vision is showing God is the only one that can bring us back from (spiritual) death.

 

[YahuahSaves]

(without the forced overtones/overlays of domination over others ..)

Who's dominating? I just want people to know who Jesus really is - the express nature of the living God - just as real and alive today as he was then. He is wonderful, merciful, kind, faithful and just. Seek for yourself - all are welcome at the table.

 

[Tinker Grey]

Do your own seeking, I guarantee for those with a heart earnestly seeking the Lord, he will reveal himself.

I was a Christian for 44 years. My last few years will filled with tears and turmoil begging God to reveal himself. You know what I got? Silence.

And if you are going to respond that I wasn't doing it right, don't.