How to become a Calvinist in 5 easy steps

[Clare73]

You are fully satisfied with a formula that nobody knows/understands what it is? Okay.

Are you sure that attitude is significantly better than that of cults? And can you explain how it is better?

The satisfied have to need to justify their satisfaction. . .

 

[Clare73]

BTW, are you changing the subject here?

I was referring specifically to the Hypostatic Union, not to the general doctrine of the Trinity. I'm a Trinitarian of course.

That works for me also.

 

[zoidar]

Are they the only ones who know how it is used?

Are there not other great divines who also know how it is used?

Who? Those who wrote it? The problem is that they are not explaining what they wrote. That's why we have Bible commentaries and that is why we have great use of the writings of the Early Church Fathers.

 

[Clare73]

Who? Those who wrote it? The problem is that they are not explaining what they wrote.

What's to explain? We have the whole counsel of God from which to understand it.

That's why we have Bible commentaries and that is why we have great use of the writings of the Early Church Fathers.

The early church Fathers aren't the only ones who understand.

 

[JAL]

The satisfied have to need to justify their satisfaction. . .

That's what the cults say.

 

[Clare73]

That's what the cults say.

And? . . .I bet they also say that the sun rises in the east. . .and I stand with them in that assertion.

 

[JAL]

@Clare73,

At times, the way you speak of orthodoxy seems to have an authoritative ring to it. That's just my imagination, right?

Do you see orthodoxy as an authority? Or Scripture alone?

 

[JAL]

And? . . .I bet they also say that the sun rises in the east. . .and I stand with them in that assertion.

Why are you changing the subject? What do well-understood, scientifically supported claims have to do with magical, supernatural assertions incomprehensible to everyone?

 

[Clare73]

@Clare73,

At times, the way you speak of orthodoxy seems to have an authoritative ring to it. That's just my imagination, right?

Do you see orthodoxy as an authority? Or Scripture alone?

Scripture alone.
I see orthodoxy as preferable to all else when it is not in disagreement with Scripture.

 

[Clare73]

Why are you changing the subject? What do well-understood, scientifically supported claims have to do with magical, supernatural assertions incomprehensible to everyone?

I give up. . .what do they?

 

[zoidar]

What's to explain? We have the whole counsel of God from which to understand it.

The early church Fathers aren't the only ones who understand.

Of course the Early Fathers aren't the only ones who understand, and I'm sure they didn't understand all and neither do you and I or anyone else except God. I'm saying they are a great tool in the toolbox. To not make use of it, is not very wise.

 

[Clare73]

Of course the Early Fathers aren't the only ones who understand, and I'm sure they didn't understand all and neither do you and I or anyone else except God. I'm saying they are a great tool in the toolbox. To not make use of it, is not very wise.

I find other tools to be better.

 

[JAL]

I give up. . .what do they?

You seem to be deflecting, dancing in circles. You still haven't explained how the Christian practice of accepting incomprehensible supernatural beliefs, such as the Hypostatic Union, is significantly more commendable than the cultic practice of accepting incomprehensible supernatural beliefs.

 

[Clare73]

You seem to be deflecting, dancing in circles. You still haven't explained how the Christian practice of accepting incomprehensible supernatural beliefs, such as the Hypostatic Union, is significantly more commendable than the cultic practice of accepting incomprehensible supernatural beliefs.

Give me 10 good reasons why I should do so.

 

[JAL]

Give me 10 good reasons why I should do so.

This is clearly deflection. If everything in life had to wait for us to know 10 specific reasons, many of our responsibilities would get neglected.

Anyway here's one good reason: 100 billion souls potentially at stake if our doctrine, or our practice is wrong. Therefore we should shun a cult-like attitude and mindset - a mindset that prefers incoherent beliefs over coherent ones.

 

[zoidar]

I find other tools to be better.

Why?

 

[Clare73]

This is clearly deflection. If everything in life had to wait for us to know 10 specific reasons, many of our responsibilities would get neglected.

Anyway here's one good reason: 100 billion souls potentially at stake if our doctrine, or our practice is wrong. Therefore we should shun a cult-like attitude and mindset - a mindset that prefers incoherent beliefs over coherent ones.

Nobody's soul depends on my doctrine nor practice.

I'm not the only tool in the divine tool box.

 

[Clare73]

Why?

More comprehensive.

 

[zoidar]

More comprehensive.

The advantage of the ECF over other sources is that their writings are so close in time to Christ and to when the Bible was written. Some of them may also have been taught directly from the apostles or have been taught by those that have. I know you have pointed out they may not have had access to all books of the Bible, and that's a weakness you have to accept studying them.

 

[Clare73]

The advantage of the ECF over other sources is that their writings are so close in time to Christ and to when the Bible was written. Some of them may also have been taught directly from the apostles or have been taught by those that have. I know you have pointed out they may not have had access to all books of the Bible, and that's a weakness you have to accept studying them.

But in all things, they cannot go beyond the Scriptures, and if I have the Scriptures, I have what they had.