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How should we respond to Justin Peters' challenge to modern prophets?

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False prophets intentionally lead people away from God. (Matt 24:11, 24; II Pet 2:1). It's not when the word is in error - Deu 18:22

No believer serves God without error.
But if a person says they have a word from God, that God has spoken to them, then the word they give should not be in error, otherwise they are taking the Lord's name in vain. God does not make mistakes, nor does He lie. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of truth.

You don't hear any of the Old Testament prophets, or Agabus say, "I think I may have a word from God for you, and forgive me if I make some mistakes with it."

Therefore a true prophet of God always tells the absolute truth and never makes any mistakes about it.
 
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jiminpa

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I watched one of his videos, he needs to repent of being a deceiver and a gossip. He needs to repent of misusing scripture. He needs to repent of idolizing reformed theology, and dishonoring the word of God. He needs to turn away from bad religion and follow the Bible, and Jesus instead.
 
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Oh? I thought he did follow the Jesus of the Bible. All he has done is to call out the false prophets whose predictive prophecies never came to pass, and that no Charismatic prophet has been able to predict any of the significant world and national events that have happened over the last three years. So, what part of the Bible is he dishonouring?
 
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jiminpa

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The video that I saw was full of edits and blatant lies. He is a liar and an unrepentant accuser of those with more sound doctrines than his own. He literally labels people citing the Bible for their doctrines as false teachers, while himself opposing the text of the Bible.

I need to limit my responses to you, since everything I have seen about reformed theology and the Bible demonstrate them to be mutually exclusive to each other.
 
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Always in His Presence

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If the fruit of a ministry is strife, division and name calling - I want no part of it.


Romans 16:17 Now I urge you, brethren, note those who cause divisions and offenses, contrary to the doctrine which you learned, and avoid them
 
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jiminpa

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If the fruit of a ministry is strife, division and name calling - I want no part of it.


Romans 16:17 Now I urge you, brethren, note those who cause divisions and offenses, contrary to the doctrine which you learned, and avoid them
I wonder how guilty I am of that.
 
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Gregory Thompson

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Sure, but in general, to his general skepticism. The challenge is just one example. @Oscarr always brings up Justin Peters when he argues against current prophets.
If God doesn't give you any evidence to present to him, then there's no need to respond.
 
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So, what are the lies you are accusing him of, and how is he an unrepentant accuser? How is the fact that he keeps to the Nicene Creed not abiding in sound doctrine? And exactly what Bible citations does he criticise as not being sound doctrine?

I am just as Charismatic as you are, even more so, and over five decades of holding to Pentecostal theology, and I don't agree with your assessment of him. But I also hold to the Nicene Creed, and I view the Bible for what it actually says and I don't add things to the text that are not there. I also know the difference between descriptive narrative and prescriptive text. I also have a M.Div from a non-Charismatic Bible College and passed with distinction after three years of intense Biblical study. I am telling you this, not to be narcissistic, but to show that I am not some wet behind the ears kid who came down in the last shower.

In the light of that, I did have my doubts about him a couple of years ago, but since then I have viewed many of his videos and carefully considered what he has said, and I find that he is sound in his thinking about the way the Charismatic movement has gone in the last few years. As a traditional Pentecostal, I don't agree with the Word-Faith movement. It is not the traditional Pentecostalism that I was trained in during the 1970s. I have examined the preaching of the principal teachers of the Word-Faith movement and see clearly that they depart from the Nicene Creed, and have labelled those who stand up for what Jesus did on the Cross and the need for repentance from sin as having a demon. In all the messages I have heard from those Word-Faith Prosperity and Guaranteed Healing preaches I have never heard the Gospel of Christ that Paul spoke about in 1 Corinthians 15. They don't preach it.

In fact, in my last Charismatic church, which started to be influenced by Word-Faith, repentance from sin was hardly ever preached. I left that church in 1978, because it no longer reflected the Pentecostalism that I was introduced to in the AOG in 1966.

It might be good for you to look up the meaning of slander and defamation of character. It's a good thing that Justin Peters is more gracious than I am, because if you had said those things about me, you'd be getting a letter from my lawyer.
 
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ARBITER01

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Innocent, up until he beats up the body of Christ, then he's an agent of Hell.

The way I view it is this,..... the body of Christ is The Lord Jesus's responsibility,.... not mine or anyone else's. It is not for any one of us to beat up or put down His bride. That's a sure fire way to get on the bad side of GOD and experience the judgment side of His character.

Justin Peters and many of the other cessationist types have only ever voiced their opinions before people because they hate those that operate in the gifts. It's certainly not as innocent as Oscarr is trying to make it out to be to us.
 
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Justin Peters explained his cessationism. He says that he firmly believes that Jesus does heal today, but believes that the sign gifts, such as tongues and prophecy ceased with the last Apostle. He doesn't believe in modern day Apostles or Prophets.

I don't agree with him that the gifts of the Spirit, including tongues and prophecy ceased through some decree of God that they should have at the end of the Apostolic Age. They did decline and cease, but because the church went apostate. The Pentecostal movement of the early 20th century started to restore the gifts. So I am not a continuist, but a restorationist.

Mr Peters has observed the modern healing ministry and has observed the talk and speechmaking about it, but has not been able to observe any actual demonstration of real healing. Bill Johnson, one of the foremost proponents of healing, was not able to stop Covid-19 from going right through his school of supernatural ministry, and was unable to get his wife healed of cancer. He said that there needs to be sufficient demonstration of healing to silence the cessationists. But he can't.

But God does heal. There are many testimonies to support it. But God is sovereign in how and when He heals. He doesn't heal just because the Word-Faith preachers command, name, or claim it.

As far as Mr Peters calling out false prophets, I am sure that no genuine prophecies have been harmed in his videos. The false prophecies that he has cited are clearly false. They either make predictions that never came true, or they were buzz word salads which said basically nothing. When someone says they have received a word from God, and then goes on to say a lot of confused bovine scatology that says basically nothing, they are in serious trouble with the Lord, because they are taking His name in vain, and Jeremiah says that the Lord is against them.

So all that Mr Peters is doing is to prove all things and hold fast to that which is good. I know how difficult it is to accept when people's religious sacred cows are threatened with substantive evidence. It took me from 1978 until 2020 to realise that some of my Charismatic sacred cows weren't worth a wood nickel. I opposed Mr Peters at first, and treated John MacArthur as a false teacher. But after carefully viewing their ministries and what they were saying, I could see what they are getting at.

It is quite true that the Word-Faith movement is quite a different form of the Charismatic that I was trained in while serving with mature and sound Pentecostal pastors from 1966-1973. These were pastors who were men of prayer and the Word of God. When they corrected me, they always showed me in the Scriptures. I am thankful for the discipleship they gave me as a young man. Their instruction has stood the test of time (1966-2022), while other Pentecostal and Charismatic mentors were forgotten.

Sometimes it is painful to have the truth revealed to us, and we are more likely to react by shooting back at the messenger. I think we need to treat Mr Peters fairly, and view his teaching with an open mind. After viewing all his videos over the last two years, my restorationist view of the gifts of the Spirit and my use of the gift of tongues and prophecy was never threatened, because I base them on what the Scriptures say about them, and I know from my study of early church history why they ceased when they did, but also how different groups, suppressed by the established apostate church, continued to manifest the gifts through the centuries, until they broke out at the start of the 20th Century.

But as with all genuine moves of God, the devil is always there working to corrupt it, and I think this is what has happened with the changes in the Charismatic movement over the last 10 years. And it is these undesirable changes that Mr Peters is commenting about.
 
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ARBITER01

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So all that Mr Peters is doing is to prove all things and hold fast to that which is good.

Lol.

Really Oscarr? You're actually trying to run that by us on here? That he is so innocent in his endeavors to correct the body of Christ and it's not to gain more followers on youtube,......

If GOD feels the need to provide correction to the body of Christ, He will do it through a Spirit-filled, anointed person,... not through someone who has denied and refused certain aspects of His word.
 
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No one seems to be able to say what aspects of God's Word that Mr Peters is denying and refusing. If you won't specify, then the accusation is meaningless.

Also, I don't understand the expression "anointed" as pertains to ordinary believers. Sounds like it is being used as a buzz word that means nothing.

Also, every genuinely converted Christian believer is Spirit-filled, aren't they? Where is a Scripture reference to say they are not? By the way, you can't use any references from Acts, because it is an historical narrative which is descriptive and not prescriptive for believers unless the text expressly says so.
 
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IMHO some of the oddballs that are promoted in Charismatic circles gives ammunition to speakers like Justin Peters:

Chris Rosebrough's "Prophecy Bingo" videos really does show all the odd balls. He assures that no true prophecy is harmed in his videos. Youtube is absolutely swamped with the odd balls. I haven't found one true prophecy yet in all my searching.
 
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ARBITER01

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Lol, you've lost it Oscarr.

You should remove that Pentecostal identification from your profile and change it to baptist.
 
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lismore

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I haven't found one true prophecy yet in all my searching.

Even if it was true, as testified by prophets and apostles who say they have been to heaven and are promoted in the charismatic church, that fish in heaven wear sunglasses, that Trump is president in heaven, that you can ride on a Pterodactyl or that you can have your own chocolate fountain in heaven.

Even if it's true that fishes in heaven wear sunglasses how would it advance the Kingdom of God by me knowing that? Would studying a passage of the bible not be of greater use?

God Bless
 
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Lol, you've lost it Oscarr.

You should remove that Pentecostal identification from your profile and change it to baptist.
I lost it years ago man! I kept the identification to allow me to debate on the Spirit-filled/Charismatic forum. However I still have a Pentecostal theology, without the Word-Faith bit. Basic Pentecostal theology is an expanded version of the Nicene Creed, plus continuation of the gifts of the Spirit until the end of the church age. I continue to pray in tongues, and have as my basis for it as 1 Corinthians 14:2 which clearly defines it, and the rest of the chapter outlines its use in the church and in private.

However, I have become aware of a number of early 20th Century newspaper articles about Parham and Dowie which are quite disturbing and shows that these men were not the men of God who are reputed to be. They certainly did not glow in the dark as many thought.
 
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