How should we read Paul?

[Righttruth]

Jesus was the only righteous person because He was also God. There was no other good person. Jesus Himself said this.

But He said only God is good.

Each of your other points has been scripturally shown to be false. Your interpretation of the KJV does not override the Koine Greek in which the NT was originally written.

You know, Jesus did not teach in Greek.

When asked to provide scripture, all you can do is regurgitate ignorant and misleading chapters of a book that you worship as though it were scripture.

Well, you and your author can keep trusting your works for your salvation. I'll trust in Jesus Christ and confess to Him that even the best of my works are no more than rubbish in the presence of His holiness and righteousness.

That is what you have done with the epistles of Paul.

 

[nomadictheist]

But He said only God is good.




You know, Jesus did not teach in Greek.



That is what you have done with the epistles of Paul.

Unlike Paul, your author contradicts Jesus. Jesus said everyone is guilty of breaking the law, except, of course, Jesus Himself - the one and only begotten Son of God. Jesus said salvation comes only from believing in Him. You and your author want to set the law back up as the standard.

Jesus said only God is good. Jesus was God in the flesh. What's so hard to understand about that?

I didn't say Jesus taught in Greek. I said the NT was written in Greek. Stop trying to twist my words as you and your author twist Paul's.

Again, you and your author can trust your good works for salvation. I'll trust Jesus, and confess before Him that even the best of my works is no more than filthy rags...

 

[nomadictheist]

Unlike Paul, your author contradicts Jesus. Jesus said everyone is guilty of breaking the law, except, of course, Jesus Himself - the one and only begotten Son of God. Jesus said salvation comes only from believing in Him. You and your author want to set the law back up as the standard.

Jesus said only God is good. Jesus was God in the flesh. What's so hard to understand about that?

I didn't say Jesus taught in Greek. I said the NT was written in Greek. Stop trying to twist my words as you and your author twist Paul's.

Again, you and your author can trust your good works for salvation. I'll trust Jesus, and confess before Him that even the best of my works is no more than filthy rags...

Can't edit this post, but I should also add that I don't put Paul's writings above scripture. I have earnestly studied Jesus' teachings as well as the scriptures that Paul quoted.

But let's start afresh with this simple question. How are we saved? Through faith in Jesus the Christ alone, or by our good works and keeping the law?

 

[Strong in Him]

Yes, I agree he was a disciple and saint. But much of his thoughts were his own being not a part of the ministry of Jesus.

No. You think that because you don't believe he was an apostle and probably also don't believe him when he said he spoke by the Holy Spirit.

The problems you have are a) Paul agreed with Jesus' teaching and b) how do you know which of Paul's teaching is just his own and which is from God?

 

[Strong in Him]

But He said only God is good.

Of course he did.
Jesus wanted people to think about things, work them out for themselves and come to their own conclusions about the truth - that is why he told parables.

Statement: Good teacher
Answer: Only God is good
Conclusions: a) I am wrong and this man is not good
b) if I know for a fact that this man IS good yet he says only God is good, then either he is lying, (in which case he is not that good), or maybe he is God.

 

[Righttruth]

Unlike Paul, your author contradicts Jesus. Jesus said everyone is guilty of breaking the law, except, of course, Jesus Himself - the one and only begotten Son of God. Jesus said salvation comes only from believing in Him. You and your author want to set the law back up as the standard.

Neither the author nor the truth seeker contradicts Jesus. Only because they want to exalt Him, they are showing imaginations of Paul who had not heard Jesus when He was available on earth.

Jesus said only God is good. Jesus was God in the flesh. What's so hard to understand about that?

Did Paul understand that?

I didn't say Jesus taught in Greek. I said the NT was written in Greek. Stop trying to twist my words as you and your author twist Paul's.

Some writings are available in the language Jesus spoke.

Again, you and your author can trust your good works for salvation. I'll trust Jesus, and confess before Him that even the best of my works is no more than filthy rags...

Our good works are not filthy. It is the OT rituals done without reverence to God is filthy as declared by Isaiah. According to you, in that case, Good Samaritan did a filthy work.

 

[Righttruth]

Can't edit this post, but I should also add that I don't put Paul's writings above scripture. I have earnestly studied Jesus' teachings as well as the scriptures that Paul quoted.

But let's start afresh with this simple question. How are we saved? Through faith in Jesus the Christ alone, or by our good works and keeping the law?

Faith which is proved by good works (not rituals of the OT) can only save. One need to keep the spirit of the Law. The Ten Commandments did not become obsolete.

 

[Righttruth]

No. You think that because you don't believe he was an apostle and probably also don't believe him when he said he spoke by the Holy Spirit.

He was definitely not an apostle. Where does he say that?

The problems you have are a) Paul agreed with Jesus' teaching and b) how do you know which of Paul's teaching is just his own and which is from God?[/QUOTE]

 

[Righttruth]

He was definitely not an apostle. Where does he say that?

The problems you have are a) Paul agreed with Jesus' teaching and b) how do you know which of Paul's teaching is just his own and which is from God?

[/QUOTE]

Read the Gospel books and other writings.

 

[Righttruth]

Of course he did.
Jesus wanted people to think about things, work them out for themselves and come to their own conclusions about the truth - that is why he told parables.

Statement: Good teacher
Answer: Only God is good
Conclusions: a) I am wrong and this man is not good
b) if I know for a fact that this man IS good yet he says only God is good, then either he is lying, (in which case he is not that good), or maybe he is God.

Jesus, God in flesh, declaring His limitations.

 

[jerry kelso]

I don't feel like i need to explain anything to you. You said not teacher would dare preach the sermon in the mount. You didn't say that they wouldn't dare use it to teach OT law, that's not what you said at all. My ignore list seems to be getting larger these days.

extraneous,

what post did I say this?

 

[nomadictheist]

Faith which is proved by good works (not rituals of the OT) can only save. One need to keep the spirit of the Law. The Ten Commandments did not become obsolete.

Good works are evidence of true faith, but that doesn't answer the question. Does faith save, or is it the good works?

 

[Extraneous]

extraneous,

what post did I say this?

Going back and looking, i see that when you said it, you may have been quoting Right truth. Perhaps. However i have heard some WOF Pentecostals say that the sermon on the mount cannot be obeyed, which is wrong. Im sure you knew exactly what post i was referring to, if you were only quoting another poster and not making that assertion yourself, why not just say a long time ago? Why play this game of questions?

 

[nomadictheist]

Neither the author nor the truth seeker contradicts Jesus. Only because they want to exalt Him, they are showing imaginations of Paul who had not heard Jesus when He was available on earth.

Your author says:
the law is not a curse within itself, nor are all that rely on the works of the law under a curse. Rather, those who obey it are under a manifold blessing!

What does it mean to rely on the works of the law?

 

[nomadictheist]

Jesus, God in flesh, declaring His limitations.

Are you suggesting that Jesus was not good while He was on earth?

 

[Extraneous]

If i misunderstood your words jerry kelso, you'll need to forgive me. I once had a WOF Charismatic tell me that the sermon on the mount was impossible to obey. He was preaching prosperity doctrine and i quoted Mathew 6:19, which he responded by saying that the sermon on the mount was impossible to obey. He said we are not meant to obey it. He said its only meant to show us our sin. Thats not true though because when the Lord says not to store treasure on earth but in heaven, he actually means it. Seeing you are a Pentecostal, i assumed you were also saying the sermon on the mount is impossible to obey. You could have just let me know that you were quoting another poster when you typed those words. It might have been helpful

 

[Foghorn]

He went in his own way ignoring the directive of Jesus.

You have yet to show proof.

 

[redleghunter]

Not in the way Paul had.

Again, Colossians 2:9

 

[jerry kelso]

Paul's letter was written to Corinthians. None of his letters can be claimed as scripture. It is done in the same way as Paul's self-claims. Nothing more.



Jesus came to show the way, the life and the truth, not to build theology of non-performance. Paul basically became an arm-chair Christian with shooting of letters from his confinement: a kind of an 'idle mind becoming devil's workshop.'



Mere belief in death and resurrection will not lead to eternal life. It is not the beginning and end, but in between life that is appropriate.



Such a knowledge is not related to the life Jesus preached.

righttruth,
Paul said the gospel was the death, burial and resurrection in 1 Corinthians 15:3-10: For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, HOW THAT CHRIST DIED FOR OUR SINS ACCORDING TO THE SCRIPTURES; AND THAT HE WAS BURIED AND THAT HE ROSE AGAIN THE THIRD DAY ACCORDING TO THE SCRIPTURES: AND THAT HE WAS SEEN OF CEPHAS, THEN OF THE TWELVE; AFTER THAT, HE WAS SEEN OF ABOVE FIVE HUNDRED BRETHREN AT ONCE; OF WHOM THE GREATER PART REMAIN UNTO THIS PRESENT, BUT SOME ARE FALLEN ASLEEP. AFTER THAT, HE WAS SEEN OF JAMES; THEN OF ALL THE APOSTLES. AND LAST OF ALL HE WAS SEEN OF ME ALSO, AS OF ONE BORN OUT OF DUE TIME. FOR I AM THE LEAST OF THE APOSTLES, THAT AM NOT MEET TO BE CALLED AN APOSTLE, BECAUSE I PERSECUTED THE CHURCH OF GOD. BUT BY THE GRACE OF GOD I AM WHAT I AM: AND HIS GRACER WHICH WAS BESTOWED UPON ME WAS NOT IN VAIN: BUT I LABOURED MORE ABUNDANTLY THAN THEY ALL: YET NOT I, BUT THE GRACE OF GOD WHICH WAS WITH ME.
Paul says the same thing that Jesus did about the death, burial and resurrection was the gospel.
Jesus said in Luke 24:44-47: AND HE SAID UNTO THEM, THESE ARE THE WORDS THAT I SPAKE UNTO YOU, WHILE I WAS YET WITH YOU, THAT ALL THINGS MUST BE FULFILLED, WHICH WERE WRITTEN IN THE LAW OF MOSES, AND IN THE PROPHETS, AND IN THE PSALMS, CONCERNING ME.
THEN OPENED HE THEIR UNDERSTANDING, THAT THEY MIGH UNDERSTAND THE SCRIPTURES, AND SAID UNTO THEM, THUS IT IS IS WRITTEN, AND THUS IT BEHOVED CHRIST TO SUFFER, AND TO RISE FROM THE DEATH THE THIRD DAY: AND TYHAT REPENTANCE AND REMISSION OF SINS SHOULD B E PREACHED IN HIS NAME AMONG ALL NATIONS, BEGINNING AT JERUSALEM.
Paul was talking about the scriptures of Christ death and resurrection just like Jesus.
Now if you think that Paul said something different than Jesus outside of this then give me one specific scripture that Jesus said that Paul disagreed with or give a specific scripture that Paul said that Christ didn't say or believe.
Jesus corrected the scribes and pharisees and his disciples both. Paul corrected wrong doctrine of the gospel of unbelievers and believers both just like Jesus. He had to deal with the judaizers and the christians being carnal.
Paul was about the greatest example of a christian being who he was and allowing God to work through him and perform the work. He had fought the good fight of faith and run the race and did all things unto God and would glory in the cross.
Paul had no idle mind; he corrected his flock because he cared for him. Christ chastens his children as well when they don't follow the truth to the extreme.
I believe salvation is the beginning, through life to one's death. Paul believed that in Romans 10:9-10 and 2 Timothy 6:11-14. Jesus believed the same thing about being born again and initial salvation John 3:5 and John 3:16 and taking up our cross and following him and not looking back and taking his hand off the plow Luke 9:62 and going into all the world and preach the gospel. Matthew 28:19 etc. Jerry kelso

 

[jerry kelso]

Going back and looking, i see that when you said it, you may have been quoting Right truth. Perhaps. However i have heard some WOF Pentecostals say that the sermon on the mount cannot be obeyed, which is wrong. Im sure you knew exactly what post i was referring to, if you were only quoting another poster and not making that assertion yourself, why not just say a long time ago? Why play this game of questions?

extraneous,
I have no idea what post you are talking about. I got to this post way after it started. I will be glad to look it up because many WOF believe Jesus taught new covenant teachings as well.
Questions are not a game but it is to see if you understand what Jesus meant by the sermon to the jews only under the Mosaic law according to the KOH and the KOG message and the covenants of Abraham and David. Can you tell if you understand this context which was historical and from the old testament scriptures?
I have heard people say the Sermon on the mount not being able to be obeyed but one has to understand what context they are speaking in. Can you tell me or is just from your understanding of what you think it means from the perception it seems to give. Let me know and in the mean while I will try to find that post so I can be specific of what they said and meant. Jerry Kelso