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agreed. And since on day 6 God first creates animals, then Adam -- this could be an afternoon event of naming animal "kinds" that are in the garden.
While I understand you are probably not generally reading my posts fully (this topic is complex, and I've written quite a lot of posts giving pieces), I do think you ought to expect better than an artificial effort to revise the flow.... I'm reading the text in an even less artificial way: just as it is, without even added assumptions about different verses being actually flashbacks in time (which you must admit is an assumption some use, an added idea...). I read it with less added ideas: just as a natural sequential flow just as written.
We have no indication whatsoever on whether that happened within a few days, a week or a month or 2 or many years.... (to have any idea of a certain amount of time, a person would need to bring in their own concept/idea/assumption from outside the Bible because the words do not say how much time passed....)
[Staff edit]
You are evading.
You’re adding to the text. Nowhere does it say that Adam looked for a suitable helper. God was the one who determined that Adam needed a suitable helper because Adam would’ve had no idea that a woman was even an option as a helper. Only God could possibly know that Adam needed a woman, Adam didn’t know what a woman was because none had ever existed yet.To find a suitable helper.
Adam needed to really notice how good a companion all other creatures might be, to better appreciate the one that is coming....
Can you do that in 1 second (or even 1 minute) for a horse? Or a dog? Or a cat? Or a friendly hog, etc? Just know instantly in 1 second whether you'd really love it your whole life as a perfect life long suitable helper?
I could not. It would take me many minutes or hours for each one... Even fish are so amazing, it would take me quite a while to know whether they were my most preferred creature (not yet having seen any woman) -- fish are wonderful for peaceful meditation or admiration of the wonder of God's creation.
You never answered these two questions.We have no indication whatsoever on whether that happened within a few days, a week or a month or 2 or many years.... (to have any idea of a certain amount of time, a person would need to bring in their own concept/idea/assumption from outside the Bible because the words do not say how much time passed....)
No, clearly at least the answer to that is in the text.
Please look carefully, even though you have before:
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18 The Lord God said, “It is not good for the man to be alone. I will make a helper suitable for him.”
19 Now the Lord God had formed out of the ground all the wild animals and all the birds in the sky. He brought them to the man to see what he would name them; and whatever the man called each living creature, that was its name. 20 So the man gave names to all the livestock, the birds in the sky and all the wild animals.
But for Adam no suitable helper was found. "
[for an unstated amount of time, very many animals were brought before Adam, giving him time for each one to see if it would be a good companion.
It's just what we read. If we believe, that's what scripture clearly is saying here, if we have faith in the words.
None of the many animals really worked perfectly in a full way, truly a "suitable"life long companion! (as God no doubt foresaw, but first He had Adam review them all....)
"suitable"
Suppose someone wanted to know how long this took....
We don't have an answer in the text, just a general situation:
We know at this moment in time, Adam is not even yet subject to mortal death! -- (he hasn't eaten of the forbidden fruit that will lead to mortal death in time...)
Adam was not yet going to age and die!!....
So, this is all we can say: there was no rush at all, but there was a purpose....
To find a suitable helper.
Adam needed to really notice how good a companion all other creatures might be, to better appreciate the one that is coming....
Can you do that in 1 second (or even 1 minute) for a horse? Or a dog? Or a cat? Or a friendly hog, etc? Just know instantly in 1 second whether you'd really love it your whole life as a perfect life long suitable helper?
I could not. It would take me many minutes or hours for each one... Even fish are so amazing, it would take me quite a while to know whether they were my most preferred creature (not yet having seen any woman) -- fish are wonderful for peaceful meditation or admiration of the wonder of God's creation.
Eventually Adam has seen a lot of animals, and no doubt enjoyed many of them!....
Wonderful creatures....
But none truly the perfect companion of the best possible kind that is most suitable for a life long companion "It is not good for man to be alone" God has said....
A lot time must have passed for Adam to try out so many as possible close companions....
So, now, finally, it's time for what is next!!....
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21 So the Lord God caused the man to fall into a deep sleep...
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Now the real one is coming!
So, we have an answer to your question: we can see that clearly in the words of scripture that Eve was created after Adam had named at least a very large number of animals, if not all.
I do think the view of the verses as sequential is definitely in the text -- over and over the events are reported to be happening in order. This isn't some odd thing of jumping around in time. It's one event after another, in order.
The scripture reads, again, and this time I'll underline it to be sure you notice.
On day 7 God stopped creating, and rested. This means that Eve was created on day 6, in the same period of time when Adam was created. Therefore in the time between the creation of Adam and Eve, Adam named the animals. If you are saying that Eve was created after day 6, then you are saying that God kept creating during day 7 when it says that He rested, This, in effect, is God breaking His own Sabbath.
I like your post. I would also argue The 6 24 hour day thing is pure nonsense and always will be. There is no evidence in the bible that supports the 24 hour day idea. The length of each day is not stated, just that they have a morning and evening. Also what is clear that these day clearly suggest that they are heaven. So actually it implies the length of time it takes God while in heaven to make earth is 6 days. Now i doubt that a day in Heaven is 24 hours long, mainly beacuse its beyond our understanding.
Nope, I’ve already stated several times that Eve was created on the same day Adam was created, after he named the animals.
True.
And so also the 7th day.
Not true.
Until you read Gen 1-2 "evening and morning" for each day and you read Ex 20:8-11 where the days of Genesis as the same as 7 days at Sinai in length.
If your position is that these were actual 24 hour days then what was the point of quoting 2 Peter 3:8?
So I didn’t falsely accusing you of anything you’re bouncing back & forth on almost everything you post. If you actually believe in a 6/24 hour period of creation we wouldn’t even be having this discussion and you would be completely agreeing that Moses wrote what God revealed to him perfectly.I'm going to totally respond in a full way. This requires more than just a few sentences, so I hope you will bear with me, with patience.
It might need patience, or maybe even not!
To discuss in love, we should be patient of course -- that's what's needed for such a deep topic.
I find it helps me tremendously to pray the prayer Christ gave in Matthew 6 before being on the internet in any forum. You need to remember I'm a believer also, as you sometimes seem to not be sure!? I believe every last word 100%.
Ok?
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We read in the bible that God uses visions to communicate, more than any other way.
3 The boy Samuel ministered before the Lord under Eli. In those days the word of the Lord was rare; there were not many visions. -- 1 Sam 3:1
Of course, as you know from reading it, the Bible has very many visions in it, not just given only to prophets like Isaiah or Ezekiel, but to very many. You can also see this in how Moses stood out for being a very special exception, we read, in that God spoke with him 'face to face', and this is emphasized to be very unusual, exceptional:
6 he said, “Listen to my words:
“When there is a prophet among you,
I, the Lord, reveal myself to them in visions,
I speak to them in dreams.
7 But this is not true of my servant Moses;
he is faithful in all my house.
8 With him I speak face to face, [! -- a very amazing, one-of-a-kind exception!]
clearly and not in riddles;
he sees the form of the Lord.
Why then were you not afraid
to speak against my servant Moses?”
Numbers 12 NIV
biblehub.com
I feel awe just reading it again....
wow.....
.....
Ok....?
When you are ready....
As we know, of course, the person who received the revelation from God written down in Genesis chapter 1 was not actually there in person with God in the beginning (Christ was, but not any mortal human!) -- so Genesis chapter 1 is of course given to us through a mortal human being who was given a revelation from God...
The person receiving this then would see some of it, (as in a vision) -- visually see some key things that happened -- and also hear some spoken words from God, which are in quotation marks for us.
Both.
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3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.
6 And God said, “Let there be a vault between the waters to separate water from water.” 7 So God made the vault and separated the water under the vault from the water above it. And it was so. 8 God called the vault “sky.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the second day.
Bible Gateway passage: Genesis 1 - New International Version
The Beginning - In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. God saw that the light was good...www.biblegateway.com
We are getting actual spoken Words from God here -- literally spoken words!!! (They are in quotation marks.)
Let's read some more visions to notice that happenining.
Peter’s Vision
9 About noon the following day as they were on their journey and approaching the city, Peter went up on the roof to pray. 10 He became hungry and wanted something to eat, and while the meal was being prepared, he fell into a trance. 11 He saw heaven opened and something like a large sheet being let down to earth by its four corners. 12 It contained all kinds of four-footed animals, as well as reptiles and birds. 13 Then a voice told him, “Get up, Peter. Kill and eat.”
14 “Surely not, Lord!” Peter replied. “I have never eaten anything impure or unclean.”
15 The voice spoke to him a second time, “Do not call anything impure that God has made clean.”
16 This happened three times, and immediately the sheet was taken back to heaven.
17 While Peter was wondering about the meaning of the vision, the men sent by Cornelius found out where Simon’s house was and stopped at the gate. ...
Bible Gateway passage: Acts 10 - New International Version
Cornelius Calls for Peter - At Caesarea there was a man named Cornelius, a centurion in what was known as the Italian Regiment. He and all his family were devout and God-fearing; he gave generously to those in need and prayed to God regularly. One day at about three in the afternoon he had a...www.biblegateway.com
And, like so many places in the Bible when anyone is given a vision, they wonder what it means for a time!
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8 During the night I had a vision, and there before me was a man mounted on a red horse. He was standing among the myrtle trees in a ravine. Behind him were red, brown and white horses.
9 I asked, “What are these, my lord?”
The angel who was talking with me answered, “I will show you what they are.”
Bible Gateway passage: Zechariah 1 - New International Version
A Call to Return to the LORD - In the eighth month of the second year of Darius, the word of the LORD came to the prophet Zechariah son of Berekiah, the son of Iddo: “The LORD was very angry with your ancestors. Therefore tell the people: This is what the LORD Almighty says: ‘Return to me,’...
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So, the person given the amazing creation vision in Genesis 1 would not naturally be able to understand precisely what he was seeing immediately....
How could anyone understand seeing Earth as a water world for example!!???
What? Earth as a water world with no land???
How could anyone comprehend that as being Earth?.....
How?
Only that God helps us to understand.
God aided him very strongly to understand, giving both spoken words and also even 'days' with a morning and evening --
That's familiar: morning time and evening time: I can understand this vision now -- it's here on Earth, and this is a day!....
In this way, the person receiving this amazing vision that would have been beyond their comprehension could begin to understand it was Earth he was seeing, being made.
Of course, God can do all things, and doesn't have to work slowly, but could make Earth in 1 second.....
But that would be very hard to comprehend as being Earth being made, if it suddenly appears out of nothing fully formed with animals and all the rest....
So, in this vision, creation is shown in a way we can understand.
It unfolds over time in the vision. In 'days' we can recognize as being on Earth -- that's what was seen.
It's understandable to us mortal humans.
God also spoke words to make it clear that Earth was being formed -- and that it is "good" for us as our home. "Very good"....
The words are enough to help make it clear -- God made our home Earth -- everything.
Here I'd better say that certainly visions aren't like a video recording though. (it would be a disrespectful cartoon version of God to claim so!)
God didn't need to set up a camera and record it and then later replay the recording for the person given this revelation....
Instead, all visions are actually given from God -- He creates the vision for us.
So that we can understand what we never could otherwise.
A vision is always a kind of stylized representation of something important. A created scene.
As a parallel analogy, visions are much more like an animation drawing than a video recording or photo from a physical camera.
They are stylistical representations. They are like something, instead of being a photo recording of something.
This is such a wonderful vision of course, and reading it can lift us up out of our base mind into a higher state of mind, ready to hear God's words to come in the scripture....
We should always take a time to sometimes read to just listen to the chapter, without thinking about any debate or doctrinal thing we heard, et
That's the main best thing we mus to hear and be lifted up, readyto continue reading the word....
I hope if anyone ever listens to anything about Genesis 1, they will listen to the key crucial help that we should read to listen, pure listening, not in order to debate, etc.
Where does it say these were days in heaven? Why is the term “there was evening and there was morning” included in every single day of creation? What’s the purpose of making that statement?
Amen, God didn’t bless the seventh epoch and rest. Here’s an idea let’s post each verse containing the days of creation and replace the word day with epoch and see if it makes any sense.
There was no earthly Evening or Morning for the first 3 days. as God made sun on 4th Day. Therefore these days had to have taken place in Heaven.
It nonsense cause for Adam to name every animal in the afternoon it would require him to name 20,000 a second. Now I am sure God could do that, Adam could not have done so unless your suggesting god gave him supernatural powers.
Okay. But you are still maintaining that it was all within a 24 hour day. That's where we differ.
