How much should I take?

[Confusedandsad]

Another sob story I'm afraid. I'll try to make it short...

My husband and I have been married almost 4 years. No kids yet. We have both been Christians for many years, although he says his faith is in crisis. No infidelity, no physical abuse, no substance use problems. 80% of the time, things are really great between us. We rarely bicker, enjoy spending time together and for the most part, are kind to each other. It's the other 20% of the time that is a HUGE problem. My husband has a traumatic history. His whole family pretty much is deceased. Events have made him angry at God and afraid to truly love. When things start going well between us, he'll pull a Jekyll & Hyde on me and become very very mean - putting me down, calling me names, saying I'm his "enemy", and becoming super cold. He'll go as far as refusing to look at or speak to me, when I'm standing there crying, just confused by his behavior. He later tells me he meant none of it, but just becomes afraid when things are going well because he fears something terrible is going to happen. He thinks he will die young or that something bad will happen to me. This cycle of "everythings great, then WHAM!... then everything's great again, and WHAM!" has been repeating itself for the entirety of our marriage. I'm... worn... out. Last time it happened I told him he needed to seek help if he understands he is having these problems being emotionally available and appropriate due to his history. (He has promised several times to go to counseling and anger management) He didnt do it. So this time, I told him we needed to separate. I've asked him to move out and he has agreed it's the best thing for us. In fact, he says if I asked for a divorce he would be happy for me because he knows I can "do better without him."

I dont want a divorce. I love this man. BUT... this is an emotionally abusive relationship and if he can't commit to doing the work he needs to do, how much should I take?

Thoughts anyone??? I really need an objective opinion (my friends say: GET OUT OF IT!) but then again, they hear me call them crying every 3 months with these horrible stories....

Thanks in advance!

Edited to say... I've been reading through this forum for awhile and have gained so much hope and support through so many of your stories, struggles, and triumphs. I just wanted to thank you all for that.

 

[deliciousBass]

Hmm... obviously his actions are symptoms of a more severe problem that hasn't been treated.

I don't think that a separation is a horrible idea. But it's not the greatest either and it does involve a good deal of risk. My concern is this: He hasn't sought help since you've been married. If he moves out, do you think he will get some help? Do you think he will have incentive to considering he's already told you that he thinks you can do better without him?

I think you two are teetering on the edge of a cliff right now. He sounds depressed and bi-polar. I also think that he's not telling you the whole story. Just a gut feeling.

Since you told him that you think you should separate, were you also prepared to accept that your relationship could go further downhill and he ending up filing for divorce?

Edit: You know what? I think I have divorce on my mind a little too much right now... Here's what I think. He won't go to counseling and he is emotionally abusive.. so you want a separation so that maybe he gets his act together and you get a breather... don't even think about divorce right now. Cross that bridge if it comes because if it does come, it's way down the road anyway. Meanwhile, I'm sure you will be on the lookout for genuine changes in him.

Another sob story I'm afraid. I'll try to make it short...

My husband and I have been married almost 4 years. No kids yet. We have both been Christians for many years, although he says his faith is in crisis. No infidelity, no physical abuse, no substance use problems. 80% of the time, things are really great between us. We rarely bicker, enjoy spending time together and for the most part, are kind to each other. It's the other 20% of the time that is a HUGE problem. My husband has a traumatic history. His whole family pretty much is deceased. Events have made him angry at God and afraid to truly love. When things start going well between us, he'll pull a Jekyll & Hyde on me and become very very mean - putting me down, calling me names, saying I'm his "enemy", and becoming super cold. He'll go as far as refusing to look at or speak to me, when I'm standing there crying, just confused by his behavior. He later tells me he meant none of it, but just becomes afraid when things are going well because he fears something terrible is going to happen. He thinks he will die young or that something bad will happen to me. This cycle of "everythings great, then WHAM!... then everything's great again, and WHAM!" has been repeating itself for the entirety of our marriage. I'm... worn... out. Last time it happened I told him he needed to seek help if he understands he is having these problems being emotionally available and appropriate due to his history. (He has promised several times to go to counseling and anger management) He didnt do it. So this time, I told him we needed to separate. I've asked him to move out and he has agreed it's the best thing for us. In fact, he says if I asked for a divorce he would be happy for me because he knows I can "do better without him."

I dont want a divorce. I love this man. BUT... this is an emotionally abusive relationship and if he can't commit to doing the work he needs to do, how much should I take?

Thoughts anyone??? I really need an objective opinion (my friends say: GET OUT OF IT!) but then again, they hear me call them crying every 3 months with these horrible stories....

Thanks in advance!

Edited to say... I've been reading through this forum for awhile and have gained so much hope and support through so many of your stories, struggles, and triumphs. I just wanted to thank you all for that.

 

[Confusedandsad]

...My concern is this: He hasn't sought help since you've been married. If he moves out, do you think he will get some help?

I'm not sure if he will or not. But he certainly hasn't while we're living together so my thought was that I need to do something, anything, differently.

Do you think he will have incentive to considering he's already told you that he thinks you can do better without him?

I'm hoping he'll realize I'm serious about this and that will be incentive to get help. But you're right, there's a chance he'll look at this as a way out.

I think you two are teetering on the edge of a cliff right now. He sounds depressed and bi-polar. I also think that he's not telling you the whole story. Just a gut feeling.

He's depressed and has posttraumatic stress symptoms, but isnt bipolar. Regardless, we are on a cliff.

Since you told him that you think you should separate, were you also prepared to accept that your relationship could go further downhill and he ending up filing for divorce?

Yes, Im prepared for that. Here's my thought... we've been running in this crazy circle for several years, going nowhere. In asking him to move out, I'm hoping that we will actually move forward. There's the possibility forward means our relationship gets better. There's also the chance that forward means a step toward divorce. Either way, I can't keep going round and round. It's getting us nowhere.

If he starts doing the work, I'm here. But what if it seems things arent going to change. Is there a point where you just have to say, enough is enough?

 

[deliciousBass]

I'm not sure if he will or not. But he certainly hasn't while we're living together so my thought was that I need to do something, anything, differently.

That's understandable. Just out of curiosity, have you offered to go to counseling with him?

I'm hoping he'll realize I'm serious about this and that will be incentive to get help. But you're right, there's a chance he'll look at this as a way out.

Yeah, that could be an incentive to get help. It happened to me, although my spouse never returned and now we'll be divorced before the end of the year.

He's depressed and has posttraumatic stress symptoms, but isnt bipolar. Regardless, we are on a cliff.

Yeah, this is why I feel for ya because I sufferred from that as well due to family issues too and because of my time in Iraq. I know what it's like to be the abuser.. and ironically enough now the roles are reversed hehe.

Yes, Im prepared for that. Here's my thought... we've been running in this crazy circle for several years, going nowhere. In asking him to move out, I'm hoping that we will actually move forward. There's the possibility forward means our relationship gets better. There's also the chance that forward means a step toward divorce. Either way, I can't keep going round and round. It's getting us nowhere.

I understand.. I just hope you are taking all the possible repercussions into account because there are a LOT of them. This could very well end up causing you more pain than what is prevented. IMHO, I do think.. well know, that it's going to cause a lot of short term emotional pain. But if he really is as bad as you say he is, then only you know if it's worth it to prevent this pain for going on until you're older and have had enough. I've spoken to too many broken women at my DivorceCare class with jerks for husbands to believe that most men truly want to change though. And it's especially sad when they're in their 40s and 50s, financially dependent on their husbands and wishing they had done things differently when they were younger....

If he starts doing the work, I'm here. But what if it seems things arent going to change. Is there a point where you just have to say, enough is enough?

Hehe, this one depends on who you ask. You're going to hear a lot of "NO YOU SHOULDN'T DIVORCE EXCEPT FOR X REASON" but since you asked ME, my opinion is that you're justified once you give it sufficient time during your separation, have prayed for reconciliation, and he still doesn't care or love you enough to do his part in saving the marriage.

.

 

[Confusedandsad]

Thanks for your replies.

Yep, we've been to counseling together in the past. At this point it's pretty apparent he needs to do his own work.

PTSD is very difficult as it sounds like you well know. I dont blame my husband for his responses to things. I just blame him for not getting the help he needs to change it. Have you found your own counseling very helpful, if you don't mind my asking?

I definitely don't think my husband is truly a jerk... he's actually a wonderful person. He's just had a lot of bad stuff happen to him and he's emotionally broken. It tears me up to think we won't make it work, but I feel like at some point I have to stop worrying about him and start worrying about preserving myself.

Thanks again for your reply... it's helpful to think through every aspect of this thing.

 

[deliciousBass]

Yep, I found counseling to be very helpful. It's good to look at it as an injury. The only problem is that most men tend to leave these emotional/psychological injuries untreated and just like physical injuries, it only gets worse. Sure, you can go through a period of time where the symptoms subside and everything is peachy but rest assured that they will return just as you've experienced with your 80% good times/ 20% bad times thing.

Counseling is weird at first.. but gradually I began to trust my counselor and I began looking forward to my weekly meeting with him. I always left feeling much better. Sometimes it's nice hearing a fresh opinion from an objective 3rd party knowing that they don't have a vested interest in the situation.

You mentioned that your husband is emotionally broken.. what have you done to build him up? I know that in the end the responsibility rests on his shoulders to fix himself but you'd be surprised what support and some words of affirmation can do to build you up. And he sounds like he especially needs it for his self-esteem.

The main topic was "How much should I take?" You know what though? Eventually you're going to get to a point where you say, "That's it, I've done my part.. now it's up to him to do his part." It's a sucky situation but you will find peace knowing that you have been a faithful wife and true to your vows and ultimately, it takes two willing participants to make the marriage work. Hopefully he will make the right choice and begin to show some initiative and commitment to reducing it to 95% good times 5% bad (I would say 100% but it's not realistic and besides, you can't appreciate the sweet without the sour )

Question: Do you feel prepared to live alone?

Thanks for your replies.

Yep, we've been to counseling together in the past. At this point it's pretty apparent he needs to do his own work.

PTSD is very difficult as it sounds like you well know. I dont blame my husband for his responses to things. I just blame him for not getting the help he needs to change it. Have you found your own counseling very helpful, if you don't mind my asking?

I definitely don't think my husband is truly a jerk... he's actually a wonderful person. He's just had a lot of bad stuff happen to him and he's emotionally broken. It tears me up to think we won't make it work, but I feel like at some point I have to stop worrying about him and start worrying about preserving myself.

Thanks again for your reply... it's helpful to think through every aspect of this thing.

 

[Autumnleaf]

People have internal thermostats that tend to make them work to get food if they fail enough. The problem is the opposite can happen... If things start going too well the thermostat can make the opposite happen to mess things up so they get back down to normal. Some call this fear of success. People who self-sabotage do this. Hypnosis from a sharp therapist might nip this at the bud.

 

[Confusedandsad]

People have internal thermostats that tend to make them work to get food if they fail enough. The problem is the opposite can happen... If things start going too well the thermostat can make the opposite happen to mess things up so they get back down to normal. Some call this fear of success. People who self-sabotage do this. Hypnosis from a sharp therapist might nip this at the bud.

Interesting thought, actually. I do think there's an element of self-sabotage, or self-fulfilling prophecy going on here. I hadn't thought about hypnosis, but there's a type of therapy called EMDR that has been shown to help PTSD, so I'm going to see if he'll consider that. Thanks for the idea!

 

[Confusedandsad]

Yep, I found counseling to be very helpful. It's good to look at it as an injury. The only problem is that most men tend to leave these emotional/psychological injuries untreated and just like physical injuries, it only gets worse. Sure, you can go through a period of time where the symptoms subside and everything is peachy but rest assured that they will return just as you've experienced with your 80% good times/ 20% bad times thing.

Thanks for your feedback on this. I'm glad to hear therapy has been helpful for you. I'm praying the same for my husband.

You mentioned that your husband is emotionally broken.. what have you done to build him up?

Not enough. I believe Im pretty supportive, but I also know that I can be become critical once I'm fed up. I'm hoping that our time separated will also help me to work on this issue. It's not entirely about him "fixing" himself... thanks for the reminder. I definitely want to work on this.

The main topic was "How much should I take?" You know what though? Eventually you're going to get to a point where you say, "That's it, I've done my part.. now it's up to him to do his part."

Question: Do you feel prepared to live alone?

I used to think I'd get to that point, but I have a short memory and a strong ability to forgive. I truly can move on after these episodes without harboring a lot of bitterness. It's just in the moment when it hurts so much, that's when I feel "I'M DONE." A day later, I can't imagine leaving him. Part of me feels like this is a blessing and a strength of mine. Part of me feels like I just end up the chump. But I suppose if things continued this way, or got worse, I'd hit a breaking point. And yah, I feel prepared to live alone.

I'm trying to think of this in a positive light. Hoping that separation will lead to reconciliation. I think that both our hearts are in it enough to try. We'll find out...