How many point Calvinist?

[hindsey]

Just wondering with those that go to Baptist churches here, how many point Calvinist are you?
I'm going to try to make a poll here, but it will be my first one, so I might screw it up...
And add in which of the 5 you agree with:

1) Total Depravity of man
2) Unconditional Election
3) Limited Atonement (Particular Redemption)
4) Irresistible Grace
5) Perserverance of Saints

 

[Andyman_1970]

I don't consider myself and Calvinist, but I agree with "U" and "P".

 

[Iollain]

Hindsey, could you explalin these better? I'm not sure what they all mean.

 

[Crazy Liz]

You can't vote if you don't believe any of them.

 

[BT]

I'm with Liz. I'm a 0 pointer.

 

[Beoga]

full 5 points and proud of it

 

[eutychus]

I'm a five pointer by the grace of God.

 

[BBAS 64]

Good Day, Hindsey

I will uphold the historical Baptist view of the Gospel.

[font=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]"The old truth that Calvin preached, that Augustine preached, that Paul preached, is the truth that I must preach to-day, or else be false to my conscience and my God. I cannot shape the truth; I know of no such thing as paring off the rough edges of a doctrine. John Knox's gospel is my gospel. That which thundered through Scotland must thunder through England again."—C. H. Spurgeon ​

[/font]


Peace to u,

Bill
​

 

[hindsey]

Sorry about forgetting the Option to have 0 of the beliefs. I count 2 people that have said they don't agree with any of them... are there more?

Hindsey, could you explalin these better? I'm not sure what they all mean.

To give credit, the following website posted the definitions for tulip for me:
http://www.mslick.com/tulip.htm

Total Depravity:
Sin has affected all parts of man. The heart, emotions, will, mind, and body are all affected by sin. We are completely sinful. We are not as sinful as we could be, but we are completely affected by sin.
The doctrine of Total Depravity is derived from scriptures that reveal human character: Man’s heart is evil (Mark 7:21-23) and sick (Jer. 17:9). Man is a slave of sin (Rom. 6:20). He does not seek for God (Rom. 3:10-12). He cannot understand spiritual things (1 Cor. 2:14). He is at enmity with God (Eph. 2:15). And, is by nature a child of wrath (Eph. 2:3). The Calvinist asks the question, "In light of the scriptures that declare man’s true nature as being utterly lost and incapable, how is it possible for anyone to choose or desire God?" The answer is, "He cannot. Therefore God must predestine."
Calvinism also maintains that because of our s fallen nature we are born again not by our own will but God’s will (John 1:12-13); God grants that we believe (Phil. 1:29); faith is the work of God (John 6:28-29); God appoints people to believe (Acts 13:48); and God predestines (Eph. 1:1-11; Rom. 8:29; 9:9-23).

Unconditional Election:
God does not base His election on anything He sees in the individual. He chooses the elect according to the kind intention of His will (Eph. 1:4-8; Rom. 9:11) without any consideration of merit within the individual. Nor does God look into the future to see who would pick Him. Also, as some are elected into salvation, others are not (Rom. 9:15, 21).
Limited Atonement:
Jesus died only for the elect. Though Jesus’ sacrifice was sufficient for all, it was not efficacious for all. Jesus only bore the sins of the elect. Support for this position is drawn from such scriptures as Matt. 26:28 where Jesus died for ‘many'; John 10:11, 15 which say that Jesus died for the sheep (not the goats, per Matt. 25:32-33); John 17:9 where Jesus in prayer interceded for the ones given Him, not those of the entire world; Acts 20:28 and Eph. 5:25-27 which state that the Church was purchased by Christ, not all people; and Isaiah 53:12 which is a prophecy of Jesus’ crucifixion where he would bore the sins of many (not all).

Irresistible Grace:
When God calls his elect into salvation, they cannot resist. God offers to all people the gospel message. This is called the external call. But to the elect, God extends an internal call and it cannot be resisted. This call is by the Holy Spirit who works in the hearts and minds of the elect to bring them to repentance and regeneration whereby they willingly and freely come to God. Some of the verses used in support of this teaching are Romans 9:16 where it says that "it is not of him who wills nor of him who runs, but of God who has mercy"; Philippians 2:12-13 where God is said to be the one working salvation in the individual; John 6:28-29 where faith is declared to be the work of God; Acts 13:48 where God appoints people to believe; and John 1:12-13 where being born again is not by man’s will, but by God’s.

Perseverance of the Saints:
You cannot lose your salvation. Because the Father has elected, the Son has redeemed, and the Holy Spirit has applied salvation, those thus saved are eternally secure. They are eternally secure in Christ. Some of the verses for this position are John 10:27-28 where Jesus said His sheep will never perish; John 6:47 where salvation is described as everlasting life; Romans 8:1 where it is said we have passed out of judgment; 1 Corinthians 10:13 where God promises to never let us be tempted beyond what we can handle; and Phil. 1:6 where God is the one being faithful to perfect us until the day of Jesus’ return.

 

[Floripa]

If you refer to limited redemption instead of limited atonement and effectual grace instead of irresistable grace, most all Baptists could agree and lay aside this potentially divisive tool of the enemy.

 

[hindsey]

If you refer to limited redemption instead of limited atonement and effectual grace instead of irresistable grace, most all Baptists could agree and lay aside this potentially divisive tool of the enemy.

Not necessarily. We have 2 in our poll (~20%) that don't agree with Total Depravity and Unconditional Election, and we have 2 others that don't agree with all 5.

 

[Cright]

1 Cor 1:10-17

 

[hindsey]

Those are good verses Cright... Did you vote in the poll?

 

[Cright]

nope

 

[TwinCrier]

0 pointer, though I once accepted P, I have since come to a new conclusion after much prayer and bible study.

 

[hindsey]

We now have 3 no-pointers to add to our poll, or TwinCrier, did you vote for P alone?

 

[Jeffrey A]

I'm with Liz. I'm a 0 pointer.

Make that three. I'm also a zero pointer. Instead, I am a "Rosesian", a person who believes in "Roses Theology" --

Redeemed on condition of faith ("For by [God's] grace you have been saved through [upon condition of your own] faith, and that [salvation] not of yourselves; it [the being saved] is the gift of God, not of works..." Eph 2:8)

Open to all ("God our Savior... desires all men to be saved... for... the man Christ Jesus... gave himself as a ransom for all" 1 Tim 2:4-6, for "Jesus Christ... himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world" 1 John 2:1-2)

Separated by sin ("Your iniquities have made a separation between you and your God" Isaiah 59:2)

Elect to good works ("He chose us in him... that we should be holy and blameless before him... For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them" Eph 1:4, 2:10, "that you may prove yourselves to be blameless and innocent, children of God above reproach in the midst of a crooked and perverse generation, among whom you [should] appear as lights in the world" Phil 2:15)

Sealed by the Spirit ("In him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation, having also believed, you were sealed in him with the Holy Spirit of promise" Eph 1:13, so that "neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord" Rom 8:38-39)


Jeffrey A

 

[TwinCrier]

We now have 3 no-pointers to add to our poll, or TwinCrier, did you vote for P alone?

I like the roses points.

 

[BT]

Yeah I'd say that describes me pretty perfectly. Thought I might append elect to good works to "elect to good works and blessings in the heavenly places".. besides that it's a-ok in my books

 

[hindsey]

Is not being "Sealed by the Spirit" the same as Perserverance of the Saints? Basically they both say that once you're TRULY saved you can never be lost-again. Right?