How many Gentiles and Samaritans could have been saved if Jesus would have sent some disciples there?

[zoidar]

If they became sheep after the cross, then Christ didn’t die for them.

How you figure?

If I build a house for the homeless people. Do I only build it for those that are homeless when I build it?

He only died for the sheep.

 

[John Mullally]

That’s not what reconciliation means.

Right now we see through a glass darkly (1 Corinthians 13:12). I walk by faith (in God's word), not by sight (needing to reconcile everything).

Calvinist can match up any events in scripture or the real world with their doctrine, because their doctrine is that "everything that happens is God's will" - which is basically what Islam teaches and is not itself supported by scripture.

 

[Hammster]

How you figure?

If I build a house for the homeless people. Do I only build it for those that are homeless when I build it?

If they only become sheep after they believe, then there’s no need for Him to die for them.

 

[Hammster]

Right now we see through a glass darkly (1 Corinthians 13:12). I walk by faith (in God's word), not by sight (needing to reconcile everything).

Calvinist can match up any events in scripture or the real world with their doctrine, because their doctrine is that "everything that happens is God's will" - which is basically what Islam teaches and is not itself supported by scripture.

Are you actually arguing that there are things that happen outside of God’s control?

 

[John Mullally]

Are you actually arguing that there are things that happen outside of God’s control?

God is not all-controlling. God permits people to do what He does not want them to do (i.e. sin).

 

[zoidar]

If they only become sheep after they believe, then there’s no need for Him to die for them.

I have no idea what you base that idea on. Feel free to elaborate.

 

[Hammster]

God is not all-controlling. God permits people to do what He does not want them to do (i.e. sin).

So even that’s under His control.

 

[Hammster]

I have no idea what you base that idea on. Feel free to elaborate.

It made more sense last night. So let’s try this.

In John 10, the sheep are given to Him by His Father. It’s a know group. They don’t become sheep, and then are given. They are already sheep, otherwise they would be goats given to Christ.

The picture is that God gives His Son a flock of sheep to care for. Christ loves His Father and the sheep, and lays His life down for the sheep. It’s the sheep that hear His voice and follow. It’s not the goats that hear His voice, decide to follow, and somewhere turn into sheep.

Even in the parable of the sheep and goats, if you read it carefully, they aren’t sheep or goats based on what they do. They act the way they do because they are sheep or goats.

 

[Dah'veed]

Not the topic.

Initially it was something about Jesus not saving Gentiles.

My point is that for some reason you want to turn Reformed Theology into a license to sin.

In which case they would be under the dominion of sin, Galatians 3:22, without Christ and without God, AKA godless. (EPh 2:12)

Please stop posting here.

Instead of being inhospitable, why don't you tell me what the thread is about?

"Blessed is he who is not offended because of Me.” Matt 11:5-6

 

[Hammster]

Initially it was something about Jesus not saving Gentiles.

Which is spelled out in the OP.

In which case they would be under the dominion of sin, Galatians 3:22, without Christ and without God, AKA godless. (EPh 2:12)

Instead of being inhospitable, why don't you tell me what the thread is about?

These twelve Jesus sent out after instructing them: “Do not go in the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter any city of the Samaritans; but rather go to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
— Matthew 10:5-6

So here we have Jesus deliberately telling His disciples to not go to the Gentiles nor the Samaritans. How many Gentiles and Samaritans could have been saved if Jesus would have sent some disciples there?

"Blessed is he who is not offended because of Me.” Matt 11:5-6

 

[BBAS 64]

I cannot decipher from the text, good answers as to a number of questions that have been raised on this parable/analogy.

The purpose of the parable/analogy is to show the Religious leaders who opposed him the tremendously strong relationship of Jesus to His Father and His followers. And to show the leaders that they stand outside that.

Your point is that Jesus's Sheep are His Sheep over their entire lifetime. That is not in the text and it is contradicted. Jesus says that the Sheep listen to "my voice" - but that does not happen until after conversion.

Good Day, John

I am sorry my brother you are way off on your understanding of the metaphor being employed her by Jesus, and given your previous comments I am not surprised.

Would strongly recommend the video's I provided by DA Carson on the subject you will find them quite helpful in your understanding and assist you in overcoming your inability to decipher this text.


Be well,

Bill

 

[BBAS 64]

God is not all-controlling. God permits people to do what He does not want them to do (i.e. sin).

Good Day, John

We indeed know that God can and has stopped people from sinning.

Gen 20:6 Then God said to him in the dream, “Yes, I know that you have done this in the integrity of your heart, and it was I who kept you from sinning against me. Therefore I did not let you touch her.

In Him,

Bill

 

[Dah'veed]

Which is spelled out in the OP.
These twelve Jesus sent out after instructing them: “Do not go in the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter any city of the Samaritans; but rather go to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. — Matthew 10:5-6

So here we have Jesus deliberately telling His disciples to not go to the Gentiles nor the Samaritans. How many Gentiles and Samaritans could have been saved if Jesus would have sent some disciples there?

As a matter of fact, Jesus went there Himself. "Whoever drinks from the water I give will never thirst."

The woman said, “I know that Messiah” (called Christ) “is coming. When He comes, he will explain everything to us.”
Then Jesus declared, “I, the one speaking to you—I am He.” John 4:22-26

"Blessed is he who is not offended because of Me.” Matt 11:5-6

 

[zoidar]

Good Day, John

We indeed know that God can and has stopped people from sinning.

Of course!

Gen 20:6 Then God said to him in the dream, “Yes, I know that you have done this in the integrity of your heart, and it was I who kept you from sinning against me. Therefore I did not let you touch her.

In Him,

Bill

To not take it out of context.

But God came to Abimelech in a dream of the night, and said to him, “Behold, you are a dead man because of the woman whom you have taken, for she is married.”
— Genesis 20:3

 

[BBAS 64]

Of course!

To not take it out of context.

But God came to Abimelech in a dream of the night, and said to him, “Behold, you are a dead man because of the woman whom you have taken, for she is married.”
— Genesis 20:3

Good Day, Zoidar

So God's means (effective and purposeful) was to come to Abimelech by a dream....

If God's purpose in coming (in a dream) was to stop sinning, could God fail to bring about the purposeful intention out come he desired?

Thus making his means ineffective?

in Him,

Bill

 

[John Mullally]

Good Day, John

We indeed know that God can and has stopped people from sinning.

Gen 20:6 Then God said to him in the dream, “Yes, I know that you have done this in the integrity of your heart, and it was I who kept you from sinning against me. Therefore I did not let you touch her.

In Him,

Bill

Yes, God often works in behalf of His purposes and people in particular (in your example Abraham and Sarah). With Christ, He stopped people from pushing him off a cliff (Luke 4) and stoning Him (John 10 - that we have been talking about).

Nevertheless, He does not restrain a lot of sin - even the most grevious sin.

Jeremiah 32:35 And they built the high places of Baal which are in the Valley of the Son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire to Molech, which I did not command them, nor did it come into My mind that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin.’​

 

[Hammster]

As a matter of fact, Jesus went there Himself. "Whoever drinks from the water I give will never thirst."

The woman said, “I know that Messiah” (called Christ) “is coming. When He comes, he will explain everything to us.”
Then Jesus declared, “I, the one speaking to you—I am He.” John 4:22-26

I even repeated the OP, and you still won’t respond on topic.

 

[Hammster]

Yes, God often works in behalf of His purposes and people in particular (in your example Abraham and Sarah). With Christ, He stopped people from pushing him off a cliff (Luke 4) and stoning Him (John 10 - that we have been talking about).

Nevertheless, He does not restrain a lot of sin - even the most grevious sin.

Jeremiah 32:35 And they built the high places of Baal which are in the Valley of the Son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire to Molech, which I did not command them, nor did it come into My mind that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin.’​

And He has a purpose when He doesn’t restrain sin. Genesis 50:20

 

[John Mullally]

And He has a purpose when He doesn’t restrain sin. Genesis 50:20

In this case it worked for the betterment of the Patriarchs.

In many cases, sin lead to death (Romans 6:23) which is not what He wants:

Ezekiel 18:30 “Therefore, you Israelites, I will judge each of you according to your own ways, declares the Sovereign Lord. Repent! Turn away from all your offenses; then sin will not be your downfall. 31 Rid yourselves of all the offenses you have committed, and get a new heart and a new spirit. Why will you die, people of Israel? 32 For I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign Lord. Repent and live!​

 

[Dah'veed]

Dah'veed said:
As a matter of fact, Jesus went there Himself. "Whoever drinks from the water I give will never thirst."

The woman said, “I know that Messiah” (called Christ) “is coming. When He comes, he will explain everything to us.”
Then Jesus declared, “I, the one speaking to you—I am He.” John 4:22-26

I even repeated the OP, and you still won’t respond on topic.

And where do you think the Samaritan woman was from?

But one of them, seeing that he was healed, quickly bowed at Jesus’ feet and thanked Him. (The man was a Samaritan.) Luke 17:15-16