How do you do it?

[HannahBanana]

How do you make yourself believe that the Bible is true? I've tried doing so before, but I'm such a staunch liberal that I just cannot do it. The parts about abortion being wrong, homosexuality being wrong, and non-Christian religions being wrong especially make me not want to take the entire Bible seriously. And I've tried forcing myself to be a conservative, but that didn't work out well at all. But I do want to be a Christian (or at least I'm pretty sure that I do). So what do I do?

 

[Faith In God]

How do you make yourself believe that the Bible is true?

You don't "make" yourself believe the Bible. When you were a child, did you have to "make yourself" believe the science-book in science class?

I've tried doing so before, but I'm such a staunch liberal that I just cannot do it. The parts about abortion being wrong, homosexuality being wrong, and non-Christian religions being wrong especially make me not want to take the entire Bible seriously. And I've tried forcing myself to be a conservative, but that didn't work out well at all. But I do want to be a Christian (or at least I'm pretty sure that I do). So what do I do?

What is a Christian to you?
Christ says He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life. He also says that He is the ONLY Way.

If you find yoursel unable to let go of the notion that homosexuals are not wrong, that abortion is not wrong, that other religions are not wrong...
why do you want to be a Christian?

...may I suggest something, though?
If Christianity is true, and if God is in this religion...then you are wrong, and these beliefs that you don't like are correct, and you are better off trusting and believing in this one.
Do you think Christianity is true?

 

[sbbqb7n16]

... first clean the inside of the cup and of the dish, so that the outside of it may become clean also.
Matthew 25:26b

You say you "tried [being] conservative" - probably an outward thing. It would be very hard for you (as someone who does not believe in conservative things) to act as someone that does. Which is prob why it "didn't work out well at all" for you. You didn't really believe what you were acting like you did. If you change your beliefs, you will change your actions.

ie. If I believe that a fetus in a womb is a child with its own life and that life is to be valued (for me this is my belief), I would be against abortion. If I believed that a fetus was just that... some extension of the host mother and is not its own life yet (probably your belief), abortion isn't that big of a deal... like removing a fungus on your toe, or an appendix or kidney.

Thus the inward belief changes the perception of abortion/homosexuality/other religions, etc.

There are many things in life that you are told that you believe, like FIG said - a science book for example. Or that my name is Paul. Do you believe that? I do. Why do I? Who knows. If you do, why do you believe me?

Now I won't debate the 3 issues you have here... there are other forums for that... but due to my beliefs on things found in scripture I disagree with you on all 3 accounts - which is to be expected.

So if you "want to be a Christian", then you are at the beginning. And:

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge.
Proverbs 1:7a

If you don't trust God enough to change your inner beliefs to His, how can you ever change?

 

[sbbqb7n16]

What is a Christian to you?

BTW, this is a good question that will probably help guide you toward answers you are looking for.

I would also like to hear your response to this question.

 

[RevCowboy]

How do you make yourself believe that the Bible is true? I've tried doing so before, but I'm such a staunch liberal that I just cannot do it. The parts about abortion being wrong, homosexuality being wrong, and non-Christian religions being wrong especially make me not want to take the entire Bible seriously. And I've tried forcing myself to be a conservative, but that didn't work out well at all. But I do want to be a Christian (or at least I'm pretty sure that I do). So what do I do?

St. Augustine, one of the most significant theologians in Christian history only converted when a Bishop told him that he didn't have to take everything in scripture literally, but rather that some were allegorical.

The reality of Christianity in North America is that group with the loudest megaphone and the most media coverage promotes simply one brand of Christianity. Perhaps you could try a mainline denomination like Episcopalian, Methodist, Lutheran or even Roman Catholic.

One does not have to Conservative to be Christian. I mean I am Canadian and I vote for a political party farther left wing than Ralph Nader, and I also have been going to university and seminary for 7 years in order to study to be a pastor. After all that time I have learned that believing in the Bible is a matter of sophisticated study.

I have also learned that faith in the Bible is not what makes one a Christian, rather it is faith in the Living Word that is Christ. Martin Luther said that the Bible is the manger that holds the Word made flesh, the Christ. While you search the manger for an experience of that living Word, you may have to sift through the straw, dung and dirt that often come with mangers.

 

[HannahBanana]

You don't "make" yourself believe the Bible. When you were a child, did you have to "make yourself" believe the science-book in science class?

Science is based on observations, though. The Bible is not.

What is a Christian to you?

A Christian is someone who takes the Bible 100% literally and who has no problem with doing so...or at least that's what I think a Christian is. I could be wrong about that.

If you find yoursel unable to let go of the notion that homosexuals are not wrong, that abortion is not wrong, that other religions are not wrong...
why do you want to be a Christian?

Because I keep hearing about how great God's love is and how much happiness people gain from being a Christian, and that really appeals to me.

...may I suggest something, though?
If Christianity is true, and if God is in this religion...then you are wrong, and these beliefs that you don't like are correct, and you are better off trusting and believing in this one.
Do you think Christianity is true?

I don't know. I want to think that it's true, but it's so hard for me to think that way.

 

[Rowan]

Yo Hannah

Is it the spirit of these beliefs that bother you? As in if you come to believe that homosexuality is wrong, will it develop a hate for homosexual people in you? or if you think abortion is wrong, will it develop in you a need to blow up abortion clinics? or if you come to believe that other religions are wrong, will it develop within you a hatred for anything different?

I know I had to deal with those issues before becoming Christian...I was kind of afraid of what I'd become.

The answers are no, no, and no, BTW.

~ Britney, just in case you forgot

 

[HannahBanana]

... first clean the inside of the cup and of the dish, so that the outside of it may become clean also.
Matthew 25:26b

You say you "tried [being] conservative" - probably an outward thing. It would be very hard for you (as someone who does not believe in conservative things) to act as someone that does. Which is prob why it "didn't work out well at all" for you. You didn't really believe what you were acting like you did. If you change your beliefs, you will change your actions.

ie. If I believe that a fetus in a womb is a child with its own life and that life is to be valued (for me this is my belief), I would be against abortion. If I believed that a fetus was just that... some extension of the host mother and is not its own life yet (probably your belief), abortion isn't that big of a deal... like removing a fungus on your toe, or an appendix or kidney.

Thus the inward belief changes the perception of abortion/homosexuality/other religions, etc.

There are many things in life that you are told that you believe, like FIG said - a science book for example. Or that my name is Paul. Do you believe that? I do. Why do I? Who knows. If you do, why do you believe me?

Now I won't debate the 3 issues you have here... there are other forums for that... but due to my beliefs on things found in scripture I disagree with you on all 3 accounts - which is to be expected.

So if you "want to be a Christian", then you are at the beginning. And:

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge.
Proverbs 1:7a

If you don't trust God enough to change your inner beliefs to His, how can you ever change?

So you're saying that it's my fault that I'm pro-choice, pro-gay rights, and pro-religious tolerance? How is it my fault when I've been this way my entire life long? I've never been conservative at all, that mindset has always seemed to make no sense at all to me (no offense or anything). So how is it my fault that I don't have a conservative mindset?

 

[HannahBanana]

Yo Hannah

Is it the spirit of these beliefs that bother you? As in if you come to believe that homosexuality is wrong, will it develop a hate for homosexual people in you? or if you think abortion is wrong, will it develop in you a need to blow up abortion clinics? or if you come to believe that other religions are wrong, will it develop within you a hatred for anything different?

I know I had to deal with those issues before becoming Christian...I was kind of afraid of what I'd become.

The answers are no, no, and no, BTW.

~ Britney, just in case you forgot

Yeah, I fear that I'll become incredibly hateful if I convert, and hatred is something that I am passionately against, so the idea that I could become a hateful person scares me to no end. How do you avoid being hateful while still following the Bible, though? I don't get it.

EDIT: Oh, hey, Britney! Thanks for responding to my post...I'm so glad to see a friendly face (even if that "face" is that of your CF Character, lol).

 

[HannahBanana]

St. Augustine, one of the most significant theologians in Christian history only converted when a Bishop told him that he didn't have to take everything in scripture literally, but rather that some were allegorical.

The reality of Christianity in North America is that group with the loudest megaphone and the most media coverage promotes simply one brand of Christianity. Perhaps you could try a mainline denomination like Episcopalian, Methodist, Lutheran or even Roman Catholic.

One does not have to Conservative to be Christian. I mean I am Canadian and I vote for a political party farther left wing than Ralph Nader, and I also have been going to university and seminary for 7 years in order to study to be a pastor. After all that time I have learned that believing in the Bible is a matter of sophisticated study.

I have also learned that faith in the Bible is not what makes one a Christian, rather it is faith in the Living Word that is Christ. Martin Luther said that the Bible is the manger that holds the Word made flesh, the Christ. While you search the manger for an experience of that living Word, you may have to sift through the straw, dung and dirt that often come with mangers.

Thanks. How do you deal with the people who say that you have to take the Bible literally in order to be a Christian, though? They have such persuasive arguments that I don't know if I would be able to ignore them.

 

[HannahBanana]

(Sorry to make so many posts in a row. I hope that's not against the rules or anything.)

Also, one thing that is especially keeping me from converting is fear: I feel a huge, incredible feeling of fear when I even think of converting to Christianity. It's like I'm afraid to even consider doing so. Is this normal, and if so, how do I overcome it?

 

[Rowan]

Yeah, I fear that I'll become incredibly hateful if I convert, and hatred is something that I am passionately against, so the idea that I could become a hateful person scares me to no end. How do you avoid being hateful while still following the Bible, though? I don't get it.

Jesus.

Let me elaborate.

Remember that not everything is instantaneous within Christ. When I first became a Christian for example, I was pro-choice, and defended it to the end. It wasn't until later that I tried to live in the faith and to be transformed by God was I sure that my former position was wrong. What that means for the real world is that I don't hate or judge doctors who perform abortions nor women that get the procedure (because that wouldn't be Christlike), but now I want to volunteer at places designed to help young and poor mothers, as well as foster and/or adopt older kids who wouldn't normally get adopted. To turn it into hate would be terrible for my soul.

None of the fruits of the Spirit is hatred. Christ brings peace. Hatred is demonic. If you find yourself driven by hatred and contempt, pray.

This could apply to the other two -- I don't hate my (many) gay friends, nor non-Christians. Same thing.

edited to add -- The opposite is pure, strict fundamentalism, that seeks extremes in EVERYTHING, while following the Law in an ungodly spirit. The problem is people who are prone to extremist fundamentalism, not the faith themselves. If Christian extreme fundamentalists weren't Christian, they'd be doing the same thing in the name of another god.

 

[RevCowboy]

Thanks. How do you deal with the people who say that you have to take the Bible literally in order to be a Christian, though? They have such persuasive arguments that I don't know if I would be able to ignore them.

Indeed that can be difficult. I deal with rather easily because read biblical greek, some Hebrew, I am almost finished my Masters of Divinity, and I have studied a lot of theology and history. Those kind of people often don't like talking to me and more often than not they tend to believe what I say because I am the one wearing the clerical collar (the black shirt with the white square at the neck). Literalists arguments don't work on me because I have always studied the bible more than they have.

However, you are not in the same situation I am. I would recommend finding a church where you are not challenged by these people and then talk to the pastor about these issues (an ELCA Lutheran Church would be such an option, but there are also others and by no means should you feel pressured to go to a Lutheran church). Then when people challenge you about taking the bible literally you can always tell them that you are talking to you pastor about it. Or if you want, you can PM I and I can answer the arguments, but I would recommend talking a live pastor.

*Just to a note to others (especially mods lurking out there), I am not trying to debate whether or not taking the bible literally is right or wrong. I think both positions are valid. I am just trying to answer the question posed in this thread.*

 

[Emmy]

Dear SoAmazinglyBlessed. It depends how seriously you want to believe. If you really want to know God, just ask and keep asking. God knows our every thought and wishes, and He will answer Hannah. The Bible is God`s Word to Man, and must be read prayerfully and sincerely. You will find that God is all Love and Forgiveness, and He wants us to love selflessly and forgive as we want to be forgiven, we were made in God`s image and our original home is Heaven. We are on this Earth to learn to love as God loves, and Jesus will help and guide us. Perhaps where you live you are able to go to Bible-Study groups? Very often we are told untruths about the Bible, by people who have not understood the Love and Compassion our God has. I say this humbly and with love, Hannah, and send greetings. Emmy, sister in Christ.

 

[sbbqb7n16]

So you're saying that it's my fault that I'm pro-choice, pro-gay rights, and pro-religious tolerance? How is it my fault when I've been this way my entire life long? I've never been conservative at all, that mindset has always seemed to make no sense at all to me (no offense or anything). So how is it my fault that I don't have a conservative mindset?

I didn't intend on blaming you or anyone else in my post.

I was trying to clarify why it was hard for you to act conservative - by saying that you have different inner beliefs about these issues than a conservative person does - and that it is those beliefs that make it hard for you to outwardly act like a conservative. I wasn't blaming you for having them, just pointing out that you do as part of that discussion.

How do you deal with the people who say that you have to take the Bible literally in order to be a Christian, though? They have such persuasive arguments that I don't know if I would be able to ignore them.

Jesus' main teaching device was parables. Most of the prophets spoke w/ word images (ie. Jeremiah's clay pots). There are some sections of the Bible that make no sense when taken literally.

I believe that most sections are to be taken literally: (ie. "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" Gen 1:1 and "He is not here, for He has risen, just as He said." Matt 28:6)

while others are symbollic: (ie Matt 25, and "He broke [bread] abd gave it to the disciples, and said, "Take, eat; this is My body"' Matt 26:26).

Some believe that everything is literal. Some that it's all symbolic. Again - not blaming anyone for having these beliefs just pointing out that they are there.

 

[tapero]

How do you make yourself believe that the Bible is true? I've tried doing so before, but I'm such a staunch liberal that I just cannot do it. The parts about abortion being wrong, homosexuality being wrong, and non-Christian religions being wrong especially make me not want to take the entire Bible seriously. And I've tried forcing myself to be a conservative, but that didn't work out well at all. But I do want to be a Christian (or at least I'm pretty sure that I do). So what do I do?

Hi!

I didn't read the bible until after I came to Christ. Many as well do not.

As to issues you mentioned, they have nothing to do with faith in Christ or believing in Christ which makes us a new creation in Christ.

God will work in you as He does with all who come to faith in Christ and your/our relationship with God is between you and He alone.

So, if you can put the things you are concerned about aside, as have nothing to do with faith in Christ, and as I said, once in Christ the Holy Spirit indwells you as do many more unseen things occur or are given us by God when we come to Christ.

One's poltical beliefs or beliefs on other topics no matter what they are may always stay such or may change.

The bible gives us the truth, again, one doesn't realize such until they are in Christ, tho one who is not in Christ can read and also see truths. Though there are some things can not be grasped by non Christians who read the bible. Many things actually.

We don't change to come to Christ, we come to Christ, and many times many things in us change. Such comes by the Holy Spirit in the believer and now the reading of the bible, as we read we see things, truths, etc, and our minds are renewed.

Sin is sin regardless of how one feels about it, and all sin, Chrisians included of course.

Abortion is not in the bible to my recollection tho verses are in there which are used to show why some believe abortion is wrong.

Homosexuality sex is a sin, as is any sexual immorality sin.

Those are only few sins of the many many sins there are and again to note, we come to Christ, are forgiven sins, past present and future, and then as we start to read the bible we slowly grow and realize other things as well.

We sin as Christians and while we are not to, we do it, God knows such, He created us, knows we will fail and bible also says anyone says is without sin is a liar.

We do not seek to sin, we seek to not sin, and all such depends on our walk with God as well.

God never stops loving us when we sin, never pulls away and we can never lose our salvation.

God also loves non believers very much so.

He calls all people to Himself and we may be called all the time, I don't know, I didn't come to Christ till I was 33, and prior to that never thought of God.

While we have all our lives to come to Christ, we never know when we may die, which is why is said the day is today..that is to trust/believe/have faith in Christ for one self.

As once we die, we no longer have an opportunity to come to Christ.

So, on issues, I wouldn't let them concern you as what you believe about matters and what I believe about things are not what makes us a Christian (except as pertains to belief in Christ.)

As it is God (the Holy Spirit) who will guide you into truth, and will help you on your walk and will work in you all your life.

All our lives we are learning of God and of truths in the bible. As tho one can have read the bible all through many many times, or even particular passages many times, doesn't mean we grasp or apply the truth in our life.

We can read scripture and one day a verse we've read a very long time, now seems to jump at is, and our lives impacted, a change in us, or the knowledge of a truth that we didn't have before, even tho we've seen that verse before and can have read and seen it many times.

So just to end, we don't change to come to Christ.

We come to Christ and are changed, all at different places, in different times, and differnt ways, some fast, some slow, as varied and unique as each of us are is as many ways one who comes to Christ's walk will be like.

All depends on each individual and is okay with God as He knows us intimitately and loves us and knows why we are where we are, and is okay.

And to note, if no one has said yet, all our sinners and Jesus died for our sins and was resurrected and Jesus says we must be born again, (which comes by belief or faith in Christ.)

To come to Christ, talk to God and tell Him whats on your heart, talking to God is same thing as praying, and praying is talking to God. Tell God everything, your concerns etc...and to come to Christ, you can tell God that, what you said about, that you desire to come to Christ or you tell Jesus I believe and am putting my faith in you and committing my life to you. You don't have to use any words I've said, just your own words.

Thanks for the question.
take care,
tapero

 

[seashale76]

How do you make yourself believe that the Bible is true? I've tried doing so before, but I'm such a staunch liberal that I just cannot do it. The parts about abortion being wrong, homosexuality being wrong, and non-Christian religions being wrong especially make me not want to take the entire Bible seriously. And I've tried forcing myself to be a conservative, but that didn't work out well at all. But I do want to be a Christian (or at least I'm pretty sure that I do). So what do I do?

I didn't force myself to believe anything. The Holy Scriptures aren't about being liberal or conservative. Those are secular political designations that are basically meaningless.

I'm taking it you are a theist of some sort. Sometimes it takes more than just reading about a faith, sometimes it must be experienced. Might I reccommend going to see an Orthodox Christian service, be it Vespers, Matins, Divine Liturgy, etc.? I was in a similar place to yourself a few years back and I couldn't ignore the truth when I encountered it after going to Divine Liturgy. I was haunted by it.

 

[hlaltimus]

How do you make yourself believe that the Bible is true? I've tried doing so before, but I'm such a staunch liberal that I just cannot do it. The parts about abortion being wrong, homosexuality being wrong, and non-Christian religions being wrong especially make me not want to take the entire Bible seriously. And I've tried forcing myself to be a conservative, but that didn't work out well at all. But I do want to be a Christian (or at least I'm pretty sure that I do). So what do I do?

Your query reminds me of the historical practice of ancient sun worshippers who prayed to the sun at every annual winter solstice for the purpose of coaxing the declining sun into returning to it's former position and not to finally depart and so leave them in the "big chill". These sun worshippers drew great encouragement for their practice in that this scheme seemed to work perfectly well for them every year.

It sounds like you have within you a great and hungering need for light, (illumination of truth that is,) and grunt and groan as you may, you'll never, ever succeed in "trying" or "forcing" this kind of spiritual light into your faculty for perception. Earthly light is something we receive when it is freely given to us. We can hide from it of our own free will, but no one ever "takes" light...We place ourselves into a position from which to receive it as it is abundantly poured out upon us through the sheer benevolence of a much, much higher Being from above.

If trying to "figure out" the feasibility of historic Christian truths is getting you no where, stop trying to grab at the sun by force of sheer intellectual comprehension. Ask the Lord to convince you of the eternal, binding and redemptive truths found in the Holy Bible through the convincing and convicting agency of His Holy Spirit, and make it clear to Him that you will be faithful to that light when once it is given.

Great secular intellectuals have come and gone who have gained widespread public recoginition for their astute perception of nearly everything under the sun except the supreme necessity of knowing personally the Son of God, Christ Jesus, and their sole and entire dependency upon the mass of intellectual acumen that they had collected was more of a hindrance to spiritual perception than it was an asset.

"For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom (It's own) did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe." I Corinthians 1:21

Believe in Him to give you that which you are unable to take of your own power.

 

[ebia]

How do you make yourself believe that the Bible is true? I've tried doing so before, but I'm such a staunch liberal that I just cannot do it. The parts about abortion being wrong, homosexuality being wrong, and non-Christian religions being wrong especially make me not want to take the entire Bible seriously. And I've tried forcing myself to be a conservative, but that didn't work out well at all. But I do want to be a Christian (or at least I'm pretty sure that I do). So what do I do?

Stop looking at it back to front, maybe.

You don't follow Christ because of a bunch of percieved prohibitions, but because Jesus is true and Lord.

If he is, then he is worth following, and allowing yourself to be transformed to his way of doing things is the right thing to do. ifthat leads you to deciding some or all of those things are wrong, well, surely the truth is better than personal preference. Those things either are wrong, in which case it's better that one comes to that conclusion, or they are not in which case you have nothing to fear.

Yeah, I fear that I'll become incredibly hateful if I convert, and hatred is something that I am passionately against, so the idea that I could become a hateful person scares me to no end. How do you avoid being hateful while still following the Bible, though? I don't get it.

Christianity isn't about following the bible, but about following Jesus of Nazareth - pure love incarnate. Why do you think that would make you a hateful person? It certainly shouldn't.

How do you deal with the people who say that you have to take the Bible literally in order to be a Christian, though?

Ignore them and make sure you mix with a more thoughtful group.

They have such persuasive arguments that I don't know if I would be able to ignore them.

Their arguments aren't particularly persuasive when you examine them properly. Join a church that does not require you to hand in your brain at the door.

 

[HisArrow]

Hi.
A true Christian is a person that follows Christ and has him in his/ her heart . This person believes that Jesus is God's son who died their sins. Then this person tries to follow Jesus's teachings. They are born again of the spirit as it talks about in John chapter 3.
i never heard that a christian needs to take the bible literally. For me ,I read the bible daily and ask God to help me understand the passage.
God does not care what political party you are involved in or the church you go to. What God is concern about is if you have Jesus in your heart. Once a person ask him in their heart and believe that Jesus is theh son of God. Then that person is a new creation. God does come in and help that person thru life's trials. HE also knows that we humans mess things up, then we come to him in prayer to ask for forgiveness.
Since becoming a true christian: I been saved from 2 homes burnings, been cured of several diseases, etc etc
If you like to know more just send me a message.