How do Trump opponents rationalize their opposition to the border wall?

[Tree of Life]

Waste of money. Majority of illegal immigrants arrive legally.

A wall at the southern border is like putting sandbags down to combat rain.

How did you learn so much about border issues?

 

[High Fidelity]

How did you learn so much about border issues?

Because I have eyes, ears and an IQ greater than my shoe size.

 

[Go Braves]

The illegal invasion.

Trump golf course housekeeper is undocumented immigrant

 

[Tree of Life]

Because I have eyes, ears and an IQ greater than my shoe size.

That's not very specific. I'm skeptical that you really know anything at all about border issues. I suspect you're just getting in line with the liberal pundits on this one. Am I wrong?

 

[childeye 2]

The illegal invasion.

What illegal invasion? Please cite your source.

 

[grasping the after wind]

Asking how someone rationalizes a thing is not exactly even handed questioning. Instead, I would suggest one who really wanted an answer to ask for what concrete arguments one has for opposing a wall. If the name Trump is included in the answer I would find that somewhat as revealing about them as using the word rationalize reveals about the OP. Perhaps some have no opposition to a wall but just oppose Trump. Certainly a great many in Congress have proven that this is the case with them. I would like to know how many oppose a wall due to concrete factors unrelated to Trump and how many just are obsessed with dislike for Trump and would oppose anything he does. For myself, I have heard the border patrol has requested walls in several place and I will concede that they are much more likely to know what is effective than I am.

 

[High Fidelity]

That's not very specific. I'm skeptical that you really know anything at all about border issues. I suspect you're just getting in line with the liberal pundits on this one. Am I wrong?

What makes you think I am unaware?

 

[Tree of Life]

What makes you think I am unaware?

I assume that unless you're a border security professional, a scholar on this or a relevant issue, or you live on the border then you're probably too unaware to credibly hold and defend an opinion on the issue. Could you provide a justification for your taking a firm stance on this issue other than the ones I've mentioned?

edit: I see that you live in the UK. I think this counts against your credibility points.

 

[High Fidelity]

I assume that unless you're a border security professional, a scholar on this or a relevant issue, or you live on the border then you're probably too unaware to credibly hold and defend an opinion on the issue. Could you provide a justification for your taking a firm stance on this issue other than the ones I've mentioned?

edit: I see that you live in the UK. I think this counts against your credibility points.

Lol. Do you need to be a border security professional to read public data issued by the government about statistics? A scholar? No. Like I said, I have eyes, I have ears and I have enough going on between my ears to form an opinion based on the overwhelming amount of information publicly available.

I don't need to be a thermodynamics professor to know holding my hand over fire will burn.

Are you finished moving the goal posts now?

 

[tulc]

by understanding that comprehensive Immigration Reform and Enforcement is not the same thing as using tax-payer dollars to build yet another Trump Tower.

What he said.
tulc(well put)

 

[bekkilyn]

Lol. Do you need to be a border security professional to read public data issued by the government about statistics? A scholar? No. Like I said, I have eyes, I have ears and I have enough going on between my ears to form an opinion based on the overwhelming amount of information publicly available.

I don't need to be a thermodynamics professor to know holding my hand over fire will burn.

Are you finished moving the goal posts now?

But see the problem is that you're not using YouTube as your primary source of news and information, so people just can't take you seriously.

 

[Halbhh]

How do they rationalize it?

The Trump administration reduced the cap for the number of refugees who will be allowed to resettle in the US to 30,000 for fiscal year 2019, according to the New York Times.

Previously, the refugee limit had been reduced to 45,000, down from a 110,000 cap established by the Obama administration .

The country is on pace to accept around 21,000 refugees this year and the new cap is the lowest limit of all time, reflecting the Trump administration’s ongoing dismantling of the country’s refugee policies.
Refugee Cap Is Now at Lowest Level Ever in the U.S.

The problem isn't the border fence, or improving it, but the new intent/purpose of it now from Trump -- to keep them out, because they are not us.


For me, I'm against Trump's "wall" -- letting in only a small amount of refugees -- because I believe in God. Meaning therefore also I believe in what He says, from the Old Covenant to the New Covenant:

Leviticus 19:34 You must treat the foreigner living among you as native-born and love him as yourself, for you were foreigners in the land of Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

Matthew 25:35 For I was hungry and you gave Me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave Me something to drink, I was a stranger and you took Me in,

Matthew 7:12 In everything, then, do to others as you would have them do to you. For this is the essence of the Law and the prophets.

If I were fleeing violence or extreme poverty to come to the "land of the free" up north, then I'd want them to allow me to immigrate, after appropriate screening so that it's shown I'm not a criminal, etc.

Don't build a wall through the Church.

 

[The Barbarian]

Personally I don't take a position on the issue because I know nothing about illegal Mexican immigration to the US. And unless you live on the border, work in border security, or have done some scholarly research on these issues I'm willing to bet that you don't either.

Our government actually asked the men and women of the border patrol, what they thought. Here it is:

WASHINGTON — President Trump has called for a wall along the border with Mexico to stop undocumented immigrants and drugs from entering the United States. But Border Patrol agents on the front lines say they need more technology and additional personnel to curb the illegal traffic, according to a report released on Thursday by Democrats on the Senate Homeland Security Committee.

The report was based on internal Customs and Border Protection documents from the 2017 fiscal year. It concluded that less than one half of 1 percent of the agents’ suggestions to secure the Southwest border mentioned the need for a wall.

The documents show that the Border Patrol identified what it called 902 “capability gaps,” or vulnerabilities, on the Southwest border. The word “wall” was suggested as a possible solution for just three of those gaps.

Agents mentioned a “fence” or “fencing” as a possible solution 34 times — less than 4 percent of the 902 vulnerabilities identified, the report found.
What Border Agents Say They Want (It’s Not a Wall)

Oddly enough, this:

Was deleted from the Border Patrol Union Webpage, shortly after Trump brought the Union president to Washington, and had him endorse the wall.

I wonder what changed his mind...

 

[bekkilyn]

The Trump administration reduced the cap for the number of refugees who will be allowed to resettle in the US to 30,000 for fiscal year 2019, according to the New York Times.

Previously, the refugee limit had been reduced to 45,000, down from a 110,000 cap established by the Obama administration .

The country is on pace to accept around 21,000 refugees this year and the new cap is the lowest limit of all time, reflecting the Trump administration’s ongoing dismantling of the country’s refugee policies.
Refugee Cap Is Now at Lowest Level Ever in the U.S.

The problem isn't the border fence, or improving it, but the new intent/purpose of it now from Trump -- to keep them out, because they are not us.


For me, I'm against Trump's "wall" -- letting in only a small amount of refugees -- because I believe in God. Meaning therefore also I believe in what He says, from the Old Covenant to the New Covenant:

Leviticus 19:34 You must treat the foreigner living among you as native-born and love him as yourself, for you were foreigners in the land of Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

Matthew 25:35 For I was hungry and you gave Me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave Me something to drink, I was a stranger and you took Me in,

Matthew 7:12 In everything, then, do to others as you would have them do to you. For this is the essence of the Law and the prophets.

If I were fleeing violence or extreme poverty to come to the "land of the free" up north, then I'd want them to allow me to immigrate, after appropriate screening so that it's shown I'm not a criminal, etc.

Don't build a wall through the Church.

What you said here is one big reason I changed my mind concerning immigration a number of years ago. I used to be pretty black and white about it. Only legal immigrants should be allowed in and the others prevented or immediately deported. I didn't understand why people couldn't see how simple it was.

But then I got to know some (legal) immigrants and heard how many years it took to become citizens, how convoluted and difficult it was to immigrate legally...over ten years and these were for "desirable" IT and engineer types. I began to imagine how literally impossible it was for anyone else not so fortunate to be very highly educated, and then when they are fleeing their countries because their lives are in danger, I couldn't say I wouldn't have done the same in their shoes. There but for the grace of God go I.

And then as a Christian, I am commanded to love my neighbor, and putting these people, including babies and small children, in camps, starving them and physically and sexually assaulting them, and separating parents from children as if they were lower beings than even the grubs we don't even think about treading upon....well, needless to say, I have a much different view on immigration (and perhaps even people in general) now, and what the current administration is doing to our neighbors is wrong in every way...politically, economically, environmentally, and morally wrong.

 

[Ringo84]

I don't have to "rationalize" anything. Again and again I've posted evidence that the wall is not effective, is not wanted and is not needed. The fact that polling in favor of the wall has been dropping like a rock is proof positive that not only is it not wanted, but Donny and his associates have failed to convince anyone that it's necessary.
Ringo