How do demons evangelise?

[Johan2222]

If a well known pastor who preached the gospel of salvation was coming to town and someone who believed strongly in their message and in their ordaining by God decided to promote the venue where the pastor was going to preach, what indications might reveal whether they were doing so by the Spirit or by demonic influence?

Please quote scriptures that support your answer.

EDIT; OK some more information as nobody has yet picked up on the cues;

The essence of this test was put before a biblical character.

What did he determine and why and what did he do in response to his determination?

OK EDIT number two as this of obviously not going to be addressed anytime soon.

Acts 16:16-18 KJV
And it came to pass, as we went to prayer, a certain damsel possessed with a spirit of divination met us, which brought her masters much gain by soothsaying: [17] The same followed Paul and us, and cried, saying, These men are the servants of the most high God, which shew unto us the way of salvation. [18] And this did she many days. But Paul, being grieved, turned and said to the spirit, I command thee in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her. And he came out the same hour.

Here was a woman who met Paul and Silas and obviously believed in their message strongly enough to go out and fervently promote their ministry free of charge.

I know some will claim that Paul and Silas knew she was possessed because they knew her history, but there is no evidence of that in scripture and some evidence to suggest otherwise.

Even if they did know she was possessed, surely that would have added more clues about where wisdom could be found to address the question . “How do Demons evangelise”?

But from the responses, especially prior to the first edit, that has not been the case.

There is certainly evidence in the woman’s behaviour that reveals her error, but with what the church teaches today, it is understandable why it is not well known.

Remember that before Christ told us to go out and evangelise the world, he showed us exactly how to do it. Luke 10.4-9.

And what has God ordained concerning them?

1 Corinthians 9:13-14 KJV
Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar? [14] Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

For those who have a heart to seek more on this;

John 6.66
Hebrews 12.6-8
Matthew 13.11
Matthew 13.52
Proverbs 5.2
Malachi 2.7

Also, seeing the error amongst some concerning the difference between possession and influence, remember that the demons cast out of Legion begged to be allowed to enter into the swine, so it is clear that they by all means seek to dwell in any host they can.

Why would you expect any different, knowing that they have been cast out of the kingdom of heaven and made homeless.

Knowing they miss their home, and knowing that all of us seek the most ideal home available, where is the only place on earth that they can find the kingdom of heaven? Luke 17.21

 

[Hoping2]

If a well known pastor who preached the gospel of salvation was coming to town and someone who believed strongly in their message and in their ordaining by God decided to promote the venue where the pastor was going to preach, what indications might reveal whether they were doing so by the Spirit or by demonic influence?

Please quote scriptures that support your answer.

Look at the fruit.
Jesus said, "Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them." (Matt 7:15-20)

 

[Gregory Thompson]

If a well known pastor who preached the gospel of salvation was coming to town and someone who believed strongly in their message and in their ordaining by God decided to promote the venue where the pastor was going to preach, what indications might reveal whether they were doing so by the Spirit or by demonic influence?

Please quote scriptures that support your answer.

Last half of James Chapter 3

 

[Gregory Thompson]

You may also notice the similarity in "fruit emphasis" as the Matthew 7 reference provided earlier in the thread.

James Chapter 3
11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?
12 Can the fig tree, my brethren, bear olive berries? either a vine, figs? so can no fountain both yield salt water and fresh.
13 ¶ Who is a wise man and endued with knowledge among you? let him shew out of a good conversation his works with meekness of wisdom.
14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.
17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.
18 And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.

The passage explains how to discern when a message comes from a demonic source, and a heavenly source, which was the question in the OP.

 

[Johan2222]

You may also notice the similarity in "fruit emphasis" as the Matthew 7 reference provided earlier in the thread.

James Chapter 3
11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?
12 Can the fig tree, my brethren, bear olive berries? either a vine, figs? so can no fountain both yield salt water and fresh.
13 ¶ Who is a wise man and endued with knowledge among you? let him shew out of a good conversation his works with meekness of wisdom.
14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.
17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.
18 And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.

The passage explains how to discern when a message comes from a demonic source, and a heavenly source, which was the question in the OP.

Sorry, pretty vague still. I am not faulting your answer, but I’m looking for something a bit more specific relating to the particular scenario that I outlined and which I don’t think I have ever heard anybody discuss.

The influence of the prince over the body is obviously quite pronounced and the three measures of meal are clearly very well leavened and that would certainly explain why it is not discussed very much.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Sorry, pretty vague still. I am not faulting your answer, but I’m looking for something a bit more specific relating to the particular scenario that I outlined and which I don’t think I have ever heard anybody discuss.

The influence of the prince over the body is obviously quite pronounced and the three measures of meal are clearly very well leavened and that would certainly explain why it is not discussed very much.

You'll probably get an answer, but the question is general in nature, so only a general answer would come from anyone outside the situation.

When I read "what indications might reveal whether they were doing so by the Spirit or by demonic influence?" I would look at the life of the church and analyze if gossip is an integral part of the life of the church.

Where rule-by-gossip exists, "bitter envying and strife" tends to be ever present.

People who came to a decision by laboring in prayer, and listening to what God had to say would follow the pattern of being "first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy."

Looking at the fruit one can determine the type of tree it is, and if that tree is sick or healthy.

In the same way no one can really know if someone is really saved, except God who saved them - No one can really know what's going on in people's hearts, except God who created those hearts. That's why we need to look at the fruit.

 

[d taylor]

If a well known pastor who preached the gospel of salvation was coming to town and someone who believed strongly in their message and in their ordaining by God decided to promote the venue where the pastor was going to preach, what indications might reveal whether they were doing so by the Spirit or by demonic influence?

Please quote scriptures that support your answer.

-
​

Do they say to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life salvation a person must believe in Jesus.

John 1:12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name:
-------------------------------
John 3:14,15 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
-------------------------------
John 3:17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.
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John 3:18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is
condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only
begotten Son of God.
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John 3:36 He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”
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John 5:24 “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.
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John 6: 27,28,29 Do not labor for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to everlasting life, which the Son of Man will give you, because God the Father has set His seal on Him.”
Then they said to Him, “What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?”
Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”
-------------------------------
John 6:47 Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believe in Me has everlasting life.
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John 11:25,26,27
Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?”

She said to Him, “Yes, Lord, I believe that You are the Christ, the Son of God, who is to come into the world.”
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John 20:31
but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

I think a red flag can be found here: "And the King shall answer and say unto them, ‘Verily I say unto you, inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these My brethren, ye have done it unto Me.’"

What is the message on care for the most vulnerable?

What we want to hear is justification for self interest.

Also

What is the message on self giving?
Luke 9:23-24
"Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross daily and follow me
John 12:24
"Whoever loves his life loses it. And whoever hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life"

 

[linux.poet]

The essence of this test was put before a biblical character.

What did he determine and why and what did he do in response to his determination?

Are you referring to this scene with Paul in Acts?

16 One day as we were going to the place of prayer, we met a female slave who had a spirit of divination and brought her owners a great deal of money by fortune-telling. 17 While she followed Paul and us, she would cry out, “These men are slaves of the Most High God, who proclaim to you the way of salvation.” 18 She kept doing this for many days. But Paul, very much annoyed, turned and said to the spirit, “I order you in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her.” And it came out that very hour.

19 But when her owners saw that their hope of making money was gone, they seized Paul and Silas and dragged them into the marketplace before the authorities.

Paul (and Luke, who wrote Acts) must have had determined that the girl had a demon, the standout was knowledge she could not have possessed on her own, and Paul took authority over the demon and told it to leave.

If so, the OP didn't make this clear because demonic influence is not the same as possession. Someone can be influenced by a demon (or by Satan) without being possessed.

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

If a well known pastor who preached the gospel of salvation was coming to town and someone who believed strongly in their message and in their ordaining by God decided to promote the venue where the pastor was going to preach, what indications might reveal whether they were doing so by the Spirit or by demonic influence?

Please quote scriptures that support your answer.

EDIT; OK some more information as nobody has yet picked up on the cues;

The essence of this test was put before a biblical character.

What did he determine and why and what did he do in response to his determination?

There are mountains of open clues, but people still miss them by the score.

Anyone who sells a "way out."
Anyone who claims to be sinless.
Anyone who does not actually love their neighbors
Anyone who makes faith into a magic act rather than simply loving our neighbors
Anyone who picks your pocket

I could go on. Unfortunately when one is first born again it seems like we are lied to like no other place other than politics and we are either forced to go through the pieces and measure or we just get suckered in and stay there

 

[Johan2222]

Are you referring to this scene with Paul in Acts?



Paul (and Luke, who wrote Acts) must have had determined that the girl had a demon, the standout was knowledge she could not have possessed on her own, and Paul took authority over the demon and told it leave.

If so, the OP didn't make this clear because demonic influence is not the same as possession. Someone can be influenced by a demon (or by Satan) without being possessed.

It was clear enough for the discerning. Paul would have put the dots together in a second, even before I added the edit. Kindergarten clarity when asking questions requiring a little discernment rather defeats the purpose.

Paul didn’t make many things clear intentionally. 2 Peter 3.16.

The spirit does not lay everything bare in childlike fashion for several reasons. 1 Corinthians 2.13

Your point about possession/influence is likewise moot in the same fashion, for there was more than enough information to put the dots together and put an answer forward describing both scenarios if anyone wanted to.

You will notice that the edit said “the essence of the test”, not the exact test.

How Paul determined her possession is not clearly revealed, but it is revealed, and it is not for the reason you suppose.

Daniel knew information that he could not have known naturally, but Paul would not have determined by that knowledge that he was possessed.

Many people reveal their spirits without divulging information they should not know and this woman did likewise.

 

[Lost4words]

Demons evangelise through organisations like LGBQ+ and gender alteration etc etc

 

[Johan2222]

Demons evangelise through organisations like LGBQ+ and gender alteration etc etc

Far more people are going to be led into captivity by those who come as angels of light than those who come as angels of Sodom.

 

[Lost4words]

Far more people are going to be led into captivity by those who come as angels of light than those who come as angels of Sodom.

Explain.....

 

[linux.poet]

It was clear enough for the discerning.

Spiritual discernment is not mind reading. Your responsibility is to communicate clearly, and if your post is a trap to bait people into a spiritual guessing game so you can criticize their lack of spiritual maturity, you and you alone are responsible for that too.

It was clear enough for the discerning. Paul would have put the dots together in a second, even before I added the edit. Kindergarten clarity when asking questions requiring a little discernment rather defeats the purpose.

I am not Paul, and neither are the members of this forum. Furthermore, there is no need to obscure information because none of the members of this forum are demon possessed. Demon possession, if we look at Mark 5, leads to chaotic behavior:

He lived among the tombs; and no one was able to bind him anymore, not even with a chain, because he had often been bound with shackles and chains, and the chains had been torn apart by him and the shackles broken in pieces; and no one was strong enough to subdue him. Constantly, night and day, he was screaming among the tombs and in the mountains, and cutting himself with stones. Seeing Jesus from a distance, he ran up and bowed down before Him; and shouting with a loud voice, he *said, “What business do You have with me, Jesus, Son of the Most High God? I implore You by God, do not torment me!” For He had already been saying to him, “Come out of the man, you unclean spirit!” And He was asking him, “What is your name?” And he *said to Him, “My name is Legion, for we are many.”

Therefore, such chaotic behavior would invariably break a bunch of forum rules and guidelines and the person would be banned. The obnoxious behavior of the woman and Paul would be harassment, which is against the rules here.

Furthermore, I’ve spent 4 years studying communication in the English language and 14 years posting on online forums, and if that experience has taught me anything, it’s that the capacity of human beings for miscommunication is quite vast. It takes effort to communicate clearly in a piece of writing so that you are understood. We don’t need “lack of spiritual discernment” to fail to understand each other; we mess that up well enough on our own. What you mock as “kindergarten clarity” is frequently essential.

Paul didn’t make many things clear intentionally. 2 Peter 3.16.

This is a misinterpretation of Scripture. The verse literally says that Paul has things in his letters that are “hard to understand”. The reason why they are hard is because God is infinite and we are not, and so trying to comprehend Him and His actions is difficult.

Paul did not obscure information the way Jesus did with the parables. Jesus was stopping the Jewish people from making him King by force, and also killing him before his time on the cross. At the end of the day, the Jewish people would have to crucify Him to be free from their sins, which they might not have done had they understood it. They wanted to be trapped in their sin.

Paul, on the other hand, was in a very different scenario, trying to fight falsehoods tooth and nail and keep the churches that he had started under control. He had no benefit to obscuring information, he was an authority figure that people wrote to with problems, and they wanted clear and truthful solutions.

Your point about possession/influence is likewise moot in the same fashion, for there was more than enough information to put the dots together and put an answer forward describing both scenarios if anyone wanted to.

Since other posts described the influence scenario, there was no need to go into it in my own post because that has already been described, so this point is also moot.

Daniel knew information that he could not have known naturally, but Paul would not have determined by that knowledge that he was possessed.

Daniel asked God for that knowledge, and God gave it to him. It was not an instant process, and credit was given to the proper place.

The reason Daniel was able to read the handwriting on the wall was because it was written in Hebrew, which was a common thing for him to know. It’s not demon possession to know how to read another language.

 

[RileyG]

Demons evangelise through organisations like LGBQ+ and gender alteration etc etc

Amen.

 

[RileyG]

Explain.....

There is no new sin under the sun. The sin of Sodom is very alive today in America and throughout the Western world, many celebrate it as "love is love" despite it's unnatural lust (Romans 1:26-27).

 

[Johan2222]

Spiritual discernment is not mind reading. Your responsibility is to communicate clearly, and if your post is a trap to bait people into a spiritual guessing game so you can criticize their lack of spiritual maturity, you and you alone are responsible for that too.

I am not Paul, and neither are the members of this forum. Furthermore, there is no need to obscure information because none of the members of this forum are demon possessed. Demon possession, if we look at Mark 5, leads to chaotic behavior:



Therefore, such chaotic behavior would invariably break a bunch of forum rules and guidelines and the person would be banned. The obnoxious behavior of the woman and Paul would be harassment, which is against the rules here.

Furthermore, I’ve spent 4 years studying communication in the English language and 14 years posting on online forums, and if that experience has taught me anything, it’s that the capacity of human beings for miscommunication is quite vast. It takes effort to communicate clearly in a piece of writing so that you are understood. We don’t need “lack of spiritual discernment” to fail to understand each other; we mess that up well enough on our own. What you mock as “kindergarten clarity” is frequently essential.


This is a misinterpretation of Scripture. The verse literally says that Paul has things in his letters that are “hard to understand”. The reason why they are hard is because God is infinite and we are not, and so trying to comprehend Him and His actions is difficult.

Paul did not obscure information the way Jesus did with the parables. Jesus was stopping the Jewish people from making him King by force, and also killing him before his time on the cross. At the end of the day, the Jewish people would have to crucify Him to be free from their sins, which they might not have done had they understood it. They wanted to be trapped in their sin.

Paul, on the other hand, was in a very different scenario, trying to fight falsehoods tooth and nail and keep the churches that he had started under control. He had no benefit to obscuring information, he was an authority figure that people wrote to with problems, and they wanted clear and truthful solutions.

Since other posts described the influence scenario, there was no need to go into it in my own post because that has already been described, so this point is also moot.


Daniel asked God for that knowledge, and God gave it to him. It was not an instant process, and credit was given to the proper place.

The reason Daniel was able to read the handwriting on the wall was because it was written in Hebrew, which was a common thing for him to know. It’s not demon possession to know how to read another language.

Until a man is able to recognise the darkness that comes as an angel of light, how will he know the true light?

Do you think Satan has not deceived wiser men than you?

Matthew 16:23 KJV
But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

Do you think Jesus changed Peter‘s name.

John 13:27 KJV
And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.

Do you think the Pharisees and scribes received Judas as a blithering madman?

Matthew 6:23 KJV
. . . If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness!

If it was obvious, do you think Christ would have given us such a warning?

When it comes to communication, my responsibilities come from God and they include not casting pearls before swine, striving to be at peace with all men where possible, speaking the truth in love, rebuking exhorting and many other things.

Jude 1:23 KJV
And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

Though you have made yourself the judge of what my responsibilities are, know assuredly that you have usurped the position of God who is my judge.

Do you think you have done that by the Spirit of God?

 

[linux.poet]

Until a man is able to recognise the darkness that comes as an angel of light, how will he know the true light?

Do you think Satan has not deceived wiser men than you?

I'm certain that he has, because he deceived Solomon through his love of foreign women.

The true light is found in God's Word, the Bible, and through faith in Jesus Christ and the power of the indwelling Holy Spirit. I don't need to research Satan to know the truth about God. You have it backward. It is knowing biblical truth, the true light, which is what allows each believer in Christ to uproot the lies of Satan that are in all of our sinful hearts and destroying our minds.

Do you think Jesus changed Peter‘s name.

No.

Do you think the Pharisees and scribes received Judas as a blithering madman?

No. I think Satan has more intelligence than his legions of followers. Satan is sharp enough to make arguments to God in Job 1, talk to Jesus when he was tempting him, and deceive Eve in the Garden. He is intelligent and cunning.

But he is also a defeated enemy.

10 Anyone whom you forgive, I also forgive. In fact, what I have forgiven, if I have forgiven anything, has been for your sake in the presence of Christ. 11 And we do this so that we may not be outwitted by Satan, for we are not ignorant of his designs.

If you look at this passage, part of Satan's plan is to divide us by unforgiveness. What bothers me here about these posts is how much they evidence a lack of trust in people. This is the Christians-Only section; these are your brothers and sisters in Christ.

12 A scoundrel and a villain
goes around with crooked speech,
13 winking the eyes, shuffling the feet,
pointing the fingers,
14 with perverted mind devising evil,
continually sowing discord;
15 on such a one calamity will descend suddenly,
in a moment, damage beyond repair.

What you fear, you give power to; if you think Satan is around every corner, he will arrive. It is not wise to continually fear his influence and to be suspicious of everyone, as the proverb says above.

7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you. 8 Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded. 9 Lament and mourn and weep. Let your laughter be turned into mourning and your joy into dejection. 10 Humble yourselves before the Lord, and he will exalt you.

11 Do not speak evil against one another, brothers and sisters. Whoever speaks evil against another or judges another speaks evil against the law and judges the law, but if you judge the law, you are not a doer of the law but a judge. 12 There is one lawgiver and judge who is able to save and to destroy. So who, then, are you to judge your neighbor?

The Lord would not have given the command to resist the devil if it were not indeed possible. It's telling that after James commands believers to resist the devil, he tells them not to speak evil of one another. Not only is this consistent with Paul's teaching in 2 Corinthians, it precludes fear of false teaching from the devil as as a source of division. Such false teaching is simply to be uprooted as false and moved on from.

for God did not give us a spirit of cowardice but rather a spirit of power and of love and of self-discipline.

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

The difficulty in discussions about our adversary is that adversary is part of everyone's package.

It's not a question of IF we ignore the subject our adversary, our temptations, our trials go away. The tempter is in fact the source of all these things and us so because that tempter is intertwined within everyone. An enemy unseen

Mark 4:15 is a hard line fact for everyone.

God Himself bound us all to the spirit of disobedience. It's actually DISHONEST to not discuss it and cover it up, like Adam and Eve did in the garden

The reason it needs to be dragged out into the sunlight has a very simple spiritual principle behind it. It shows our dominion over that liar because the devil can't speak the truth.

When we go before the Lord we go with an evil conscience intact. We have the tempter or his own intact.

None of us are sinless, ever in this life. We're no better than the lowest of sinners, Romans 3:9. Paul placed himself even lower. The very lowest of sinners, 1 Tim. 1:15

And the thing is, sin is of the devil. 1 John 3:8, Mark 4:15 and others

Sins are not counted against people, 2 Cor. 5:19. BUT those sins ARE counted against the devil.

This subject is meant to be exposed. We're not called into lying cover up hypocrisy

Most who read this scripture can't even hear Jesus saying hypocrisy is the BEAM or LOG in our own eye

Matthew 7:5
Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

How easy it is to pluck that neighbors sliver WHEN IT'S NOT THEM.

See?

Fact is Jesus could look any of us in the face and speak to the TEMPTER just as He did with Peter