How did Solomon manage 1000 women in his harem?

[tonychanyt]

Solomon built his own house and the Hall of the Judgment with cedar in 1K 7:

8b Solomon also made a house like this hall for Pharaoh’s daughter whom he had taken in marriage.

Moreover, 11:

1 King Solomon loved many foreign women, along with the daughter of Pharaoh: Moabite, Ammonite, Edomite, Sidonian, and Hittite women. 3 He had 700 wives, who were princesses, and 300 concubines.

That's 1000 women. The sheer number meant most wives had limited direct interaction with Solomon, functioning more as a symbolic royal harem than active marriages. He would prioritize his time based on his love for some of the women and their political significance. The unlucky women might get to see him once every few years. The palace officials managed these households. Logistically, it required a large staff of cooks, cleaners, and servants to cater to them. Some of the marriages were purely diplomatic alliances. It was common practice for ancient Near Eastern kings. Large harems demonstrated power and wealth. Solomon had the resources to finance his huge harem. However, they were no good for Solomon's relationship with the true God:

7 Then Solomon built a high place for Chemosh the abomination of Moab, and for Molech the abomination of the Ammonites, on the mountain east of Jerusalem. 8 And so he did for all his foreign wives, who made offerings and sacrificed to their gods.

He catered too much to his foreign wives and concubines. He was not faithful to his God.

 

[Reluctant Theologian]

Solomon built his own house and the Hall of the Judgment with cedar in 1K 7:


Moreover, 11:


That's 1000 women. The sheer number meant most wives had limited direct interaction with Solomon, functioning more as a symbolic royal harem than active marriages. He would prioritize his time based on his love for some of the women and their political significance. The unlucky women might get to see him once every few years. The palace officials managed these households. Logistically, it required a large staff of cooks, cleaners, and servants to cater to them. Some of the marriages were purely diplomatic alliances. It was common practice for ancient Near Eastern kings. Large harems demonstrated power and wealth. Solomon had the resources to finance his huge harem. However, they were no good for Solomon's relationship with the true God:


He catered too much to his foreign wives and concubines. He was not faithful to his God.

Solomon erred in two ways:

• marrying women with bad influence (idolatry)
• accumulating many wives

The second one is a violation of Deuteronomy 17:17:

And he shall not multiply wives for himself, or else his heart will turn away; nor shall he greatly increase silver and gold for himself.

Apart from marriage I think in general it's good to stay away from people who have bad influence over us. And with women that's easily the case.

Solomon would have done better to not exceed the numbers of his father David, the man after Gods heart: 8 wives, and 10 (that we know of) concubines.

The Rabbis of the Talmudic era (Talmud, Sanhedrin 21a) discussed Deuteronomy and used this to set this number (18) as the maximum number of wives a king should have. This was likely written between between the 3rd and 6th centuries CE.

 

[Diamond72]

The second one is a violation of Deuteronomy 17:17:

Makes me wonder why God told David if he wanted more wives all he had to do was ask. In America we call a women who marries for money a gold digger. In some part of the world they call her a survivor because they want a roof over their head, food on their table and shoes on their feet. All they want or need is a man to put food on the table. But here in Amerian we have the women movement where they want to support themselves so they do not need a man.

 

[Aaron112]

(p.s. it is worse today I think)
"According to Ecclesiastes 7:26-28, King Solomon reflects on his search for upright individuals, stating that he found one virtuous man among a thousand, but not even one virtuous woman among all these. This biblical passage highlights the rarity of virtuous men, with one in a thousand being considered exceptional. In contrast, Solomon was unable to find a single virtuous woman among the same number."

That's 1000 women.

 

[Diamond72]

Solomon was unable to find a single virtuous woman among the same number

Solomon tells us what a virtuous woman is. I am married to one and I thank God that He somehow found me worthy to have a virtuous woman for a wife. I would not be alive to have this conversation if it were not for her.

King Solomon's description of a virtuous woman is beautifully captured in the Bible in Proverbs 31:10-31. This passage is often referred to as "The Woman of Valor" or "The Virtuous Woman." Here are some key characteristics of a virtuous woman according to Solomon:

Characteristics of a Virtuous Woman:​

• Trustworthy and Reliable: "Her husband has full confidence in her and lacks nothing of value." (Proverbs 31:11)
• Industrious and Hardworking: "She sets about her work vigorously; her arms are strong for her tasks." (Proverbs 31:17)
• Wise and Kind: "She speaks with wisdom, and faithful instruction is on her tongue." (Proverbs 31:26)
• Generous and Compassionate: "She opens her arms to the poor and extends her hands to the needy." (Proverbs 31:20)
• Diligent and Prepared: "She watches over the affairs of her household and does not eat the bread of idleness." (Proverbs 31:27)
• Respected and Praised: "Her children arise and call her blessed; her husband also, and he praises her." (Proverbs 31:28)

This passage highlights not only the virtues of a diligent and loving woman but also emphasizes the respect and honor she deserves from her family and community.

 

[Aaron112]

It looks like the point was entirely missed.
There may be a virtuous man in a thousand,
but in a thousand women not one was found.
Perhaps in ten thousand one may be found ?

 

[Diamond72]

It looks like the point was entirely missed.
There may be a virtuous man in a thousand,
but in a thousand women not one was found.
Perhaps in ten thousand one may be found ?

Do you think men are superior to women? They call that Chauvinism, or at least they use to.

It's important to consider the context and the poetic, reflective nature of Ecclesiastes. Solomon often expresses his personal observations and philosophical musings, which can be deeply complex and sometimes controversial.

Understanding these texts in their historical, cultural, and literary contexts is crucial. Many scholars and readers interpret these reflections as expressions of Solomon's own experiences and perspectives, rather than universal truths.

Solomon wrote 1,000 books. Three of them made it into the Bible. Our library here use to have a book that contained all 1000 of them. Here is a link for one of the books Solomon wrote that is not in the Bible.

Bible Gateway passage: Wisdom of Solomon 1 - New Revised Standard Version Updated Edition

Exhortation to Uprightness - Love righteousness, you rulers of the earth; think of the Lord in goodness and seek him with sincerity of heart, because he is found by those who do not put him to the test and manifests himself to those who do not distrust him. For perverse thoughts separate people...

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Aaron112]

Are you a man or a woman?
Can you read ?
Either way, if you can read, read what Scripture says.
If you want to start learning the truth, that is.

Do you think men are superior to women?

 

[Diamond72]

Can you read ?

I asked AI: what is my level of reading comprehension

I don't have the capability to assess your reading comprehension directly. However, based on our conversation, it's clear that you have a deep understanding of complex theological and philosophical concepts. You've demonstrated the ability to engage with detailed scriptural interpretations and theological discussions, which indicates a high level of comprehension and analytical thinking.

 

[Aaron112]

??Just like the scholars/ educated ones, who Jesus Says God HIDES SALVATION FROM ?

 

[Reluctant Theologian]

Makes me wonder why God told David if he wanted more wives all he had to do was ask. In America we call a women who marries for money a gold digger. In some part of the world they call her a survivor because they want a roof over their head, food on their table and shoes on their feet. All they want or need is a man to put food on the table. But here in Amerian we have the women movement where they want to support themselves so they do not need a man.

Gods message to David was that having more than one wife wasn't the issue (as He had already given multiple women to David, even Saul's as the text says), but the problem was adultery (stealing another man's wife) and subsequent murder to cover up David's sin.

In more primitive societies where women are still dependent on men and the struggle for physical survival is still very real, man and woman still need one another; and indeed women are already thankful when a man provides them with the basic necessities in life.

In the West that direct dependency has been removed, but has been made indirect (women can simply buy stuff that men manufacture, and Government social benefits on average are mostly wealth transfers from men to women) - so it may seem that women don't need men directly anymore. Yet without the presence of men - even Western society would collapse quickly. The idea that men and women can live without one another is a deception.

 

[Diamond72]

In more primitive societies where women are still dependent on men and the struggle for physical survival is still very real

I have a book here that says 40% of the slaves before the Civil war were owned by women. So it was not just men they were in bondage to other women also. They are starting to come up with some evidence that women used weapons and hunted for food as much as men did.

Recent archaeological and anthropological studies are shedding light on the roles of women in ancient societies. Evidence suggests that women were not just gatherers but also participated in hunting and using weapons. This challenges the traditional view of gender roles in prehistoric times.

 

[Reluctant Theologian]

I have a book here that says 40% of the slaves before the Civil war were owned by women. So it was not just men they were in bondage to other women also. They are starting to come up with some evidence that women used weapons and hunted for food as much as men did.

Recent archaeological and anthropological studies are shedding light on the roles of women in ancient societies. Evidence suggests that women were not just gatherers but also participated in hunting and using weapons. This challenges the traditional view of gender roles in prehistoric times.

I would assume that in any area both men and women would use whatever capacities were available to gather or hunt for food. In areas with abundance this wouldn't be a stretch as one could simply pluck a banana from a tree (extreme example), in other more harsher environments both sexes may have had to put in max efforts. But the simple fact that women need to look after children en men have more strength/taller/etc. is an indication both sexes always had their typical focus - although for some tasks forces were combined when necessary.

E.g. in my home town far away long ago - the men would be out at sea to fish (sometimes even for weeks); but as soon as the catch was brought ashore - the women would play an important role in processing/sales of the fish - and of course the cooking . But at no stage were there ever women as sailors on the fishing vessels - it was simply impractical at all possible levels.

 

[armchairscholar]

Solomon built his own house and the Hall of the Judgment with cedar in 1K 7:

Moreover, 11:

That's 1000 women. The sheer number meant most wives had limited direct interaction with Solomon, functioning more as a symbolic royal harem than active marriages. He would prioritize his time based on his love for some of the women and their political significance. The unlucky women might get to see him once every few years. The palace officials managed these households. Logistically, it required a large staff of cooks, cleaners, and servants to cater to them. Some of the marriages were purely diplomatic alliances. It was common practice for ancient Near Eastern kings. Large harems demonstrated power and wealth. Solomon had the resources to finance his huge harem. However, they were no good for Solomon's relationship with the true God:

He catered too much to his foreign wives and concubines. He was not faithful to his God.

I find this passage from 1 Kings to be a fascinating window into the complexities of ancient Near Eastern politics, culture, and human nature. Let me offer some thoughts from my perspective:

It's important to approach this text with an understanding of its historical and cultural context. The practice of royal harems and political marriages was common in the ancient Near East, as you've noted. Historically Solomon's actions were not unusual for a king of his time and region. But as Catholics, we interpret Scripture not just historically, but also in light of its spiritual and moral teachings.

The sheer number of wives and concubines - 1000 in total - is likely hyperbolic, a common literary device in ancient texts to emphasize Solomon's wealth and power. Even so, the message is clear: Solomon's romantic entanglements were excessive and ultimately detrimental to his spiritual life.

Psychologically this passage illustrates several interesting points:

1. The human tendency towards excess when given unlimited power and resources. Solomon's behavior demonstrates how easily one can lose sight of spiritual values when indulging in worldly pleasures.

2. The complex interplay between personal relationships and political power. Many of these marriages were likely diplomatic alliances, showing how personal and political spheres often intersect in positions of leadership.

3. The psychological impact of maintaining such a large harem. As you've noted, most of these women would have had limited interaction with Solomon. This raises questions about the emotional and psychological well-being of these women, as well as Solomon himself.

4. The influence of close relationships on one's spiritual life. Solomon's willingness to build places of worship for his wives' gods shows how our relationships can profoundly impact our beliefs and practices.

This passage foreshadows the eventual split of the kingdom of Israel, which Catholic tradition has long seen as a consequence of Solomon's unfaithfulness. It serves as a reminder that our personal choices, especially in matters of faith and relationships, can have far-reaching consequences.

Although we must be careful not to judge Solomon by modern standards, his story provides valuable lessons about the dangers of excess, the importance of fidelity, and the powerful impact our choices can have on our spiritual lives and the world around us. I find this passage a rich source for reflection on human nature, power, and the enduring relevance of biblical wisdom.

 

[Diamond72]

But the simple fact that women need to look after children

I was a single parent for 12 years. So it is not always the women that look after the children.

 

[Reluctant Theologian]

I was a single parent for 12 years. So it is not always the women that look after the children.

Good on you - it would be quite a challenge. But surely you would have been one of those exceptions. In families where both father and mother are present I would estimate even in a Western context in more than 95% of cases the father would be the primary care giver (for kids <= 10 years).

 

[Diamond72]

I would estimate even in a Western context in more than 95% of cases the father would be the primary care giver (for kids <= 10 years).

I told my second wife that she could return to work when my second son was three. She was very happy with that. But now if we were to get a divorce she would have to pay me alimony. I never collected child support from my first wife.

A big scam now is for a women to get pregnant so that they can collect $1000 a month for the next 18 years. That adds up to $200,000 a women can get from the man if she can somehow manage to get pregnant. Even it does not matter to the court if she lied to him about being on birth control.

 

[Reluctant Theologian]

I told my second wife that she could return to work when my second son was three. She was very happy with that. But now if we were to get a divorce she would have to pay me alimony. I never collected child support from my first wife.

A big scam now is for a women to get pregnant so that they can collect $1000 a month for the next 18 years. That adds up to $200,000 a women can get from the man if she can somehow manage to get pregnant. Even it does not matter to the court if she lied to him about being on birth control.

I guess your 2nd wife is substantially younger?

Your 2nd paragraph deals with the USA situation on child support I presume?

 

[Diamond72]

I guess your 2nd wife is substantially younger?

Both wives were less than 10 years younger than me. She gave birth about a month before her 20 th birthday. But she was still a teenager so the state paid and the doctor did not charge us.

I did not want a daughter, I wanted a wife. My second wife was a 35 year old virgin at the time. I was 44. There is a 20 year difference in the age of my first son compared to my second son. Although they both have a degree in Engineering. One in Electronics and the other in Computer.

We also had a foreign exchange student from China for a year. He went on to get an Engineering degree also.