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Simplistically speaking, a Jew is someone who practices Judaism and originated from the Israelites...
Since presumably, we all came from Noah, then probably all we need to do is just is to be accepted by Judaism and practice the religion and we would become a Jew.
I know it's not that simple but if we use the Noah argument, we are technically Jews who got lost along the way
From what I understand there was only one ice age caused by the flood of Noah as the waters receded and the moisture accumulated over the poles of the earth...and precipitated.
There's been more than one. The last glacial maximum was around 13,000 years ago, and the Holocene glacial epoch began about 11,500 years ago. Also, here's a fun fact - about 15,000 years ago the Persian Gulf was dry. The more I learn the more nonsensical trying to cram 4.6 billion years of earth's history into 6,000 years becomes.
There's been more than one. The last glacial maximum was around 13,000 years ago, and the Holocene glacial epoch began about 11,500 years ago. Also, here's a fun fact - about 15,000 years ago the Persian Gulf was dry. The more I learn the more nonsensical trying to cram 4.6 billion years of earth's history into 6,000 years becomes.
There may be several grains of truth to the flood mythology of Noah and similar mythologies from elsewhere in the ancient Middle East. About 25 years ago it was discovered (" Noah's Flood" by Ryan and Pitman) that in antiquity the Black Sea was a freshwater lake with a water level at least 155 meters (510 feet) below its present level. It was cut off from the Mediterranean Sea by a silt plug in the Straits of Bosporus. This plug broke through about 5600 BC due primarily to the dramatic rise in sea levels caused by the melting that ended the last ice age.. It created an immense waterfall whose sound was most likely audible for 100 or more miles. The Black Sea basin filled to its present level over a period of several weeks. It is estimated that the shore line advanced at the rate of a mile or more per day. For the people living around the lake it was a catastrophe of immense magnitude. It was likely the single most memorable flood in all of human history. The racial memory of this event probably inspired the Gilgamesh epic which in turn inspired the Noah narrative in the Bible. The evidence for this flood is scientifically solid. This prompted the National Geographic Society to finance an underwater search along the ancient shoreline for evidence of pre-flood human habitation. This search has been successful! A settlement has been found at a depth of 90 meters approximately 12 miles off the coast of Turkey. It is in a remarkable state of preservation because it is located in an area of the Black Sea where the water is completely devoid of oxygen with the effect that biological decomposition does not take place. This means that wooden artifacts such as tools, planks, housing beams etc are preserved intact. What is also quite amazing is that while there is solid scientific evidence for this local flood some 7600 YBP, there is no evidence at all for a worldwide flood just 4300 YBP. One would think that a more recent, more catastrophic event would have wiped out evidence of the earlier Black Sea event. There is also evidence for a similar event causing the flooding of the Gulf of Arabia about 10,000 YBP.
Don't forget the Great Flood... The account of the flood told by other races also told of large boats being built by other races. It wasn't only Noah and his family who survived the great flood...
...Otherwise, we'll all be Jews, isn't that right?
Israel was not born until after the Flood. Noah was not an Israelite, nor were any of his sons or their wives. His descendant Jacob was the founder of the Israelite line. Judaism is named after his son Judah (by way of the place and people bearing his name), but it is difficult to say exactly when our concept of Judaism first emerged and became definitive.According to Judaism, we are all sons of Noah including the Gentiles...
It would seem to imply we are all Israelites originally. What only distinguishes a Jew is that a Jew is someone who practice Judaism.
There were many floods throughout Mesopotamia from 4000 BC to 2500 BC. I think the Mesopotamian flood story relates the conditions of a fairly recent regional flood, not the Black Sea event of 5600 BC. In Atrahasis, the gods bitterly regret their decision to flood the land. If the story was a retelling of the Black Sea event, this feature would have fallen out, because the numerous intervening floods would have suggested to the Mesopotamians that the gods did not really regret it at all.I've heard about the Black Sea flood. It makes sense that event would be the basis for the Epic of Gilgamesh and the story of Noah which came later.
If you take it literally, and assume what your saying is true, God would have been lying about Noah being the only one righteous, unless he simply couldn't find the others, which doesn't bold well either.
What if we get our Torah from the Septuagint? It comes from Hellenists, not Pharisees. We could piece together a lot of the Torah from the Dead Sea Scrolls, too. Those were written by Essenes, not Pharisees. The Samaritans preserved the Torah, too. No way were they allowed into the Pharisee clubhouse.Everything that belongs to that religion is Judaism or Pharisee. And this includes the Torah (The first five books of the Bible, is common to Judaism/Pharisee).
Remember Jesus warning us about anything coming from the Pharisees. Now, can you trust anything from the Torah is 100% truth?
The Black Sea flood doesn't fit the description of the flood presented in the bible.There may be several grains of truth to the flood mythology of Noah and similar mythologies from elsewhere in the ancient Middle East. About 25 years ago it was discovered (" Noah's Flood" by Ryan and Pitman) that in antiquity the Black Sea was a freshwater lake with a water level at least 155 meters (510 feet) below its present level. It was cut off from the Mediterranean Sea by a silt plug in the Straits of Bosporus. This plug broke through about 5600 BC due primarily to the dramatic rise in sea levels caused by the melting that ended the last ice age.. It created an immense waterfall whose sound was most likely audible for 100 or more miles. The Black Sea basin filled to its present level over a period of several weeks. It is estimated that the shore line advanced at the rate of a mile or more per day. For the people living around the lake it was a catastrophe of immense magnitude. It was likely the single most memorable flood in all of human history. The racial memory of this event probably inspired the Gilgamesh epic which in turn inspired the Noah narrative in the Bible. The evidence for this flood is scientifically solid. This prompted the National Geographic Society to finance an underwater search along the ancient shoreline for evidence of pre-flood human habitation. This search has been successful! A settlement has been found at a depth of 90 meters approximately 12 miles off the coast of Turkey. It is in a remarkable state of preservation because it is located in an area of the Black Sea where the water is completely devoid of oxygen with the effect that biological decomposition does not take place. This means that wooden artifacts such as tools, planks, housing beams etc are preserved intact. What is also quite amazing is that while there is solid scientific evidence for this local flood some 7600 YBP, there is no evidence at all for a worldwide flood just 4300 YBP. One would think that a more recent, more catastrophic event would have wiped out evidence of the earlier Black Sea event. There is also evidence for a similar event causing the flooding of the Gulf of Arabia about 10,000 YBP.
Time does work!The answer can be complicated. Remember that the Jews have their distinct religion that is *not* Christianity -- Judaism. To keep the story short, Judaism came directly from Pharisee.
Everything that belongs to that religion is Judaism or Pharisee. And this includes the Torah (The first five books of the Bible, is common to Judaism/Pharisee).
Remember Jesus warning us about anything coming from the Pharisees. Now, can you trust anything from the Torah is 100% truth?
What if we get our Torah from the Septuagint? It comes from Hellenists, not Pharisees. We could piece together a lot of the Torah from the Dead Sea Scrolls, too. Those were written by Essenes, not Pharisees. The Samaritans preserved the Torah, too. No way were they allowed into the Pharisee clubhouse.
If we hold that Adam and Eve started out in ancient Mesopotamia and then humanity spread out from there... how did Native Americans and other people in the "western" continent get all the way over there? I mean, it was hard enough for people after "ancient times" get a boat over there without dying on the way. How did they even get there???
Unless we can accept the Pangea theory that all the continents were one big continent and that continental drift is a real thing (which I don't think would contradict Creationism at all).
But I'm just curious as to how they got there...
If we hold that Adam and Eve started out in ancient Mesopotamia and then humanity spread out from there... how did Native Americans and other people in the "western" continent get all the way over there? I mean, it was hard enough for people after "ancient times" get a boat over there without dying on the way. How did they even get there???
Over the centuries and going right back to the New Testament itself, the Pharisees have been viewed very negatively. In my opinion most of this negativity is quite undeserved.
At the time of Jesus the Pharisees were the most liberal and progressive aspect of Judaism. They were in several 'schools' or ‘bets’ --- the most progressive was Bet Hillel, which was in a minority position at the time of Jesus. The dominant group was the more conservative Bet Shammai. Towards the end of the first century following the destruction of the temple, Bet Hillel moved into the dominant role. Modern rabbinical Judaism traces its roots to the Pharisee movement.
Being a rabbi, Jesus was also a Pharisee and it seems most likely that Jesus was of Bet Hillel. To suggest that the scribes and Pharisees were in bed with the high priest and his little group is to betray a lack of understanding of Judaism at that time. The high priest, a Sadducee, was the most hated man in Judaism for the simple reason that he was regarded as a Roman 'quisling' --- he was after all personally appointed by the procurator himself and answered to him. The high priest did chair the Sanhedrin but did not control it. It was, in fact, controlled by the Pharisees who opposed the high priest at nearly every turn.
The Pharisees themselves became a major movement within Judaism in the centuries just prior to Jesus. They regarded their role as an effort to make the Law a possession of all the people not just the priesthood and the ruling elite. To this end they established synagogues in the cities, towns and villages. That is to say, they invented the 'community church' and most Christian churches today follow the same order of service established by the Pharisees --- several scripture readings interspersed with prayer and hymns and of course a sermon usually based on one of the readings. They also established schools attached to the synagogues to encourage literacy even amongst the common people. At the time of Jesus they as a group were certainly were not the hypocrites that the gospels portray them as. It is also very probably true that there were individual Pharisees who were over-zealous hypocrites.
In addition, they were able to successfully introduce legal measures to mitigate the harsher aspects of Torah law. This had the effect of virtually eliminating legal executions by stoning for offences like blasphemy, adultery, rebellious youths and the like. In those few executions that did take place, they ensured that the victim was rendered dead or unconscious by the first stone.
Scripture portrays a degree of hostility between the Pharisees and Jesus and his followers. It is doubtful that this was the actual case at the time of Jesus. I suspect that the majority of Pharisees would have been both curious about and friendly toward Jesus. In Acts 5:33-42 Luke portrays Peter and the apostles arrested and taken for trial before the Sanhedrin. Note that earlier in this same chapter it was the Sadducees not the Pharisees who were demanding that the apostles be imprisoned. It was Rabbi Gamaliel, a Pharisee, who successfully defended them before the Sanhedrin. Rabbi Gamaliel was a student of Rabbi Hillel mentioned earlier. Scripture even notes that Saul/Paul studied under Gamaliel.
About forty years following the execution of Jesus, the Romans destroyed Jerusalem and the temple and with it they also destroyed the high priesthood. In the years following, the leadership of Judaism did devolve upon the Pharisees and we see rabbinic Judaism becoming dominant. Like all peoples threatened with cultural extinction, Judaism turned inward --- they circled the wagons and became very suspicious of any threat both internal and external. This is a fundamentalist knee jerk reaction --- we see something similar going on in the Islamic world today and also in the Christian right in certain parts of the USA.
This was the climate in which the gospels were written. By this time it was becoming increasingly apparent that the early Christian church was losing the battle for the heart and soul of Judaism to the Pharisee rabbis and there was a good deal of bitterness on the part of both parties. This explains the animosity toward the Pharisees. Let us then temper our attitudes and ‘Pharisee rhetoric’ because we now realize, for the most part, that they have been portrayed quite unfairly in the gospels.
You would expect us to take your speculation as the pure truth and the Gospels as propaganda then?
If we hold that Adam and Eve started out in ancient Mesopotamia and then humanity spread out from there... how did Native Americans and other people in the "western" continent get all the way over there? I mean, it was hard enough for people after "ancient times" get a boat over there without dying on the way. How did they even get there???
Unless we can accept the Pangea theory that all the continents were one big continent and that continental drift is a real thing (which I don't think would contradict Creationism at all).
But I'm just curious as to how they got there...
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