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How can we all be saved if we are all sinners
- Thread starter EAGonzalez
- Start date
Everyone in the world are sinners only. There is no doubt in this statement. And there is no chance of becoming like Jesus.
In early days people used to sacrifice the animals for God as a sign of forgiving(overcome from sin). Jesus came to earth and sacrifice himself on behalf to overcome our sin.
My suggestion is whenever you feel that you are going to fall in a sin, that time think of Jesus and the blood which comes out for us. Surely no one will commit any sin on seeing this blood.
In early days people used to sacrifice the animals for God as a sign of forgiving(overcome from sin). Jesus came to earth and sacrifice himself on behalf to overcome our sin.
My suggestion is whenever you feel that you are going to fall in a sin, that time think of Jesus and the blood which comes out for us. Surely no one will commit any sin on seeing this blood.
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Peripatetic
Restless mind, peaceful soul.
There's a difference between being a sinner and living a life of sin. It's all about your system of values. As you said, everyone is a sinner, but if you are living by the values of the spirit (love, humility, patience, generosity, peace, trust, etc.) while growing a relationship with God, you are on the path that that He wants for you. If you live according to the values of the world (greed, pride, anxiety, self-sufficiency, and skepticism) and don't pursue a relationship with God... well... He still wants a relationship with you, but you are putting up the barriers to prevent it.
And by the way... living by these values is "the fruit of the Spirit", it isn't your own righteousness that is earning points with God. If you spend time reading the Bible, ask God for guidance, and listen to the Holy Spirit, you will start to live in those values without even noticing it sometimes.
And by the way... living by these values is "the fruit of the Spirit", it isn't your own righteousness that is earning points with God. If you spend time reading the Bible, ask God for guidance, and listen to the Holy Spirit, you will start to live in those values without even noticing it sometimes.
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ephraimanesti
Senior Veteran
MY FRIEND,
No, it is not impossible not to sin. However, getting to that point requires a total and complete surrender to the indwelling Holy Spirit residing in our hearts, and that type of complete trust and surrender usually takes an extended period of time.
In the meantime, the way we sinners are saved is by repenting of our sins as quickly after we commit them as possible, with a firm intention of not repeating the sin we are struggling against, and trusting in God to forgive us.
By trusting in what Jesus has accomplished on our behalf, we know that we are forgiven sinners, spending our lives struggling towards sanctification at the end of the race in the power and with the guidance of the Holy Spirit.
ABBA'S fool,ephraim
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That sounds scriptural.
We are gradually transformed into His likeness.
The church builds up layers of assumptions and rules that can squish us into very tight corners. But if you read the Bible's list of regulations, it is not the whole Bible -- it is just part of the Torah, which contains overlap.
Jesus challenged religious legalism with, "but if you think it in your hearts..." which cut back on some, but added even more ways we can sin. That wasn't the purpose for Him implying our thoughts are as sinful as our actions.
When you get a chance, go back and look at the laws of Moses. Some laws may seem extreme, but others are very sensible. Then notice that there are not many rules that go beyond these. We just imagine there are.
God also asks us to do things out of love, make love our highest aim, lay down our lives for others, go the second mile, do to others as we would have them do to us, serve the lord with all our hearts/minds/soul/strength.
These are the sensibilities that represent the heart of the law. If we are always thoughtful of others and God, then we live in harmony with others. One person builds up another, and they are all supported and protected from harm.
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Yep, we're all sinners. But...we aren't saved because of ourselves. We're covered by Christ's righteousness because of his death on the cross for the forgiveness of all of our sins. That's the gist of it.
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sbbqb7n16
Veteran - Blue Bible Dude
The Apostle Paul wrote about this very subject in Romans chapter 5. I've copied it here for your convenience, and emphasized in blue the points I feel address the question you've asked.
In short: we are saved by His mercy, not our own merit
Romans 5
"Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom also we have obtained our introduction by faith into this grace in which we stand; and we exult in hope of the glory of God. And not only this, but we also exult in our tribulations, knowing that tribulation brings about perseverance; and perseverance, proven character; and proven character, hope; and hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out within our hearts through the Holy Spirit who was given to us. For while we were still helpless, at the right time Christ died for the ungodly. For one will hardly die for a righteous man; though perhaps for the good man someone would dare even to die. But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him. For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. And not only this, but we also exult in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation. Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned-- for until the Law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam until Moses, even over those who had not sinned in the likeness of the offense of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come.
But the free gift is not like the transgression. For if by the transgression of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many. The gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned; for on the one hand the judgment arose from one transgression resulting in condemnation, but on the other hand the free gift arose from many transgressions resulting in justification. For if by the transgression of the one, death reigned through the one, much more those who receive the abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ. So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to all men. For as through the one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One the many will be made righteous. The Law came in so that the transgression would increase; but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more, so that, as sin reigned in death, even so grace would reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
In short: we are saved by His mercy, not our own merit
Romans 5
"Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom also we have obtained our introduction by faith into this grace in which we stand; and we exult in hope of the glory of God. And not only this, but we also exult in our tribulations, knowing that tribulation brings about perseverance; and perseverance, proven character; and proven character, hope; and hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out within our hearts through the Holy Spirit who was given to us. For while we were still helpless, at the right time Christ died for the ungodly. For one will hardly die for a righteous man; though perhaps for the good man someone would dare even to die. But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him. For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. And not only this, but we also exult in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation. Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned-- for until the Law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam until Moses, even over those who had not sinned in the likeness of the offense of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come.
But the free gift is not like the transgression. For if by the transgression of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many. The gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned; for on the one hand the judgment arose from one transgression resulting in condemnation, but on the other hand the free gift arose from many transgressions resulting in justification. For if by the transgression of the one, death reigned through the one, much more those who receive the abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ. So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to all men. For as through the one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One the many will be made righteous. The Law came in so that the transgression would increase; but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more, so that, as sin reigned in death, even so grace would reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
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heymikey80
Quidquid Latine dictum sit, altum viditur
We are given favor by God. That word translated "grace" in Scripture is "favor".
It depends on what you mean by possibility.
It's impossible for someone who intentionally sins, not to sin. Intent is from the heart.
It's also impossible in this life to avoid our hearts' corruption. We can engage in cleansing our hearts. But a clean heart can only come from Christ, and is only in Christ.
Christ's heart is without corruption. Not only is it possible, but it is actual for Christ to not sin.
In our present condition we will continue to sin -- we continue to sin until our glorification, when our sinful corrupt hearts will have died away and we shall continue on, resurrected, with a new heart without corruption.
'Til then, "If we say we have no sin, we're just lying to ourselves and inside -- no truth." 1 Jn 1:8 There is such a thing as walking with Christ and yet carrying with that walk, our current nature of corruption.
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childofGod31
Regular Member
God CREDITS righteousness to us, to our account. IF we come to Him, walk with Him, fellowship with Him, seek Him first and daily.
It so happens that we start to sin less if we do all those things. But it's a matter of growth.
But nevertheless, it's our faithfullness and our love that God counts. He knows that we can't be sinless. So He sent Jesus to die to PAY for our sins. Therefore, He does not count sins against us. All our sins have been forgiven to us and forgotten by God (in a manner of speaking). He does not see our sins anymore.
(There is an exception of course. If you are not walking with God, if you are not trying to do God's will and not seeking God, then you are exposed, your sins are not covered by Jesus' sacrifice.)
It so happens that we start to sin less if we do all those things. But it's a matter of growth.
But nevertheless, it's our faithfullness and our love that God counts. He knows that we can't be sinless. So He sent Jesus to die to PAY for our sins. Therefore, He does not count sins against us. All our sins have been forgiven to us and forgotten by God (in a manner of speaking). He does not see our sins anymore.
(There is an exception of course. If you are not walking with God, if you are not trying to do God's will and not seeking God, then you are exposed, your sins are not covered by Jesus' sacrifice.)
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ChildOfGod97
Regular Member
Christians are saved through the Spirit of Jesus. In the Spirit of Jesus we are free from bondage to the Law of sin and death.
This was proven at His resurrection.
'If anyone claims they have not sinned, they are a liar', as John said. Which means, everyone is in need of this salvation to escape the death proscribed upon them for their sin.
Death is sin full grown.
After one is saved, 'we do not go on sinning'. That is a process. The Spirit of Christ leads us away from sin.
As Paul spoke of himself in that regard - a very spiritually advanced elder Christian - 'I do not yet consider myself perfect' though he said 'I do not pay attention to other's judgment of me, nor even judge myself'.
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Jesus rescues us because we can't rescue ourselves. Christianity is not a 'self help' religion (although some try to turn it into that) but accepting that God's gift through Jesus was adequate enough to really address our inability - "while we were helpless..' says Scripture.
John
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John
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childofGod31
Regular Member
Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness.
The word "believed" means Abraham loved God, obeyed God, trusted God, put God above all in his life.
When we do that, then God ALSO credits us righteousness.
He knows that we cannot overcome sin in the flesh. So when we "walk with God", He says: ok, even though you are still sinful by your behavior, I DECLARE that you are righteouss in my eyes because of the blood of Jesus. Jesus PAID your penalty. Therefore, you are free. You don't have to go to jail (be condemned) because Jesus sat in jail on your behalf. Even though you WERE quiltly, all your sins (past, present and future) have been forgiven because Jesus took the penalty on Himself.
An example could be this:
Here is this old man who is very very rich, but lonely. And you owe a huge debt to this Guy. (let's say 500,000)
And you could never pay him back because let's say you barely have enough money to make ends meet each month.
So this person, being generous and being rich, can afford to forgive you this debt. So let's say he comes to you and says: "I'll make a deal with you. Since I am so lonely, why don't you stop by my house a few times a week and just talk to me. And in return for that, I'll forgive you your debt. (Because for this person, fellowship was far more valuable then mere 500,000).
So, God, also desiring our fellowship, says to us: just come to Me daily, spend time with Me and I promise I'll forgive you your debt. I promise I won't count your sins against you. I promise I'll turn a blind eye towards your sins and your mistakes.
But to put this in the correct perspective, here is another example:
if you have a child and a child is learning to walk, and keeps falling, you don't mind. You expect the child to keep falling until they learn to walk.
But let's say your child is not learning at all. Then you would think that there is something wrong with your child. So it's not falling that would trouble you, but it's not learning to walk that would be a problem.
When we "learn to walk with God", when we come to spend time with Him and fellowship with Him, our sins are taken care of.
But when we just sit there, live our lives, ignore God, ignore learning to walk - well, then there is something wrong with us. Perhaps we were never born again in the first place.
I hope you have seen my point...?
James said in James 3:2 "we all stumble in many ways." If anyone is never at fault in what he says, he is a perfect man, able to keep his whole body in check"
There are no perfect people.
And John said:
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
But there is a God who forgives and declares us holy in spite of our behavior.
But only if we live IN HIM. Only if we "walk with Him", "have fellowship with Him"
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For me, it helps if I associate it with something I already understand.
ie
If my adopted son does something wrong, I correct him. If he knowingly chooses to do wrong, I discipline him. But I would never tell him that he is not eligible to be my son and must leave my house. No matter what, he will always be my son.
God loves us more than we love our own children. He adopted us by allowing his true Son to give his life.
It's like we are criminals (we are all sinners) sentenced to the death penalty, but allowed to walk away from the electric chair because our brother (Jesus), who is innocent, takes our place. (we are all saved)
The saddest thing I know is the thought that Jesus has already been executed; yet, his love is rejected, and his gifts thrown back in his face. Such precious gifts; a new name, a new life, a new family, and a clean slate!
ie
If my adopted son does something wrong, I correct him. If he knowingly chooses to do wrong, I discipline him. But I would never tell him that he is not eligible to be my son and must leave my house. No matter what, he will always be my son.
God loves us more than we love our own children. He adopted us by allowing his true Son to give his life.
It's like we are criminals (we are all sinners) sentenced to the death penalty, but allowed to walk away from the electric chair because our brother (Jesus), who is innocent, takes our place. (we are all saved)
The saddest thing I know is the thought that Jesus has already been executed; yet, his love is rejected, and his gifts thrown back in his face. Such precious gifts; a new name, a new life, a new family, and a clean slate!
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yeshuaslavejeff
simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
just read 1st john through Revelation.
then decide if you(plural singular/ readers around the world) prefer to die in sin, or to be redeemed. (if Yhvh grants the choice)
According to Revelation (read last, after the other shorter parts of the Bible) most people of the world choose willingly and willfully to die in sin.
perhaps, there is enough time left for the lost, or some of the lost, to be redeemed. perhaps not. Yhvh knows.
then decide if you(plural singular/ readers around the world) prefer to die in sin, or to be redeemed. (if Yhvh grants the choice)
According to Revelation (read last, after the other shorter parts of the Bible) most people of the world choose willingly and willfully to die in sin.
perhaps, there is enough time left for the lost, or some of the lost, to be redeemed. perhaps not. Yhvh knows.
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One is saved from the malady of sin in all mankind by receiving God's "...so great salvation" in His beloved Son ---the only sacrifice for our sin nature. When one receives the Savior --the Lord Jesus, the Christ of God, into one's heart and trusting Him, that one will be "born again" and sealed by the indwelling Holy Spirit (the gift of God). Following the teachings of God will not bring salvation of the soul, but it should lead a serious seeker to the Savior (note John 14).
Because we true believers continue to have the old nature we will fail often and sin, but it no longer should have dominion over one who has the new birth. The believer can follow 1 Jn. 1:8-10 for daily sins, then go on happily in fellowship with our Savior --our best Friend and Lord now and for eternity. One should read their Bible daily to learn more of these things.
Because we true believers continue to have the old nature we will fail often and sin, but it no longer should have dominion over one who has the new birth. The believer can follow 1 Jn. 1:8-10 for daily sins, then go on happily in fellowship with our Savior --our best Friend and Lord now and for eternity. One should read their Bible daily to learn more of these things.
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Dear EAGonzalez. We are all sinners and God wants us to return to Him. There is a way, and Jesus tells us in Matthew 22: 35-40: how it can be done.
The first and great Commandment is: " Love God with all our hearts, with all our souls, and with all our minds. The second is like it: Love our neighbour as we love ourselves." Jesus also tells us: On these two Commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets" God is Love, and God wants our love in all we say or do, in all we advice and stand for. Here is one way we can go:
"ask and you shall receive," ( Mathew 7: 7-10) we can ask God for Love and Joy, then we thank God and share all Love and Joy with our neighbour. We keep asking God and thanking God, then we share all Love and Joy with all we know and all we meet, friends and not friends. God will see our loving efforts,
and God will approve and bless us.
The Bible tells us to "Repent and be Born Again," give up our selfish wishes and wants, and learn love and care in all we stand for. The Holy Spirit will help and guide us, and Jesus our Saviour will lead us all the way: JESUS IS THE WAY.
We may stumble and forget at times, but then we ask God to forgive us, and carry on loving and caring. Love is a Christian`s strong weapon, with love we
can overcome all anger and wrong behaviour.
Yes, we are all sinners, and God wants loving sons and daughters. God wants
our love freely given and NO tags attached, ALSO God does NOT force us, we have God`s Commandments and we know where we can turn to for help.
We also have years to get better and better, and Love is very catching.
We also will find that people will treat us the same way as we treat people.
Unless we sincerely try to become as God wants us to become, we will never know how VERY POSSIBLE IT IS TO FOLLOW GOD`S COMMANDMANTS TO LOVE GOD AND LOVE OUR NEIGHBOUR. I say this with love, EAGonzalez.
Greetings from Emmy, your sister in Christ.
The first and great Commandment is: " Love God with all our hearts, with all our souls, and with all our minds. The second is like it: Love our neighbour as we love ourselves." Jesus also tells us: On these two Commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets" God is Love, and God wants our love in all we say or do, in all we advice and stand for. Here is one way we can go:
"ask and you shall receive," ( Mathew 7: 7-10) we can ask God for Love and Joy, then we thank God and share all Love and Joy with our neighbour. We keep asking God and thanking God, then we share all Love and Joy with all we know and all we meet, friends and not friends. God will see our loving efforts,
and God will approve and bless us.
The Bible tells us to "Repent and be Born Again," give up our selfish wishes and wants, and learn love and care in all we stand for. The Holy Spirit will help and guide us, and Jesus our Saviour will lead us all the way: JESUS IS THE WAY.
We may stumble and forget at times, but then we ask God to forgive us, and carry on loving and caring. Love is a Christian`s strong weapon, with love we
can overcome all anger and wrong behaviour.
Yes, we are all sinners, and God wants loving sons and daughters. God wants
our love freely given and NO tags attached, ALSO God does NOT force us, we have God`s Commandments and we know where we can turn to for help.
We also have years to get better and better, and Love is very catching.
We also will find that people will treat us the same way as we treat people.
Unless we sincerely try to become as God wants us to become, we will never know how VERY POSSIBLE IT IS TO FOLLOW GOD`S COMMANDMANTS TO LOVE GOD AND LOVE OUR NEIGHBOUR. I say this with love, EAGonzalez.
Greetings from Emmy, your sister in Christ.
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