How can Jesus have born future sins?

[zoidar]

What would be your conclusion, if you had to make your call based on this verse?

Act 4:26 The kings of the earth stood up, and the rulers were gathered together against the Lord, and against his Christ.
Act 4:27 For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together,
Act 4:28 For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done.

I think in this case the crucfixion was determined, not the hands that would nail Jesus to the cross. Even if God determined these people for this purpose, I don't see how it answers the OP.

 

[martymonster]

I think in this case the crucfixion was determined, not the hands that would nail Jesus to the cross. Even if God determined these people for this purpose, I don't see how it answers the OP.

Well, it means that those who were involved in killing Christ, were predetermined to do so.

 

[RickReads]

Romans 5

I don't see how this explains it. So feel free to expand on that.

What I get out of Romans 5 is this: By the sin of one, death came to all men therefore it is equitable, fair, and just that by the righteousness of one and His gift of righteousness that many are made alive. It satisfies God`s righteous judgment.

Jesus is the vine that gives life to all the branches. They all originate with Him by His gift of righteousness.

As a side note: This is why salvation can never be earned. We are unable to earn the righteousness that Jesus has and freely gives us.

Romans 3

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

All the branches originate with the vine.

Romans 8

28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

He AKA the Vine does it all.

 

[fhansen]

I think in this case the crucfixion was determined, not the hands that would nail Jesus to the cross. Even if God determined these people for this purpose, I don't see how it answers the OP.

His sacrifice covers all the sins of humanity, forever. That doesn’t mean we don’t need to repent of those sins, whether committed before or after we first come to Him.

 

[Butterball1]

I was out walking today, thinking about the sacrifice of Christ. Then this question arose, how Jesus could have born all sins that hadn't even been comitted yet. How do you reason around this?

Christ forgives sins conditionally. When the sinners obeys the gospel by being water baptized, all the sins he has committed up till that time are forgiven, washed away by the blood of Christ (Acts of the Apostles 2:38). Therefore water baptism is the initial point sins are forgiven and from this point forward he must continue to walk in the light to conditionally have all future sins forgiven, (1 John 1:7) with walking in the light including repenting, confessing of sins, Luke 13:3; 1 John 1:9.
Case in point, Simon in Acts 8 had been baptized (Acts of the Apostles 8:13) whereby all the sins he had committed up till that time were forgiven, remitted by the blood of Christ. Yet in the future Simon commited a sin by trying to buy the power of the Holy Ghost with money (Acts of the Apostles 8:18-20). Yet this sin of Simon was not unconditinally forgiven. Because of this sin he became lost (perishing - v20) unless/until he repented (Acts of the Apostles 8:22).

 

[fhansen]

Can you clarify what that means? Jesus only had to die once. It`s not something that is "occurring"

It’s ever-occurring. That’s why historically the Eucharist or Lords Supper is considered to be a re-presentation of the sacrifice on Calvary, where the effects are continuously experienced, applied, and benefitted from.

 

[RickReads]

It’s ever-occurring. That’s why historically the Eucharist or Lords Supper is considered to be a re-presentation of the sacrifice on Calvary, where the effects are continuously experienced, applied, and benefitted from.

Yeah, I thought that`s where he was going with that.

 

[Clare73]

Agreed. It`s your use of the word "occurring" in connection to the cross.
The crucifixion happened one time. It occurred, it is not occurring. Maybe I`m splitting hairs, I wasn`t sure how you were looking at it.

Christ was sacrificed once for all. (Hebrews 7:27)

No "occurring" on earth or in heaven. . .important.

 

[Clare73]

It’s ever-occurring. That’s why historically the Eucharist or Lords Supper is considered to be a re-presentation of the sacrifice on Calvary, where the effects are continuously experienced, applied, and benefitted from.

Not according to the word of God written.

Christ was sacrificed once for all (Hebrews 7:27).

It is not continual, either on earth or in heaven.
It's all been bought and paid for.
The money is in the bank.

 

[RickReads]

Christ was sacrificed once for all. (Hebrews 7:27)

No "occurring" on earth or in heaven. . .important.

Agreed, but for those who believe in the Eucharist, it would be occurring.
Out of respect for others on this site, I`ll leave this one alone.

 

[fhansen]

Not according to the word of God written.

Christ was sacrificed once for all (Hebrews 7:27).

It is not continual, either on earth or in heaven.
It's all been bought and paid for.
The money is in the bank.

The sacrifice was once for all of course-no other sacrifice will ever be necessary. And that's the point, we don't experience a new sacrifice with the Eucharist, but the same one. It's moment and its effects on us are now, not just back then. It's the sacramental means of experiencing the eternal nature of the sacrifice and its redemptive consequences for us-and knowing that it-that He-is real and present and able to be freely partaken of in the here and now.

1362 The Eucharist is the memorial of Christ's Passover, the making present and the sacramental offering of his unique sacrifice, in the liturgy of the Church which is his Body. In all the Eucharistic Prayers we find after the words of institution a prayer called the anamnesis or memorial.

1364 In the New Testament, the memorial takes on new meaning. When the Church celebrates the Eucharist, she commemorates Christ's Passover, and it is made present; the sacrifice Christ offered once for all on the cross remains ever present. "As often as the sacrifice of the Cross by which 'Christ our Pasch has been sacrificed' is celebrated on the altar, the work of our redemption is carried out."

1365 Because it is the memorial of Christ's Passover, the Eucharist is also a sacrifice. The sacrificial character of the Eucharist is manifested in the very words of institution: "This is my body which is given for you" and "This cup which is poured out for you is the New Covenant in my blood." In the Eucharist Christ gives us the very body which he gave up for us on the cross, the very blood which he "poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins."

 

[pescador]

It’s ever-occurring. That’s why historically the Eucharist or Lords Supper is considered to be a re-presentation of the sacrifice on Calvary, where the effects are continuously experienced, applied, and benefitted from.

While the effects are continuously experienced by some people (in theory), Jesus died only once.

 

[fhansen]

While the effects are continuously experienced by some people (in theory), Jesus died only once.

No doubt- which is why it's considered a re-presentation of the one same sacrifice, not a new one.

 

[BobRyan]

I was out walking today, thinking about the sacrifice of Christ. Then this question arose, how Jesus could have born all sins that hadn't even been comitted yet. How do you reason around this?

God can see the future better than we can see the past.

He says to Abraham "A father of many nations HAVE I made you"

 

[pescador]

I was out walking today, thinking about the sacrifice of Christ. Then this question arose, how Jesus could have born all sins that hadn't even been comitted yet. How do you reason around this?

Because He is God, whose existence is outside of time. Sin is in the world, has been since the Garden of Eden, and will continue until this present world disappears. Sin is disobedience to God's will; time is not a factor.

BTW, I walk daily, or as often as is possible, and it is my private time for prayer, reflection on Scripture, and rejoicing in God's creation. Romans 1:20, "For since the creation of the world his invisible attributes—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, because they are understood through what has been made."

 

[eleos1954]

I was out walking today, thinking about the sacrifice of Christ. Then this question arose, how Jesus could have born all sins that hadn't even been comitted yet. How do you reason around this?

He is High Priest over all and through His sacrifice is in the position to forgive all sin, past present and future. We do need to ask for forgiveness and when one does we are covered by His shed blood.

Final judgement for all humans (past, present & future) will not be completed fully until Jesus returns.

Revelation 22:12
Berean Study Bible
“Behold, I am coming soon, and My reward is with Me, to give to each one according to what he has done.

 

[Clare73]

The sacrifice was once for all of course-no other sacrifice will ever be necessary. And that's the point, we don't experience a new sacrifice with the Eucharist, but the same one. It's moment and its effects on us are now, not just back then. It's the sacramental means of experiencing the eternal nature of the sacrifice and its redemptive consequences for us-and
knowing that it-that He-is real and present and able to be freely partaken of in the here and now.

I think that Bibilically, "This is my body, This is my blood" is about the sacrificial system rather than about a "real presence."

In the OT, the sinner participated, with the priest who offered it, in a sacrficial meal on the actual flesh of the sacrifice, wherein he
received within himself the benefits of that sacrifice--pardon of sin, peace, reconcilation and fellowship with God.

I think Jesus was saying that bread and wine would be the NT sacrificial meal on the actual flesh and blood of his sacrifice, wherein
we would partake/participate (1 Corinthians 10:16) in its benefits--pardon of sin, fellowship with God in a transforming
process as his sons, access to the throne of grace, promises of the New Covenant, etc.

Partaking of the actual sacrifice itself is much more in keeping with the Bibical presentation of, and practice regarding, sacrifice
than is "real presence."

 

[Sabertooth]

Can God punish me now for something I will do in the future, that wouldn't be right.

It is only the future to you.
Being born into sin, we are deserving of punishment at conception, but God forestalls said judgment in an effort to restore as many as possible (among other unknown considerations).
Prior to personal Salvation, there is never a time when we do not deserve judgment.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Christ was sacrificed once for all. (Hebrews 7:27)

No "occurring" on earth or in heaven. . .important.

Once for all means once for all who have ever lived or will live.

This means that for them, in every moment of time, the Cross is continually working, effecting, covering, redeeming...

It is a timeless event as it's benefactors totally span time.

 

[Carl Emerson]

That is why there is a strong tradition of 'coming to the Cross' in faith to appropriate what was and is happening for you.