Homosexuality

[pgp_protector]

beacuse people can make money from other sins so they arnt realy sins.

Some times I feel this is one of the reasons

That or it's because the thought that I'm not bothered with this sin, so I'll attack it, cus I'm sin free in this area.

 

[Gusoceros]

Well I've heard that some women tend to call men dogs

I recommend avoiding such women ;-)

 

[angelmom01]

Are you suggesting that we should take our natural cues from animals?

No, I'm just replying to the comment that men are not animals and God doesn't look on them as animals.

Christ himself called the Gentiles DOGS.

angelmom

 

[EnemyPartyII]

Perhaps you could write your own Bible- call it the EnemyParty Version of Biblical relevance.

And red herrings add precisely what to this discussion?

I don't presume to think myself worthy or capable of writing Scripture.

I merely don't see that Paul considered himself as any better than me.

At the end of the day- you need to decide if you will accept God's Word, or if you will cherry pick it to fit your lifestyle.

I totally accept God's word. Its Paul's words I have some issues with.

Perhaps you have a much different understanding of biology than you have- I still seem to think, that in order to procreate, you need opposite sexes. Isnt that the way you understand it?

Of course you need male and female germ cells to procreate.

However...

a. There is nothing to say that jhomosexual couple's can't adopt, use surrogates, be involved in IVF, or have children from previous heterosexual relationships

b. Since you yourself agree that infertile couples can experience the full range of emotional and spiritual joining that is implicit in marriage, I'm still waiting for a basic explanation of why this should be denied homosexual couples.

Put it this way, what is the difference between an infertile, or childless by choice heterosexual couple, and a homosexual couple?

 

[Gusoceros]

No, I'm just replying to the comment that men are not animals and God doesn't look on them as animals.

Christ himself called the Gentiles DOGS.

angelmom

What do you think they meant by this?

 

[EnemyPartyII]

Well I've heard that some women tend to call men dogs

the opposite seems far more common actually

 

[Gusoceros]

And red herrings add precisely what to this discussion?

I don't presume to think myself worthy or capable of writing Scripture.

To the contrary- you have declared yourself capable if identifying which parts of Scripture should be followed- and which ones shouldnt be.

I merely don't see that Paul considered himself as any better than me.

Irrelevant. They arent Paul's words, but God's.

I totally accept God's word. Its Paul's words I have some issues with.

Except- that the Bible, is God's Word, not Paul's.

Of course you need male and female germ cells to procreate.

However...

a. There is nothing to say that jhomosexual couple's can't adopt, use surrogates, be involved in IVF, or have children from previous heterosexual relationships

b. Since you yourself agree that infertile couples can experience the full range of emotional and spiritual joining that is implicit in marriage, I'm still waiting for a basic explanation of why this should be denied homosexual couples.

Put it this way, what is the difference between an infertile, or childless by choice heterosexual couple, and a homosexual couple?

Im glad, that we agree there is a HUGE fundamental difference between same sex couples, and married couples. That we agree that there is a design difference, that affects society between the 2 couple types.

G

 

[davedjy]

Homosexuality isnt "bad" because they cant procreate- that is how same sex couples are different. The homosexual act is bad, because it is a sin.

Oh really? show me one Bible verse of a Lesbian relationship condemned or what act do you speak of that lesbians do that is condemned?

 

[Nadiine]

So God never lumps man and beast together?

And man is not a "beast"?

Isn't the number of the beast the number of a MAN?

Christ referred to the Gentiles a "dogs". We are told not to cast our pearls before "swine". And in Job man is refered to as a "worm".

Man has no preeminence over a beast. :o

Ecc 3:18 I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts.

angelmom

Hmmm, so I guess this makes GOD A BIRD - since it says He has WINGS? & is a HEN becuz in Mat. 23 He said He wanted to gather His people to himself like a mother hen gathers her chicks.

So God's a hen, and I'm a beast. I'm glad that's settled!

 

[pgp_protector]

the opposite seems far more common actually

Well It's not dog but (nhaa I won't push the censors )

 

[davedjy]

Hmmm, so I guess this makes GOD A BIRD - since it says He has WINGS? & is a HEN becuz in Mat. 23 He said He wanted to gather His people to himself like a mother hen gathers her chicks.

So God's a hen, and I'm a beast. I'm glad that's settled!

YOU brought up the point about hens, no one else did that. God isn't a created thing, anyways...we like the other species are a created thing.

Nadine, you are a funny lady.

 

[Gusoceros]

Oh really? show me one Bible verse of a Lesbian relationship condemned or what act do you speak of that lesbians do that is condemned?

'For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another...' (Romans 1:26-27).

 

[EnemyPartyII]

Irrelevant. They arent Paul's words, but God's.

How do you figure, based purely on where they are published???

Except- that the Bible, is God's Word, not Paul's.

Says who? Paul maybe? Does the idea of "unlocking the box with the key inside it" mean anything to you?

Im glad, that we agree there is a HUGE fundamental difference between same sex couples, and married couples.

What post did you read? No, there is no difference between same sex and married couples. Unless you can tell me what it is... I'll ask again, this time read, and then answer the question please...

"what is the difference between a heterosexual couple that chooses, or is incapable, of having children, and a homosexual couple?"

That we agree that there is a design difference, that affects society between the 2 couple types.

How can you possibly derive this from anything I have said?

 

[EnemyPartyII]

So God's a hen, and I'm a beast. I'm glad that's settled!

You don't think God exists within hens?

Obviously you are of the "Old man in beard and robes" school of theology

 

[Myriah]

No, I'm just replying to the comment that men are not animals and God doesn't look on them as animals.

Christ himself called the Gentiles DOGS.

angelmom

Christ couldn't right then when he said that. He still didn't want the apostles to know who he was at that point -- the Messiah, Savior of the whole world at that time when Jesus says that. He still needed to gain the apostles "trust" as one of them first. They first thought he was an earthly king, then later realized he was the Christ. Jesus came down to break down pride and prejudice.

"What good is it if you only love those who love you? Don't even the pagans and tax collectors do that? Be ye perfect therefore, as I am perfect". This is the finish of the "love thy neighbor as thyself" verse. Perfect love is breaking down and letting go of our pride and prejudices. The apostles later learned Jesus was the Christ... the Messiah of the whole world, but not right at first. Jesus was still called "rabbi" for a time....

 

[Gusoceros]

How do you figure, based purely on where they are published???Says who? Paul maybe? Does the idea of "unlocking the box with the key inside it" mean anything to you?

What post did you read? No, there is no difference between same sex and married couples. Unless you can tell me what it is... I'll ask again, this time read, and then answer the question please...

"what is the difference between a heterosexual couple that chooses, or is incapable, of having children, and a homosexual couple?"

How can you possibly derive this from anything I have said?

Let me get this right:

1) the Bible is not Scripture

2) Paul was not speaking God's Word

3) There is no difference at all, between same sex couples and married couples

Do I have your position summed up accurately?

 

[davedjy]

'For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another...' (Romans 1:26-27).

Burned in lust for one another...where does that describe lesbian acts being condemned, and what are the acts, specifically? and I already explained the other viewpoint, it's talking about Pagan Worship.

Where do Paul or any of the other Apostles talk about sexual orientation or innate attraction to same sex people that we know is true today?

Hmm....

 

[davedjy]

Let me get this right:

1) the Bible is not Scripture

2) Paul was not speaking God's Word

3) There is no difference at all, between same sex couples and married couples

Do I have your position summed up accurately?

Is this penned by God, too like all you people who believe it is "the actual Word of God"?

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46 NLT)

Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. (Ephesians 6:5 NLT)

How about this one?

(Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT)

If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.

 

[Gusoceros]

Burned in lust for one another...where does that describe lesbian acts being condemned, and what are the acts, specifically? and I already explained the other viewpoint, it's talking about Pagan Worship.

Where do Paul or any of the other Apostles talk about sexual orientation or innate attraction to same sex people that we know is true today?

Hmm....

'For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another...' (Romans 1:26-27).

The natural use of men and women, is of course- intercourse. They are discussing woman on woman relations in this scripture.

G

 

[EnemyPartyII]

Do I have your position summed up accurately?

No. You are being deliberately contrarian...

1) the Bible is not Scripture

The Bible, in its entirety, is written by man. Some of those wruitings, are the documentations of man's interaction with God, but some of it fails to logically link up with what we know about God.

Just because its "In the Bible" is NOT enough evidence that it is the word of God. You have to use your brain sometimes and think about the contextual back ground.

UI'll say it again, Jesus DIDN'T say "These are the books you shall consider the Bible"... the decision of what to invclude in the Bible was made rather arbitrarily, and for reasons political as much as spiritual, by early Christian bishops around the year 300 AD.

Just because Paul's writings are traditionally included in the book that says "Bible" on the cover, is not, in itself, reason enough to consider them the word of God. By your logic for defining what is "Scripture"... the name of the publishing company and editors and translators are ALSO Scripture, they're "in the Bible" after all

2) Paul was not speaking God's Word

I believe Paul was explaining what he sincerely thought to be God's message. Is that the same thing as speaking the inerrant word of God?

3) There is no difference at all, between same sex couples and married couples

None that I can think of. If you can think of any differences, please tell me