MORAL LAWS from the Torah continue to stand today. The other laws you quote there are from the civil & ceremonial laws of the Torah - there are 3 sections of the law/categories if you will.
Worship/religious/sacrificial, & civil laws (govt. civil society laws) & Moral.
Moral law was law before the OT Torah was written. Murder by Cain was SIN before the law came. So was all the sin of the people of Sodom & Gomorrah & in Noah's days before the flood (God judged them on their immorality).
So those STAND today. So when Paul "rants" against homosexuality, he's REITERATING THE MORAL LAWS of the OT that are still in effect.
As are the lists of other moral laws. But you don't see the Sacrifical laws *incl. Sabbath observance* or any of the CIVIL laws they followed that day (on farming, animal treatment, etc.).
The same word used to describe "abomination" was used for the dietary laws and even the best scholars will admit that it falls under the purity code in that chapter, which we do not follow.
Nadiine said:
He WAS speaking agaisnt homosexality. Romans 1:18-32 cannot be any clearer than it is in its direct definition & detail of a man with man & woman with woman "exchanging the NATURAL function" & use.
and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.
24Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another.
In conjunction w/pagan worship/idolatry which is the reason God gave them up.
Since homosexuals didn't retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind.
Since the Gentiles were idolatrous God gave them over to a debased mind of homosexuality. However, I believe that Paul was saying the following:
"Since the Gentiles did not retain God in their knowledge God gave them over to a debased mind. The debased mind is NOT homosexuality but a mind that is centered on unrighteousness, hence the listing of what the Gentile mind is full of in verse 29.
29-32 This list of "unrighteousness" is being applied to all Gentiles, not Gentiles that commit homosexual sex acts. It is the Gentiles "who are worthy of death." These verses are really just an exposition of verse 18.
26-27 Another interesting point to consider is that people often use verses 26-27 to prove that Paul used an argument from "nature" to prove that homosexual activity was wrong. However that kind of usage of the word "nature" is highly unlikely as Paul usually uses the word "nature" or "natural" to mean not what "Mother Nature" does but instead he means "the previously accepted common usage". Nature is not a great teacher about ethics and humans are nowhere called in scripture to emulate it. What is more, homosexual activity DOES go on in the animal world.
JESUS Himself defined lawful marriage in God's eyes:
Mat 19:4-6 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read,
that he which made [them] at the beginning made them male and female,
And said,
For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to
his wife: and the two shall be one flesh?
Gen 2:23-24 And Adam said, This [is] now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh:
she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.
Therefore shall a
man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his
wife: and
they shall be one flesh.
Notice there's NO room given for man and man? Woman with woman? No HE and HE? No She and her?
JESUS defined lawful sexual unions, Paul merely reiterated the standard.
Always remember, HOMOSEXUALITY WAS NOT AN ISSUE OF THEIR DAY in Israel! Homosexuality was NOT a typical lifestyle and it wasn't hotly contested as it is today here.
Show me in the Bible where Jesus
condemned slavery? Everything has to be taken into account w/it's historial context. Where does Paul address the issues of gay marriage that we have today or in Revelation? Where did Jesus talk about homosexuality? Where does it say what marriage isn't? (man and man, woman and woman) Where did they condemn loving, monogamous same-sex relationships? They weren't recognized till the 19th century, so of course, the Bible doesn't talk about that...homosexuals are in a small minority of the population.
The upshot is, homosexuality IS SINFUL - it's unlawful union in the eyes of GOD because God made the prototype at the beginning of creation: male and female, (and HE SAYS) FOR that very reason, they are to become one union. Not 2 men, not 2 women.
That is the prototype, but lots of God's plans have been distorted with sin creating birth defects, and abnormalties. Where is God's prototype of one to be born w/both sex organs, and plan for someone to be born with one eye or handicapped in a wheelchair?
By the way, maybe you can show me in the Bible where all the many Gay examples of Christians & OT saints that were GAY who led the people??? If it was SO lawful & common, there will SURELY be many Godly gay examples
of elders, shepherds, priests, prophets & teachers in our bible that display God's pleasure with homosexuality.
I'll wait for your verse examples for us.
I'm still waiting for the verses of a same sex, loving monogamous relationship condemned by Jesus or any of the other Apostles. I am waiting for an example of homosexuality without:
a)pagan worship and orgies (Romans 1)
b) rape (Sodom and Gomorrah) Aphrodites was the prevailing god of the time, roleplaying w/natural being the USUAL use of them being straight. Paul also said it was shameful for a man to have long hair.
c)unbiased translations, 1 Corinthians is the weakest argument since the translation of "homosexual offender" is not what the word really means. It was said to be meant "masturbation" by the early church Fathers, and the best of scholars don't even know what it means. (arsenkoitas)
d) Where does Jesus talk about homosexuality? clearly it wasn't an issue back then, as it wasn't recognized till the 19th century
e) a solution to gay freedom besides "reparative therapy" which is condemend by EVERY SINGLE credible mental health foundation in America, which causes suicide and depression rates to increase hugely. Ask that same thing about alcoholism, and you will get another answer. It is clear. it is irreversible, and the testimonials are probably from people who are bisexual to begin with or are confused. "The vast majority of our participants will still 'struggle' with same sex attraction their whole lives". LOLOLOL! yeah, what a healing, and why? Don't even get me started on what I would like to do to these "repair groups".
f) Where does Paul talk about homosexual attraction and not just lust? There is a distinction.
g) Where does Paul talk about people being born gay, and that innate attraction that even Exodus International talks about?
h) Where does the Bible say what marriage "isn't"?
It doesn't say "man cannot join with man in marriage", they had no need for that as they didn't even know about loving relationships then.
Safely, loving, monogamous, homosexual acts are NOT condemned....hence the UCC churches and Gay Pentecostal Churches...
the only safe haven for Gay Christians. Like all other Conservative Christians, it's a pick and choose with which context we speak.
Again, it's all about historical context:
Titus 2:9
"Teach slaves to be subject to their masters in everything, to try to please them, not to talk back to them..."
1 Peter 2:18
"Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh."