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Homosexuality

davedjy

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The Father, Son and Holy Ghost, is and has been the only answer I have seen given. There is no other answer but the Lord, what would you think we would be saying?

I am sorry that so many are angry at people for speaking what they with all their hearts believe is the truth. Yet, I would want to be warned of anything that I was doing that was not what the Lord wanted. I guess not everyone feels that way, but I don't want anyones souled on my hands. The way I understand the Bible, I will be held accountable for those I don't speak the truth to, and so I..................

Anyhow, as I have said, everything has been gone over time and time again, on many threads. Can't think of anything else that should or can be said.

May we all seek and find the path the Lord has for us all.:wave:

Kathy, I think you are doing the right thing by preaching what you believe is the truth, just like Nadiine or anyone else that shares that viewpoint. I just don't believe that when you become born again your sexuality changes. All things are possible through Christ, but I don't see Him changing all who are gay or bi, even the ones that want to be changed. Now they are just supposed to be stuck? I don't believe that is what God would say, either.
 
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savedandhappy1

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Kathy, I think you are doing the right thing by preaching what you believe is the truth, just like Nadiine or anyone else that shares that viewpoint. I just don't believe that when you become born again your sexuality changes. All things are possible through Christ, but I don't see Him changing all who are gay or bi, even the ones that want to be changed. Now they are just supposed to be stuck? I don't believe that is what God would say, either.


No one is stuck with Christ, and if any of us are truely seeking the path that the Lord has for us, then yes He can and will change them.

Alot of the ones I have seen here don't want to change even if that is what the Lord wants. IMHO. So until that happens, wanting what the Lord wants, from any of us then I am back to are any of us really saved if we don't want what He wants and requires?
 
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SoldierKG

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Continuing on from the above great post.​

Jesus did speak about homosexuality when He said marriage is between a man and woman, and that the marriage bed is undefiled.​

That would include adultery, fornication, homosexuality, and all sexual sins. So denying what Jesus said and trying to say he only spoke of love would be incorrect.​

He told the story of Lazarus and the rich man, one going to heaven and one going to hell. We need to tell of His love and how He doesn't want anyone to perish, but we must not leave out what will happen if He is not accepted. If a person doesn't know what they need saved from then why would they see the need for a Saviour?​

One thing is true. This subject has been debate on alot of threads, and the same things have been pointed out. I haven't heard anyone who believes that homosexuality is a sin, saying anything except that because of their love for everyone, that they don't want them to perish. Somehow that has been continuely called hate, when all it is, is wanting what God wants. THAT NO ONE PERISH, BUT ALL COME TO CHRIST!!!​
See what you to are calling sin is the act. What I said in my origional post is that being a homosexual is NOT the sin, doing homosexual act is. Have you not read any of what I have posted this whole thread? No where in scripture is simply being a homosexual labeled as sin. A homosexual is one who has an attraction to a member of the same sex. END OF STORY. now back yourself up with scripture, or be silent.
 
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ScottBot

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Kathy, I think you are doing the right thing by preaching what you believe is the truth, just like Nadiine or anyone else that shares that viewpoint. I just don't believe that when you become born again your sexuality changes. All things are possible through Christ, but I don't see Him changing all who are gay or bi, even the ones that want to be changed. Now they are just supposed to be stuck? I don't believe that is what God would say, either.
There are alot of things that we are not supposed to be once we have DIED TO OURSELVES, and allow CHrist to live through us. By saying that you remain unrepentantly homosexually active, you imply that Christ has that tendency, which is sheer and utter blasphamy. If I were a kleptomaniac, would it be okay if I were to continue to steal if I accept Christ as my Lord and Savior? I may still have the URGE, but I am supposed to allow the compullsion to follow that urge to die.

YOu may not like the comparison of homosexual attraction to alcoholism, kleptomania, or other such thngs, but the effective comparison is valid. The path that leads to paradise is narrow, and those that find it are few. The road that leads to destruction is wide and the gates are open. You may want to conform Christianity to your worldview, but we are called to conform our worldview to Christ.
 
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davedjy

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No one is stuck with Christ, and if any of us are truely seeking the path that the Lord has for us, then yes He can and will change them.

Alot of the ones I have seen here don't want to change even if that is what the Lord wants. IMHO. So until that happens, wanting what the Lord wants, from any of us then I am back to are any of us really saved if we don't want what He wants and requires?
If one wants to draw that Conservative Mainstream viewpoint of it, then yes, definitely


There are alot of things that we are not supposed to be once we have DIED TO OURSELVES, and allow CHrist to live through us. By saying that you remain unrepentantly homosexually active, you imply that Christ has that tendency, which is sheer and utter blasphamy. If I were a kleptomaniac, would it be okay if I were to continue to steal if I accept Christ as my Lord and Savior? I may still have the URGE, but I am supposed to allow the compullsion to follow that urge to die.

YOu may not like the comparison of homosexual attraction to alcoholism, kleptomania, or other such thngs, but the effective comparison is valid. The path that leads to paradise is narrow, and those that find it are few. The road that leads to destruction is wide and the gates are open. You may want to conform Christianity to your worldview, but we are called to conform our worldview to Christ.
There is a misconception there. Going through a 12 Step program for an alcoholic IS recommended by all health foundations, but not reparative therapy for Gays and bisexual people. In fact, they have proved that it is abusive, and the suicide rate is higher among those who go through such programs.
These are all against it:
* American Psychiatric Association
* American Academy of Pediatrics
* American Medical Association
* American Counseling Association
* National Association of School Psychologists
* National Association of Social Workers
* Royal College of Nursing


While no comprehensive study has been yet carried out into the long-term consequences of conversion therapies, the Schroeder and Shidlo study outlined above found that the majority of respondents reported being left in a poor mental and emotional state after the therapy, and that rates of depression, anxiety, alcohol and drug abuse and suicidal feelings were roughly doubled in those who underwent reparative therapy. Of particular concern was the lack of support given by reparative therapists and counsellors to those who found their programme to be contributing to psychological distress (see the section on ethics, below)

 
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savedandhappy1

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See what you to are calling sin is the act. What I said in my origional post is that being a homosexual is NOT the sin, doing homosexual act is. Have you not read any of what I have posted this whole thread? No where in scripture is simply being a homosexual labeled as sin. A homosexual is one who has an attraction to a member of the same sex. END OF STORY. now back yourself up with scripture, or be silent.


You know what young man, if you call the way you speak to people Christlike then you are speaking of someone I don't know.​


I do hope you have and show respect for and to the Lord, because frankly if you think your smart mouth and disrespectful nonsense makes you all grown up well you are sadly mistaken.​


If my son would have spoke to me or any adult the way you have spoken to many here, he would still be grounded and would still be blowing soap bubbles out of his mouth, and he is 29 yrs. old.
Anyhow you aren't my son, but I will still lift you up to the Lord, because He is the only answer to your questions, and your life.:prayer:


Well the only answer you should listen to I guess I should say.​


And here is your scripture.​


Matt 7:6-8​

6Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.
7Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
8For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
 
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davedjy

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Scott_LaFrance said:
By saying that you remain unrepentantly homosexually active, you imply that Christ has that tendency, which is sheer and utter blasphamy.

After the fall in the Garden of Eden, a lot of things changed...is it "blasphemous" to call a hermaphrodite, blind, deaf or person with severe birth defects a creation of God? Were these people's problems His "original intent"?
 
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savedfromdistruction

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What Scripture, back yourself up. Show me scripture. If you can't than not only is your argument baseless, you have lied.


9Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders 10nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
 
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mysterychristian

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9Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders 10nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
It's actually "have an inheritance" in the kingdom of God. (You can't see it in the KJV but in the text its have an inheritance)

You build rewards in this life by walking in love, those who do what you stated above, are not walking in love so they surely will not have an inheritance in the kingdom of God.

Their is an inheritance (or rewards) 1. for walking in love and also 2. an inheritance just because you are a son of God, it's a sonship inheritance, the new spiritual body is a part of that sonship inheritance that you cannot lose.

Just like in the physical, a son inherits the genetics of his father and cannot lose them, it's the same with God and is sons, but that which we get from God is a spiritual seed, instead of a physical seed.

That seed is called incorruptible seed in Peter, it is also called holy spirit which is given to us from God, it's called power from on high, the comforter, the spirit of truth, Christ in you, many different names, each name intending to describe a characteristic of the spirit.


No matter what any one says the word is very clear that, you are "sealed with the holy spirit of promise" until the "redemption" (the complete freedom paid by a ransom) of the purchased possession. We are just living a partial freedom now because we are still in our physical bodies.

To be sealed with holy spirit is just another proof that you cannot lose eternal life, once you get it, but you do receive rewards or not receive rewards (inheritance) by your walk of love or lack of walking in love in this life.

The word sealed is a great word to study and understand biblically, as related to you being sealed. Nothing can get in and nothing can get out.

Redemption basically means a complete freeing paid by way of a ransom, Jesus Christ was the ransom, He paid the price for us, His life, and we have been delivered, rescued out from the power of darkness.

We are still in this flesh suit corrupting body, but citizens of heaven, blessed with all spiritual blessings, seated at the right hand of God with Christ, but in the future we will no longer be limited to this physical body.

We are a new creation NOW, a new spiritual race of men and women with Jesus Christ as the forerunner, the first born among men from the dead into a new spiritual body, and in the future at the redemption of the purchassed possesion, you and I, the Christians will have a body fashioned like unto His glorious body.

Either way this redemption, comes to it's fullness, when we are changed in a moment or twinkling of an eye, or when we are raised from the dead, then the fullness, the completness of the redemption comes into fruition.

Right Now in life, a Christian, born again believer with eternal life, has a token, an earnest of the spirit. A down payment so to speak of that which is coming, the greater. We have power now, but by no means to the fullness and capacity that we will have in the future.

Ephesians 1:12-14

12That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

[SIZE=-4]13[/SIZE]In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

[SIZE=-4]14[/SIZE]Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

You are truly loved of God.

If you need scripture to back all of this up, I will supply word for word, line by line, if needed, no problem at all and would be a blessing to do.
 
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mysterychristian

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Kathy, I think you are doing the right thing by preaching what you believe is the truth, just like Nadiine or anyone else that shares that viewpoint. I just don't believe that when you become born again your sexuality changes. All things are possible through Christ, but I don't see Him changing all who are gay or bi, even the ones that want to be changed. Now they are just supposed to be stuck? I don't believe that is what God would say, either.
Only the ones that want to change can change, the others will not if they don't want to, you have to desire change, because change comes from the inside out, it begins in the mind, the thoughts, the beliefs, the attitudes, and then is manifested in the lifestyle, so change is possible for those who want it but many do not, so they do not change, you definatly can be a christian with eternal life and and be a homosexual at the same time, it's not what God desires and the best for that individual, or for the example we are supposed to walk before others but neither are other things people do. It's an area people need to be healed in, and can be. The lifestyle is very destructive to the individual, alot of depression, suicide, guilt, ect... on and on stem from it

You are Loved of God
 
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savedandhappy1

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[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Ro 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: [/FONT]
dia; tou'to parevdwken aujtou;ß oJ qeo;ß eijß pavqh ajtimivaß: ai& te ga;r qhvleiai aujtw'n methvllaxan th;n fusikh;n crh'sin eijß th;n para; fuvsin, [FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Ro 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another *; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. [/FONT]
oJmoivwß te kai; oiJ a~rseneß ajfevnteß th;n fusikh;n crh'sin th'ß qhleivaß ejxekauvqhsan ejn th'/ ojrevxei aujtw'n eijß ajllhvlouß, a~rseneß ejn a~rsesin th;n ajschmosuvnhn katergazovmenoi kai; th;n ajntimisqivan hJ;n e~dei th'ß plavnhß aujtw'n ejn eJautoi'ß ajpolambavnonteß. http://bible.crosswalk.com/InterlinearBible/bible.cgi


Ok here is my question. I have been told that Paul didn't use the words normally used for homosexual in writing Romans 1, and so he was probably meaning male prostitutes or something different then is stated in the Bible. I have also been told that the word homosexual wasn't even a word back then so it couldn't mean what it does today.

Yet when we look at the scriptures above, he doesn't even mention the word homosexual. Looking at the Greek and English we see it say men to men. It says men leaving the nature use of woman, etc.

Am I suppose to believe that the Greek words for men to men was different back in NT times as compared to now? :confused:

If you follow the link you can click on the English word and it will give the Greek and the meanings for each word. Anyhow just some questions I have been thinking about and searching for understanding on.
 
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davedjy

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[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Ro 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: [/FONT]
dia; tou'to parevdwken aujtou;ß oJ qeo;ß eijß pavqh ajtimivaß: ai& te ga;r qhvleiai aujtw'n methvllaxan th;n fusikh;n crh'sin eijß th;n para; fuvsin, [FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Ro 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another *; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. [/FONT]
oJmoivwß te kai; oiJ a~rseneß ajfevnteß th;n fusikh;n crh'sin th'ß qhleivaß ejxekauvqhsan ejn th'/ ojrevxei aujtw'n eijß ajllhvlouß, a~rseneß ejn a~rsesin th;n ajschmosuvnhn katergazovmenoi kai; th;n ajntimisqivan hJ;n e~dei th'ß plavnhß aujtw'n ejn eJautoi'ß ajpolambavnonteß. http://bible.crosswalk.com/InterlinearBible/bible.cgi


Ok here is my question. I have been told that Paul didn't use the words normally used for homosexual in writing Romans 1, and so he was probably meaning male prostitutes or something different then is stated in the Bible. I have also been told that the word homosexual wasn't even a word back then so it couldn't mean what it does today.

Yet when we look at the scriptures above, he doesn't even mention the word homosexual. Looking at the Greek and English we see it say men to men. It says men leaving the nature use of woman, etc.

Am I suppose to believe that the Greek words for men to men was different back in NT times as compared to now? :confused:

If you follow the link you can click on the English word and it will give the Greek and the meanings for each word. Anyhow just some questions I have been thinking about and searching for understanding on.
How are you certain that verse isn't talking about naturally born straight men turning for the same sex? and yeah, the word for homosexual back then was "paisserrate" or something. I did a study in another post.
 
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ScottBot

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If one wants to draw that Conservative Mainstream viewpoint of it, then yes, definitely



There is a misconception there. Going through a 12 Step program for an alcoholic IS recommended by all health foundations, but not reparative therapy for Gays and bisexual people. In fact, they have proved that it is abusive, and the suicide rate is higher among those who go through such programs.
These are all against it:
* American Psychiatric Association
* American Academy of Pediatrics
* American Medical Association
* American Counseling Association
* National Association of School Psychologists
* National Association of Social Workers
* Royal College of Nursing

While no comprehensive study has been yet carried out into the long-term consequences of conversion therapies, the Schroeder and Shidlo study outlined above found that the majority of respondents reported being left in a poor mental and emotional state after the therapy, and that rates of depression, anxiety, alcohol and drug abuse and suicidal feelings were roughly doubled in those who underwent reparative therapy. Of particular concern was the lack of support given by reparative therapists and counsellors to those who found their programme to be contributing to psychological distress (see the section on ethics, below)

I am more prone to follow an organization that is rooted in objective truth. Since the APA has had 4 different versions of the DSM, I don't think they qualify. Plus, its seems that those who turn to chemical and self-abuse aren't really relying on Christ as their strength, are they?
 
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davedjy

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I am more prone to follow an organization that is rooted in objective truth. Since the APA has had 4 different versions of the DSM, I don't think they qualify. Plus, its seems that those who turn to chemical and self-abuse aren't really relying on Christ as their strength, are they?
Which organization do you know of that is rooted in "objective truth"? I don't see any of these mainstream organizations like that, at all. Yes, I agree, that one shouldn't turn to drugs or alcohol, but it does show the turning to depression, instead of such a positive treatment.
 
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ScottBot

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Correct you are saved according to this verse and obedience to this verse alone

Romans 10:9,10
If that's all we need, then we can reduce the bible to an index card. There's alot more to salvation than 2 sentences.
 
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davedjy

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The word "inherit" is a synonym for salvation. We inherit salvation by grace through faith. We do not inherit rewards, we earn them. Those who practice the things mentioned in 1 Corinthians are not saved according to the verse.
I guess you aren't saved either, because God sees sin as sin. All liars will be cast into the lake of fire as well. We ALL fall short!
There are no greater sins, that was just to point out certain ones to the Corinthians.
 
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ScottBot

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I guess you aren't saved either, because God sees sin as sin. All liars will be cast into the lake of fire as well. We ALL fall short!
There are no greater sins, that was just to point out certain ones to the Corinthians.
and the first epistle of John says that there are varying degrees of sin, some which do not compromise salvation, and some that do.

[bible]1 john 5:16-17[/bible]
 
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savedfromdistruction

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I guess you aren't saved either, because God sees sin as sin. All liars will be cast into the lake of fire as well. We ALL fall short!
There are no greater sins, that was just to point out certain ones to the Corinthians.

Anyone no matter the sin if they practice it are lost according to scripture. :)
 
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