Homosexuality - Here I stand.

[wayseer]

I think I see where you are coming from and the idea that ritual provided a means of separating cultures is valid. Today those ritual practices are declining as we become a more global village. Although, there are still parts of the world that claim separation.

However ...

Its an abombination for us to worship idols. Why don't we hear this preached today. Because noone would be being convicted and feel guilty because so few have idol set on alters in they home that they bow down before!

No, not set on our alters but those idols sit right there in the middle of the lounge - the TV set. TV provides the information that creates meaning for most. There is the idol of sport, the idol of the stock market, the idol of women's fashion, the idol of being right all the time ... you get the drift.

So much idolling is going on that it has become idolatry - the worship of other gods. But you might have noticed that all those idols have coming crashing down of late - the MacMarket. (I wonder if anyone ever noticed?)

Paul was concerned with all the idolatry going on in his churches that he wrote a few letters. What he was concerned about was that his followers were continuing to practice the rituals pertaining to Roman culture going on all around them - and Roman culture was pervasive as the TV scene - it sucked people in. I'm a bit of fan of Paul so much so that apart from the news and an odd program on the ABC I don't bother watching TV - it distracts me from God. Paul was worried about similar distractions and it was in that context that he mentions homosexuality - not the homosexuality we might understand today, but the practice of 'worshipping' the human body through sexual acts, be such acts with women or men. This was playing the Roman game - similar to the Western game of sitting at home and watching TV.

 

[Zeena]

God clearly states homosexuality is an abomination.
But so is lying.
I do not believe it will keep you out of heaven.
It is still wrong.
then again looking at woman with a lustful eye is to (How many of us guys do that?)
the fact is we literally know nothing about homosexuality except its an abomination and some people claim to be gay.thats all we know.
Nobody understands it.
It clearly states homosexuality is a sin.
.
Leviticus 18:22
You shall not lie with a male as you lie with woman it is an abomination.

How can you not understand that?
its very clear.
There is NO other way to perceive it.
Cultures change God's word does not.
(Thats were I stand)

Amen!

1 Corinthians 3:14-15
If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

 

[Zaac]

not hard to refute and the above gives good reason not to trust wikipedia, hereis an alternative, one which is more credible:

http://www.rense.com/general61/outof.htm





in fact some historians thnk aids was alive and wellduring the roman empire, have to check on that to see ifthe sources were credible or not.



wrong again, and has been addressed already. some people just do not give up even when they are so wrong.



wrong again but people still keep trying



people are getting desperate to legitimize something that GOD Himself said was an abomination and sin. culture doesn't over rule God.



trying to sow confusion and doubt now and desperately trying to get people to question what they know. it is a weak and poor attempt to be included in the body of Christ and continue to practice that which is sin.



all sin is the church's problem, even homosexuality. repent then you will find the acceptance you desire but as long as people practice homosexuality as a lifetstyle or sexual choice there is NO acceptance in the church of God.

sinners are cast into the lake of fire and their only hope to avoid that judgment is to repent not change what God declared sin.

 

[Texas Lynn]

Cultures change God's word does not.

Our understanding of it constantly changes.

 

[Zaac]

Our understanding of it constantly changes.

Absolute truth does not change. All you have said is that someone isn't listening to God.

 

[one11]

God considers eating clam chowder an abominable sin

Remarriage after divorce is an abomination

Paying interest on your mortgage is an abomination

Talking with a woman during her period is an abomination (but its so tough to get them to post sings about their menstrual cycle in the workplace)

Reading your daily horoscope in the newspaper is an abomination
trimming one's beard - abomination

Its an abomination to have a tattoo, even if it says "Mom"

Having your steak rare is an abomination

That poly cotton blend shirt you are wearing…abomination

Ladies in pants? Abomination

Telling your wife that dress doesn’t make her look fat is an abomination

Stopping off for a haircut? Abomination

Not all those were abominations. I don't recall reading where one couldn't talk to a women during her menstruation?

Here's some mentioned in the church of the Wikipedia lol, so I might need to dig deeper for REAL information.

Tōʻēḇā is also used in Jewish (and Christian Old Testament) scriptures to refer to:

1. idolatry or idols (Deuteronomy 7:25, Deuteronomy 13, (Isaiah 44:19)
2. illicit sex (Ezekiel 16:22,58, Ezekiel 22:11, Ezekiel 33:26)
3. illicit marriage (Deuteronomy 24:2-4)
4. male homosexual and (collectively) heterosexual immorality (Leviticus 18:22, Leviticus 20:13, Leviticus 18:27-30)
5. temple prostitution (1Kings 14:24)
6. offerings from the above (Deuteronomy 23:18)
7. child sacrifice (Jeremiah 32:35)
8. cross-dressing (Deuteronomy 22:5)
9. cheating in the market by using rigged weights (Deuteronomy 25:13-19, Proverbs 11:1)
10. dishonesty (Proverbs 12:22)
11. dietary violations (Deuteronomy 14:3)
12. collectively for many transgressions of the law of Moses (Jeremiah 7:10, Ezekiel 18:13)

********************


Jeremiah 7:10 is incorrect above. I just checked the scripture of Jer 7:10 and that's not what that scripture says.


People are learning about the Bible through the church of the Wikipedia and I'm praying that stops soon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Stop reading the Wikipedia. It's not even written by scholars!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Zeena]

Not all those were abominations. I don't recall reading where one couldn't talk to a women during her menstruation?

Here's some mentioned in the church of the Wikipedia lol, so I might need to dig deeper for REAL information.

Tōʻēḇā is also used in Jewish (and Christian Old Testament) scriptures to refer to:

1. idolatry or idols (Deuteronomy 7:25, Deuteronomy 13, (Isaiah 44:19)
2. illicit sex (Ezekiel 16:22,58, Ezekiel 22:11, Ezekiel 33:26)
3. illicit marriage (Deuteronomy 24:2-4)
4. male homosexual and (collectively) heterosexual immorality (Leviticus 18:22, Leviticus 20:13, Leviticus 18:27-30)
5. temple prostitution (1Kings 14:24)
6. offerings from the above (Deuteronomy 23:18)
7. child sacrifice (Jeremiah 32:35)
8. cross-dressing (Deuteronomy 22:5)
9. cheating in the market by using rigged weights (Deuteronomy 25:13-19, Proverbs 11:1)
10. dishonesty (Proverbs 12:22)
11. dietary violations (Deuteronomy 14:3)
12. collectively for many transgressions of the law of Moses (Jeremiah 7:10, Ezekiel 18:13)

********************


Jeremiah 7:10 is incorrect above. I just checked the scripture of Jer 7:10 and that's not what that scripture says.


People are learning about the Bible through the church of the Wikipedia and I'm praying that stops soon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Stop reading the Wikipedia. It's not even written by scholars!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So, is abomidable sin the "sin that leads to death" that Saint Paul speaks of in;

1 John 5:16
If anyone sees his brother commit a sin that does not lead to death, he should pray and God will give him life. I refer to those whose sin does not lead to death. There is a sin that leads to death. I am not saying that he should pray about that.

It's seems pretty obvious that suicide would be a 'sin that leads to death', but what about abomidable sin?

 

[one11]

So, is abomidable sin the "sin that leads to death" that Saint Paul speaks of in;

1 John 5:16
If anyone sees his brother commit a sin that does not lead to death, he should pray and God will give him life. I refer to those whose sin does not lead to death. There is a sin that leads to death. I am not saying that he should pray about that.

It's seems pretty obvious that suicide would be a 'sin that leads to death', but what about abomidable sin?

No, read all of 1 John 5, the whole passage in context.

If you read it in context, I believe it is related to blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, the only unforgivable sin, because 1 John 5 is also relating Satan, but those of us who have the Holy Spirit can beat Satan.

It is only those who refuse to confess that Christ's miracles were by the power of the Holy Spirit and those who have deemed that Jesus' miracles were by the power of Satan we are not to pray for. I think that's what that whole passage is trying to relate.

 

[Texas Lynn]

Absolute truth does not change.

True; our understanding of what the constitutes however constantly changes.

All you have said is that someone isn't listening to God.

In your opinion. That "someone" might not be who you think.

 

[Zeena]

No, read all of 1 John 5, the whole passage in context.

If you read it in context, I believe it is related to blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, the only unforgivable sin, because 1 John 5 is also relating Satan, but those of us who have the Holy Spirit can beat Satan.

It is only those who refuse to confess that Christ's miracles were by the power of the Holy Spirit and those who have deemed that Jesus' miracles were by the power of Satan we are not to pray for. I think that's what that whole passage is trying to relate.

That makes sense, thanks

 

[LightSeaker]

It's seems pretty obvious that suicide would be a 'sin that leads to death'..........?

As repugnant as suicide is to me, I don't believe that it is a sin that leads to death. I can't. I've had a loved one who did take their own life. If only you knew the personal agony that person went through, the pain, the hurt, the place of absolutely the lowest of mental self worth that person felt about themself. Yes, that death, as is all death is sad. But is it a death that led to death? I don't believe it for an instant.

I can't help but believe that the God I love and worship is a compassionate God. If I thought otherwise I'd have no choice but to flee.

.

 

[Zeena]

As repugnant as suicide is to me, I don't believe that it is a sin that leads to death. I can't. I've had a loved one who did take their own life. If only you knew the personal agony that person went through, the pain, the hurt, the place of absolutely the lowest of mental self worth that person felt about themself. Yes, that death, as is all death is sad. But is it a death that led to death? I don't believe it for an instant.

I can't help but believe that the God I love and worship is a compassionate God. If I thought otherwise I'd have no choice but to flee.

.

Amen!

Speaking of which, I would like to take this opportunity to remind anyone caught up in a homsexual lifestyle that, even though I know it to be sinful, as stated in the Bible, I in no way believe it affects acceptance of a person with our Father. For I know Him to be just like Jesus, who is the express image of His being. And I know Jesus to be lovingly compassionate to all, and to prove that, He died for all.

2 Corinthians 5:15
And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

 

[wayseer]

There are, apparently, some on this thread that take objection to what I write - that is their privilege. However, comments made to administrators or moderations that are blatant misrepresentations of what I have said and taken out of context leaves me with the distinct impression that a homophobic agenda is part of the forum. This is interesting as I note another thread condemning a 'gay agenda'. I seem to remember Jesus having much to say about a similar situation in his day.

 

[david_x]

There are, apparently, some on this thread that take objection to what I write - that is their privilege. However, comments made to administrators or moderations that are blatant misrepresentations of what I have said and taken out of context leaves me with the distinct impression that a homophobic agenda is part of the forum. This is interesting as I note another thread condemning a 'gay agenda'. I seem to remember Jesus having much to say about a similar situation in his day.

I see no objections when homosexuality is the subject of debate. Problems arise when unfounded beliefs pop-up as branches to the primary debate.

 

[Rudolph Hucker]

Dr. Laura Schlessinger
is a US radio personality who dispenses advice to people who call in to her radio show. Recently, she said that as an observant Orthodox Jew - homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22 "Thou shall not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination" and cannot be condoned in any circumstance. The following is an open letter to Dr. Laura penned by a US resident, which was posted on the Internet.



Dear Dr. Laura:

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate.

I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the other specific laws and how to follow them.

1. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odour for the Lord - Lev. 1:9. The problem is my neighbours. They claim the odour is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual unseemliness - Lev. 15:19-24. The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offence.

4. Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighbouring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

5. I have a neighbour who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? - Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help.

Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging. Your devoted disciple and adoring fan.

Jim

 

[wayseer]

So, what should we do with homosexuals? I shudder to think.

And we should be mindful of Jesus' challenge - who among us would cast the first stone?

 

[Zeena]

So, what should we do with homosexuals? I shudder to think.

1 Corinthians 4:21
What will ye? shall I come unto you with a rod, or in love, and in the spirit of meekness?

Galatians 6:1
Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted.

Ephesians 4:32
And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

And we should be mindful of Jesus' challenge - who among us would cast the first stone?

2 Corinthians 10:6
And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled.

 

[david_x]

Dr. Laura Schlessinger
is a US radio personality who dispenses advice to people who call in to her radio show. Recently, she said that as an observant Orthodox Jew - homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22 "Thou shall not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination" and cannot be condoned in any circumstance. The following is an open letter to Dr. Laura penned by a US resident, which was posted on the Internet.

Then it is clearly the opinion of a Jewish women and not relevant to the current debate in Christian ethics...

 

[Rudolph Hucker]

What makes you think that the US resident was a Jewish woman? If 18:22 is an abomination to (some) Jews is it not an equal abomination to (some) Christians?

Was Christ not a Jewish man?

How about the questions posed by the resident?

 

[david_x]

I meant no insult to the Jewish people, I only meant that Dr. Schlessinger's Jewish philosophy was not Christian philosophy.