Heretical teachings of the Seventh Day Adventists

[BobRyan]

I don't understand why the SDA will try to prove that Jesus is just another prophet with Heb 1.

Are you making stuff up or just unclear?

 

[yogosans14]

The SDAs DO believe in the Trinity, but that still doesnt make there other teachings suddenly OK.

 

[BobRyan]

If you can attack Ellen White, then I can attack you. Only thing is you'll run to the moderations crying....So why not play nice?

There is a point here that should not be glossed over. Ad hominem attacks are without substance. Everyone can do it and it proves nothing - good. Why not discuss doctrine, issues, scripture.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

The SDAs DO believe in the Trinity, but that still doesnt make there other teachings suddenly OK.

Methodists don't agree with Baptists on everything. This is not news.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Setyoufree]

The SDAs DO believe in the Trinity, but that still doesnt make there other teachings suddenly OK.

Look, SDA have their problems, but be careful....Are you suggesting you have all the facts? Are your doctrines without error?

Here's Ellen White on the doctrine of the SDA church:

"There is no excuse for anyone in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair"

 

[from scratch]

If you can attack Ellen White, then I can attack you. Only thing is you'll run to the moderations crying....So why not play nice?

I believe it was you that brought up EGW, not me. I addressed the nature of Jesus and not EGW. Now since you brought up the idea I want to see a verse in support. I can provide one for my position and don't believe you can for yours.

If Christ as God did not assume your life indwelt with sin then how could you have died with Him 2000 years ago?

You have body and soul mixed up. The body isn't redeemed. The soul is redeemed and what Jesus lives in in the Christian. Yes the soul lives in a body currently. They part company at the demise of the flesh.

Keep in mind the following:

"our old self was crucified with him" Rom 6:6

Is the old self the body of flesh? No!

"you also died to the law through the body of Christ" Rom 7:4

Did my body die? No! My old nature (soul) did and was reborn not by the flesh as Jesus communicated to Nicodemus.

If you died in Christ then Christ had to assume you. You are indwelt by iniquity and if Christ as God clothed himself with your humanity that humanity had to be indwelt by sin. It was YOUR sin, not His, that Christ assumed. He assumed you to redeem you.

No I'm not indwelt by iniquity any more. I'm indwelt by the Holy Spirit and choose to follow Him (most of the time).

 

[yogosans14]

Hence the doctrine of devils...that is, the heresy that the body is evil and the soul holy. That's legalistic nonsense. That damnable doctrine undermines the gospel and the sinners total need of Christ.

You see if something in you is holy and immortal that part of you does not need Christ. This heresy you present is what Paul termed "another gospel". And he said that anyone who taught it should be accursed.

Gal 1:6 I am amazed that you are so quickly deserting http://www.biblestudytools.com/nas/galatians/1.html#cr-descriptionAnchor-12Him who called you http://www.biblestudytools.com/nas/galatians/1.html#fn-descriptionAnchor-cby the grace of Christ, for a http://www.biblestudytools.com/nas/galatians/1.html#cr-descriptionAnchor-13different gospel ; 7 which is really not another ; only there are some who are http://www.biblestudytools.com/nas/galatians/1.html#cr-descriptionAnchor-14disturbing you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we, or http://www.biblestudytools.com/nas/galatians/1.html#cr-descriptionAnchor-15an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel http://www.biblestudytools.com/nas/galatians/1.html#fn-descriptionAnchor-dcontrary to what we have preached to you, he is to be http://www.biblestudytools.com/nas/galatians/1.html#fn-descriptionAnchor-ehttp://www.biblestudytools.com/nas/galatians/1.html#cr-descriptionAnchor-16accursed

Early Church Father writings on the subject matter:

"The immortal soul dwells in a mortal tabernacle..." Letter to Diognetus (c. 125-200)

"There are some others [Platonists], who, having supposed the soul to be immortal and immaterial, believe that though they have committed evil they will not suffer punishment (for that which is immaterial is insensible). They also say that the soul, in consequence of its immortality, needs nothing from God." Justin Martyr (c. 160, E), 1.194

"If the world is begotten, souls also are necessarily begotten. Perhaps at one time they were not in existence . For they were made on account of men and other creatures - that is, if you will say that souls have been begotten wholly apart, and not along with their respective bodies...'They are not, then, immortal?' No, since the world has appeared to us to be begotten. But I do not say, indeed, that all souls die. For that would truly be a piece of good fortune to evil persons." Justin Martyr (c. 160, E), 1.197.

"It becomes us now to seek for what we once had, but have lost. It becomes us to unite the soul with the Holy Spirit, and to strive after union with God. The human soul consists of many parts, and is not simple. It is composite, so as to manifest itself through the body. For neither could it ever appear by itself without the body, nor does the flesh rise again without the soul." Tatian (c. 160, E), 2.71.

"Death is the fellowship of the soul in a state of sin with the body. Life is the separation from sin...'For the world is crucified to me,' the apostle says. 'And now I live, though in the flesh, as having my conversation in heaven." Clement of Alexandria (c. 195, E), 2.411.

 

[from scratch]

I said you are righteous by faith, not in reality. Otherwise you are stating (which is a lie) that you are actually righteous. John says one is delusional that claims to be without sin.

Your righteousness is in Christ, not in you for you are not righteous. You are accounted righteous by faith. In yourself you are a vile sinner....Who are you kidding????

Maybe you should read Heb 11 sometime.

 

[BobRyan]

Its been proven that Ellen G White is a false Prophetess which makes the SDA Chuch false since they follow her teachings.

Here again your wild assumptions do not meet the facts.

1. There is not a single belief in that list of 28 that relies on a proof/statement by Ellen White -- they all stand or fall "sola scriptura".

2. Anyone who takes the time to do that analysis and accept those Bible doctrines can then see if Ellen White meets the doctrinal test that was established to test the 28 beliefs - testing them without using a single word of her writing.

#3

in Christ,

Bob

 

[yogosans14]

Methodists don't agree with Baptists on everything. This is not news.

in Christ,

Bob

I have studied the Cults who claim to be Christian in good detail. I know enough that the disagreements in the Baptist vs Methodist Church is nothing compared to the SDA. The SDA are a watered down version of the JWs practically.

 

[yogosans14]

Maybe you should read Heb 11 sometime.

They will find some way of taking it out of context, Cults love doing that.

 

[BobRyan]

Hmmm! In my copy the SDA organization is in the cult section of Walter Martins book - Kingdom of the Cults

In my copy they are in the appendix. And the preface reads as is posted on this thread.

 

[yogosans14]

Jehovahs Witnesses believe Jesus is the archangel Michael, interesting SDAs have a spin on this to.

The Seventh Day Adventists teach that Jesus and Michael the Archangel are one and the same. However, some people mistakenly think that the SDA are teaching that Jesus is a created angel, and therefore not truly divine. But that is not the Seventh-day Adventist position. Instead, they are saying that the Old Testament manifestation of Michael the Archangel was actually the pre-incarnate Christ and that he is not created. They are incorrect in their comparison, but in it they are not denying the deity of Christ.

 

[yogosans14]

Also On October 22, 1844, the SDAs believe Jesus entered the second and last phase of his atoning work.

 

[from scratch]

"One God in THREE persons blessed Trinity" -- The Triune Godhead.

Fundamental Belief #2

There is one God—Father, Son and Holy Spirit, a unity of three co-eternal Persons. God is immortal, all-powerful, all-knowing, above all, and ever present. He is infinite and beyond human comprehension, yet known through His self-revelation. He is forever worthy of worship, adoration and service by all of creation. (Deut. 6:4; Matt. 28:19; 2 Cor. 13:14; Eph. 4:4-6; 1 Peter 1:2; 1 Tim. 1:17; Rev. 14:7.)


Fundamental Belief #4 God the Son.

God the eternal Son became incarnate in Jesus Christ. Through Him all things were created, the character of God is revealed, the salvation of humanity is accomplished and the world is judged. Forever truly God, He became also truly man, Jesus the Christ. He was conceived of the Holy Spirit and born of the virgin Mary. He lived and experienced temptation as a human being, but perfectly exemplified the righteousness and love of God. By His miracles He manifested God's power and was attested as God's promised Messiah. He suffered and died voluntarily on the cross for our sins and in our place, was raised from the dead, and ascended to minister in the heavenly sanctuary in our behalf. He will come again in glory for the final deliverance of His people and the restoration of all things. (John 1:1-3, 14; Col. 1:15-19; John 10:30; 14:9; Rom. 6:23; 2 Cor. 5:17-19; John 5:22; Luke 1:35; Phil. 2:5-11; Heb. 2:9-18; 1 Cor. 15:3, 4; Heb. 8:1, 2; John 14:1-3.)

Yes I can read very well. What is posted here in CF doesn't line up with those statements at all. No I'm not stating something that isn't true and no I'm not going to spend the time (which I don't have at the moment but if you want to push it I will quit posting till I've built a quote file to quote every time) it could take months. I'll dribble them till I've got a large file) digging up the dirt. If any one wants to call me a liar let them. The SDA live in denial.

 

[BobRyan]

The Seventh Day Adventists teach that Jesus and Michael the Archangel are one and the same. However, some people mistakenly think that the SDA are teaching that Jesus is a created angel, and therefore not truly divine. But that is not the Seventh-day Adventist position. Instead, they are saying that the Old Testament manifestation of Michael the Archangel was actually the pre-incarnate Christ and that he is not created. .

Just as Abraham sees "3 men" walking toward him and later finds that one of them is God and the other 2 are Angels. The fact that they can appear in a "form" that is not blazing glory or that God the Son can manifest himself physically so that Abraham sees him looking like "a man" does not make God less God - because He can do such things.

The Jehovah's Witnesses I have studied with never consider that a version of how they view Michael or Christ.

And of course there is the obvious point that the statement about Michael is not one of the 28 Fundamental Beliefs - and never has been.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

Yes I can read very well. What is posted here in CF doesn't line up with those statements at all. .

What I have posted comes directly from those links - and those links are hosted by the SDA world headquarters for that denomination. It does not get any more official than that.

The beliefs of the Seventh-day Adventist church are stated in 28 short paragraphs. 28 statements of belief, 28 doctrines. Each paragraph is typically between 2 to 6 sentences. So not a lot of reading.

Beliefs: The Official Site of the Seventh-day Adventist world church

http://www.adventist.org/fileadmin/...les/official-statements/28Beliefs-English.pdf

You say you have a mission to "dig up dirt" -- carry on.

I am not here to stop those looking for dirt.

=========================================

"One God in THREE persons blessed Trinity" -- The Triune Godhead.

Fundamental Belief #2

There is one God—Father, Son and Holy Spirit, a unity of three co-eternal Persons. God is immortal, all-powerful, all-knowing, above all, and ever present. He is infinite and beyond human comprehension, yet known through His self-revelation. He is forever worthy of worship, adoration and service by all of creation. (Deut. 6:4; Matt. 28:19; 2 Cor. 13:14; Eph. 4:4-6; 1 Peter 1:2; 1 Tim. 1:17; Rev. 14:7.)


Fundamental Belief #4 God the Son.

God the eternal Son became incarnate in Jesus Christ. Through Him all things were created, the character of God is revealed, the salvation of humanity is accomplished and the world is judged. Forever truly God, He became also truly man, Jesus the Christ. He was conceived of the Holy Spirit and born of the virgin Mary. He lived and experienced temptation as a human being, but perfectly exemplified the righteousness and love of God. By His miracles He manifested God's power and was attested as God's promised Messiah. He suffered and died voluntarily on the cross for our sins and in our place, was raised from the dead, and ascended to minister in the heavenly sanctuary in our behalf. He will come again in glory for the final deliverance of His people and the restoration of all things. (John 1:1-3, 14; Col. 1:15-19; John 10:30; 14:9; Rom. 6:23; 2 Cor. 5:17-19; John 5:22; Luke 1:35; Phil. 2:5-11; Heb. 2:9-18; 1 Cor. 15:3, 4; Heb. 8:1, 2; John 14:1-3.)

 

[from scratch]

Here again your wild assumptions do not meet the facts.

1. There is not a single belief in that list of 28 that relies on a proof/statement by Ellen White -- they all stand or fall "sola scriptura".

2. Anyone who takes the time to do that analysis and accept those Bible doctrines can then see if Ellen White meets the doctrinal test that was established to test the 28 beliefs - testing them without using a single word of her writing.

#3

in Christ,

Bob

Wild assumptions? Really? Why do you invite attack on your prophetess? Facts about her have been posted proving she is a false prophet. Why do we have to continue on this merry-go-round? Why must everything be posted, posted and reposted, reposted, reposted, reposted and reposted? Why isn't once enough for you people? Nothing has ever been refuted by you folks with any facts. We can even quote your archives to no avail. Like I said you live in denial. I've read the forum for more than 10 years and posted for more than 3.

Not only that, my personal interaction with SDA people bear the same story I hear on this forum complete with attitude. Some of you say I can't recognize an SDA person who has your churches commentaries, Sabbath school literature, even an EGW study bible on prominent display and invites me to their SDA church as the real McCoy. You guys fight each other as convenient to your need thinking everyone else is an idiot. But you're simply to much fun to leave alone. Besides as a Christian I really can't.

 

[Setyoufree]

If you died in Christ then Christ had to assume you. You are indwelt by iniquity and if Christ as God clothed himself with your humanity that humanity had to be indwelt by sin. It was YOUR sin, not His, that Christ assumed. He assumed you to redeem you.

No I'm not indwelt by iniquity any more.

If you weren't indwelt by your bent to self (iniquity) then you would be without sin.

I left a local SDA church back in 1997. Most them had a self-righteous attitude too. One thing I've found out is other Christians are just as self-righteous if not more so....You would make a good traditional SDA. In fact you would make an excellent Pharisee.

Anyone who states that they are without sin and are free of their nature is under the control of Satan. They are self-deceived. Again, see 1 John 1:8

 

[Setyoufree]

BobRyan,

I feel you are wasting your time....scratch isn't interested in a discussion. He has proclaimed that he is righteous....He has proclaimed that he has holy flesh. He's self-deceived....