Help please! Wife in mid-life crisis & had emotional affair

May 9, 2017
9
2
59
San Francisco
✟15,860.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Looking over the various threads in this forum I can see that I'm not alone. That realization alone makes my heart ache that much more. There's so much pain out there!

The Short Version:

my wife of 11 years had an "emotional affair" but with, admittedly, alot of physical attention. in other words, and affair, because an affair...is an affair...is an affair, any way you slice it. i know the OM -- he was formerly someone i considered a friend -- and confronted him on it. he expressed deep regret, and promised it was over and would stay away. i, of course, confronted my wife upon discovery. she is also deeply remorseful, though very confused as to our future together as a couple b/c she still has mixed feelings; she does love me and care very much for me, but "fell in love" with the OM despite knowing it was wrong to do so. we have two young children. she loves our family dynamic, which just makes this all that more confusing. i had made some mistakes for a 1-2 year period, but nothing so egregious as to warrant a complete breakdown of trust. she claims that we aren't necessarily compatible, and yet over the last 1.5 years she has seen a change in me which is why she did not give up. and, so, the jury is still out; we are in the process of recovery, in all it's painstaking slowness.

The Long, Detailed Version:

I'm in my early 50's, my wife in her late 40's. We are both Christians and attend church. We have 2 beautiful children and...I discovered recently that my wife had an emotional affair with a family friend. Someone with who I am friendly with, as well, which only adds to the sense of betrayal. I would not wish what I have been through in the last 6 weeks on anyone. It's horrific. The emails that I happened upon when she left her email account open (as I went to check for a document) sucked me down the rabbit hole; the deeper I went, the more reality slipped away. It's a nightmare unlike any other, discovering your spouse has given her heart to someone else (and possibly, much more; though I do not know the full details she has assured me they did not have intercourse and that she would get tested for STD's if I asked). I have experienced alot of heartache in my life -- parent's divorce, several deaths, a family suicide -- but nothing compares to this; the other things I can explain away. This, I cannot.

My wife was completely and utterly shocked by my discovery -- more like shell-shocked. It is much like a battlefield, the hours after discovery. I can see why some people compare going through the throes of D-day to PTSD; while not as graphic as what a soldier experiences, it's got to be just as emotionally gut-wrenching. Out of all the people in the world, this is THE one that you trust the most, honor the most, cherish the most. It's a long fall from grace -- for both the betrayed and the betrayer.

She exhibited great remorse over the following hours, days and weeks. She and I have cried together. At one point, we cried to the point where we were overcome with emotion and began kissing passionately. I almost thought that we would make love, but she insisted I spoon with her and hold her close, that she was feeling affectionate but not sexual at that time. I can understand that, but it was so hard to hold back. In retrospect, I'm glad I did -- but I miss my wife so much!

In the days and weeks since then, we have gone through every emotion that you'd expect. I did not get all the answers or details initially, and still have not, b/c my wife is not ready to divulge everything yet. It's coming in bits and pieces. She is in individual therapy (as am I), and feels she needs to do more work on herself, to delve into some of the issues that led her into this EA in the first place. She has said that she has some long-standing issues to sort out, things that she has been aware of (prior to our life together), and that she is also experiencing a sort of "mi-life crisis" (and all I wanted was a car!). I welcome the fact she is in therapy -- I think it's helped stabilize her some. She does want to go to counseling with me, too, but isn't quite ready for that. We did have one session, with an EFT therapist (Emotionally Focused Therapy), but there were some complications surrounding that; she thought we were seeing my individual therapist (not a brand new one, and I barely had time to tell her about the fact we were seeing a different person b/c we both lead such busy lives), she thought the therapist was part of our medical plan and not one we'd be paying $190/hr for, and she was upset that I had talked with the counselor initially on the phone. She was worried that she had already been "painted into a corner". I explained to her that we did chat, for 5 minutes, so I could ask her questions about her practice -- and my wife cooled down after that. Anyway, the point is that she is open to therapy, counseling, and delving into working on our marriage but will not fully commit to that until she has processed some of her own pain and issues.

As for me, after the initial shock (on a Friday), I knew by the end of the weekend that I wanted to save our marriage. I decided that I wasn't going to take this lying down, that I wouldn't let this wash over me like a riptide. I was going to fight like never before, and I was going to take The High Road to do it. I have fully committed myself to it, body and soul. I have also given it all up to the Lord as I know I have little to no control over the outcome -- He knows better than I what needs to be done, and if it is His will that our marriage shall be healed, if it serves His glory, then so be it. But just b/c you are giving it all over to the highest power does not mean you suddenly have peace of mind, that you can just switch to auto-pilot. Maybe those whose faith runs deeper can feel this way, but I am far from that in this particular case and I think He understands. This is an extremely volatile situation. I go through many periods where I feel utterly hopeless. It's soul crushing. All I can do is ask Him to protect me, my wife and our family, to know that we are human beings wired with complex emotions, and that we can only do so much on our own -- that we have to surrender our faith that He will do the rest, and take us under His care.

She has stopped contact with the affair partner, and promised that she would not be in contact, although I did discover in our one session that she had sent him an email asking if he was "OK" which was not easy for me to hear. I have also gotten in touch with the affair partner -- I know him, after all. We actually met, went on a walk and talked. It was about the most surreal experience I've ever had, meeting with this man who helped engineer our marital disaster. He was also in anguish, tried to explain why they had gotten involved, and shared with me some of the pain he has faced in his own marriage (yes, he's married w/kids, too) and in his life. We talked about our history, about our views on spirituality, all sort of things not even connected ot the affair. We were walking through this beautiful canyon when, suddenly, I knew I had to minister to him -- something i had never, ever done before, but I knew he desperately needed it. I asked at one point if we could pray together; he was a little nervous but agreed to. It was one of the most heart-opening experiences I (and, based on his tears, I think he would agree) have ever experienced. And then I forgave him. He was blown away. He vowed he would not interfere with the rebuilding process my wife and I are attempting.

A day or two later, over the weekend, I told my wife about this meeting with the "other man", while lying in bed with her; I had not planned on telling her, just one conversation thread led to another and it slipped out. In that moment I forgave her, as well. She was similarly amazed -- and speechless. Although, a couple of weeks later in our counseling session she did say that she didn't feel she should "get off that easy". I'm always amazed that someone who has been forgiven can still carry the guilt and shame of their actions, even though the party that has forgiven them clearly has forgiven them. Especially when you're a Christian; we should all understand the true meaning behind forgiveness, right? It's as if they want to carry that baggage, that they are so deep in their self-loathing or caught up in their self-destructive tendencies that they carry it like a battleship chain.

We have had some good moments since then and, on a few occasions, some great moments: a final, end of year ski trip, a family bicycle trip, 1-2 family celebrations. There has been some affection here and there; I've been a little more affectionate (not to the point of being a nuisance; mostly a quick peck here and there, occasional hand holding or rubbing sore shoulders, etc). And she has responded on occasion; we have been so much kinder to each other, vs the snappy/stressful exchanges we would have on occasion prior to discovery. She has grabbed for my hand a couple of times, or placed a hand on my knee, etc. It's not hearts and flowers but it's something and I will take it. I have tried to do anything I can to either relieve stress-points, remedy pre-existing issues, or value add to our relationship; small "random acts of kindness", giving her all the time she needs to get exercise/stay healthy, watching the kids so she can get work done, etc. I did one thing for her recently, something I picked up on, which she greatly appreciated and brought joy to her. These are all small things, like putting a fresh cut rose from our bushes in a vase on her desk, things like that. Quiet things to show her that I value her beyond measure.

You may wonder "where do you think you were at fault"? I will tell you. I can pinpoint it to a couple of things. I lost a job about 3 years ago, that caused her great stress; it impacted us a little, financially, for which she had to pick up the slack. I felt horrible about it, and did my best to keep up my end of obligations, but that was not enough. I also fell into a period of depression from this job loss/downsizing. Ironically, it was right around this period that she got closer to the "friend", and their relationship went to the next level. How I wish she had come to me, first! Did she not see how I had been humiliated, that I was hurting, too? It makes me wonder if marriage vows like "for better, for worse" have any place in this modern world, with it's modern problems; some of those vows sound almost antiquated, now. And yet, they really are timeless, aren't they? It's a shame that most spouses do not treat them with the weight they deserve. They are timeless vows for a reason; they are valid!

I also slipped up with regards to getting a few things done around the house or some parenting obligations. Not to the point where our house was falling to pieces or the kids were walking around with only one sock on, mind you, but anyone who is a parent to young, toddler to school-age kids will understand how overwhelmed one can feel at times trying to keep all the balls in the air. How do you keep your employer/spouse/kids/friends/self happy at all times? It's impossible. I think we expect too much of ourselves. We cannot, and will not, ever attain that state of perfection. It's a fantasy. I think I've batted about a .315 on all fronts, but my "coach" apparently saw someone in a slump with a .225 average. Of course, it's all hindsight now -- but I wish I had known just how vital some of these things were at the time. One of them over installing a new landline phone to replace a broken one, which took me 2 years to finally get around to. 2 years! For a $20 item. Ridiculous, that my marriage should fall to pieces over a piece of plastic and electronics made in Taiwan.

As I said, more recently we have been on a better path (this, even though we have not had serious couples counseling yet); for example, she has used more "we" statements than "I" statements, especially when it comes to a future together. We have continued to talk about some future plans, like planning her 50th birthday next year (I am taking her to Italy). The talk has shifted to being more inclusive than exclusive. We've been cuddling in bed in the morning before getting up (just spooning, leg over leg stuff), etc; my wife is subject to insomnia, though, and is also pre-menopause. She needs some separation before being able to fall asleep, otherwise she gets would up and can't fall asleep.

So, after a terrible night's sleep two nights ago, last night she was very withdrawn. She complained of "overheating" (pre-menopause symptoms), insomnia, and is also having her period. What fun; it's like a perfect storm, isn't it? She said "I need some space", mostly in terms of my not laying close to her when we fall asleep which, I admit, I have edged a little closer to her than pre-discovery (not that she ever minded me staying "on my side of the bed", per her disposition to insomnia, but at the same time she does understand my wanting to be closer to her). The need for space also ties in to the unresolved and conflicted emotions she is processing, of course; the physical intrusion into her space just complicates things, in addition to her body issues and emotional state. This is not the first time I have heard "I need space" (or the classic "I need space and time"); the one act I did for her which I mentioned earlier that brought her joy addressed her earlier "space and time" statement. But, I know it's not a one and done situation -- I know she is going to go through these periods of "needing space".

So I grabbed my pillows and told her I'd be spending the night on the sofa (which I hate). I gave her "space". I will likely do so this evening, as well. I told her "when you're ready for me to be in the bedroom again, let me know". She also said she could sleep on the sofa, but I prefer giving her the bedroom so she can be by herself w/out interruption from kids, etc. As I was drifting off to sleep, I heard her start sobbing. It wrenched at my heart. I quietly walked in, knelt beside the bed, and held her hand. I told her I wanted to say a quick prayer, to ask for peace and comfort. She didn't really respond, but I prayed with her anyway. I felt called to do it. It was the first time we had ever done this and it was moving, for me at least. I'm not entirely sure how she felt about it; I think she appreciated the gesture although I do know that when I thanked Him for our blessings, for our children in particular, she prodded me to finish (which I did). I think maybe she felt it was getting to be "too much" at that point. I have to be so careful with her!

This morning, I awoke at 6 am to hear her sobbing, again. This time, I did nothing and let her go at it. One of our son's then stumbled into bed with her. I put on some tea and left a cup on her nightstand, without a word. I then sat outside, watching the sun rise with my coffee while silently crying and asking the Lord "how much longer? how much more of this are we expected to go through"? If I ever had a quick evening prayer with Him before, it's an ongoing dialogue now; I ask Him for everything, everything. Mostly, to heal our broken marriage and to give both my wife and I the strength to carry on and see it through to another day. My greatest fear is that we will burn out at some point if we do not reach a place of healing, that the "statute of limitations" on our marriage will run out and the darkness will overcome us. She passed me by on her way out this morning, as I sat there with coffee and tears, and said in a bit of harsh tone "it's not all about you, it's about me, too". Later, she apologized in a text message and said that she knows I went outside just to prevent our kids from seeing dad upset -- she even said "thank you for sparing the kids; I left for work earlier than normal so they would not see my tears, either". She assured that it will be ok, that it needs to run it's course, and she asked me to stay strong. That this, too, shall pass.

I pray, fervently, that it does. This is all so much a bad dream that I wish would go away, but won't. It's awful. I am so deeply vested in this woman, in her family -- for example, I love her mom as my own (who I lost in 2002). Her mom adores me -- she would be horrified to know what was going on. It's just tragic in every way. Please, lift us up in prayer if you have a moment.

Thank you for reading this. A couple of questions:

* do you think I'm taking the right steps here? I've told her that I'm approaching this with all the integrity and inner strength I can possibly muster, and that I am relying on Him for everything else. She really appreciates that. I am not doing anything to guilt-trip her, make her feel bad, etc. If she is going to "feel bad" it will be due to her own guilt, etc, but I am not contributing to it. I am being patient, kind, and compassionate.
* for the ladies; how should I approach giving her "space"? how much should I lay off vs pay attention to her? I do want her to know that I care and that I am here for her, but I don't want to disrespect her desire for space to sort things out. It's hard when you're both under the same roof, with small children in the house who have absolutely no knowledge of what's going on (we put on such a good facade with them!). She stayed at an older couple's house for about a week after discovery, which I had initially suggested (but deeply regretted as I could not stand her being gone at night); last night she had told me that she would really like to go visit a close girlfriend of hers who lives far away, but she knows she doesn't really have the time/money to do so.
* how should I approach any sort of timetable for the two of us to get into counseling? Leave it entirely up to her? I am not one to issue ultimatums; I think they can backfire. I would rather just leave her be and let her get through her issues; it seems that she is indicating that she wants to stick around, although just after discovery she stated that she wasn't sure if she even wanted to be married anymore.
* and speaking of the above -- she did say, in the days after discovery, she wasn't sure she could see a future with me. She wondered if we were truly compatible, and not in the sense you might be thinking; for example, I have historically been more of a night owl, she an early riser. She wonders if this makes us truly right for each other, and i think that statement is kind of ridiculous (but have not said this to her, of course). I pointed out that, while at one time I was like this, I have shifted over the years -- and I really have, simply due to being exhausted at the end of the day from work and parenting duties -- and that I didn't see returning to that. I have tried to imply that we actually do have alot in common, it's just that we both been overwhelmed by parenting, mortgages, etc, and that things have, in fact, eased up a little over the last 1-2 years with the kids becoming more "manageable". Maybe she sees that, maybe she doesn't -- the jury is still out. But I am encouraged by those aforementioned "we" statements that had been missing for some time.
* finally, I am having a very, very hard time reconciling how something like this could happen to a Christian couple. I should note that, while both of us have been saved, each of us strayed from our faith and from church for several years (both prior to knowing each other, and for the first few years). We both began attending service about 3 years ago.

Thank you, one and all...I will post updates over time. Hopefully, we will begin to see a positive upward swing; I've already started seeing one.

s/

Hiding His Heart On His Sleeve in San Francisco
 
Last edited:

live4Christ2016

Active Member
Apr 22, 2016
117
73
54
Melbourne, Australia
✟16,335.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
I'm sorry that this has happened in your marriage. No doubt that it hurts, but you are doing very well to be open with your communication and above all forgiving them when we all know that is very hard to do.
To pray with her and the other man is such a Godly act.
This woman should feel happy to call you her husband.
As for giving her space...everyone needs space and maybe in the bedroom have some cuddling time and then give her the space she needs. I don't know...it's something you both need to discuss.
Separation isn't necessarily a bad thing, but counselling during any separation is key if you both are willing.
My husband will never go to counselling with me over our marital issues so as far as the bedroom we are separated. He sleeps in one room and I in another. It's just best for our situation. I just pray to him and us as a married couple.
One thing that struck me was for her to say that to you when she walked passed you with your coffee and tears. You have every right to shed tears over what she has done. I'm glad she apologised.
All I can say is just keep praying and loving her.
May I ask how old your children are? Are you able to have date nights....dinners out? Someone to watch the kids?
Also, do you feel that she loves you as much as you do her? That she is as deeply committed to your marriage as you are?
Somewhere she had an emotional affair because you two weren't in sync somehow. Could be that she felt it was lack of compatibility, but is there anything else?
I hope things get better and God brings you through this storm. It's not fun.
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Edo2
Upvote 0
May 9, 2017
9
2
59
San Francisco
✟15,860.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
hello "live"

thanks for your reply, i appreciate it. sorry for the extra long thread that you had to get through -- i'm going to edit that, with an "elevator pitch" version at the top and then, for anyone wanting to dig deeper, they can have at it. ;-)

let me answer the questions you had:

May I ask how old your children are?

They are 9 and 10. Sweetest guys in the world who have God in their lives, too.

Are you able to have date nights....dinners out? Someone to watch the kids?

Yes, we are able to and will be actually having a night to ourselves next week -- albeit to shop for some kitchen remodeling stuff. But we will go out for dinner as part of that, so it's not "all work" ;-) We have childcare available, yes. We went out to dinner last week as a family and had a lovely time. It's funny how, despite the intensity of this tragedy, that a little more than a month later we can sit and laugh and have warm feelings around the table. My life feels a Twilight Zone episode at times, and the lows & highs I experience make me feel like Dr Jekyll & Mr. Hyde. Emotionally it's rough, of course -- but I wonder what long-term effect this may have on my psyche because that is REALLY taking a beating.

I am also in the early stages of planning something for her birthday in mid-June. I have it set up so that we could either take the kids, or go alone -- I'm going to pitch it to her as such, and give her the choice of taking one option over the other. I do not want her to feel like I'm only taking her away to get romantic with her (although that would be a fantastic and, frankly, much needed plus); I'm really trying to rebuild our relationship from the ground up, starting with an affectionate friendship.

Also, do you feel that she loves you as much as you do her? That she is as deeply committed to your marriage as you are?

This is the tough one to answer. Does she love me? Yes. Is she "in love" with me? Upon discovery/D-day, as she explained what led her to get involved in the affair, I asked her if she was in love with the other man. She replied slowly, thoughtfully, "I think I do, yes, I think so". When I asked her if she loved me, she responded "As a person I do but, as a wife, no...not really". Which, as you can imagine, crushed me. Here I am, the one man in her life who ever treated her with honor, respect, and has never cheated or given her a reason to be jealous (unlike some of her former, so-called "true loves" who all cheated on her at one point) -- and this is the thanks I get? Unbelievable. I think there must be a medical case name for this disorder, sort of like Stockholm syndrome yet not that? Anyway 2-3 weeks later, when we got into a late night discussion with lots of tears I said at one point "I can't believe you said you love me...as a PERSON! A "person"? The mailman, that's a person. Do you love me as much as someone like the mailman?". I know, I was a bit hysterical but I think I subconsciously wanted her to see the ridiculousness of that statement and how it affects me -- someone she has known for 12 years! She said "No, no, I don't love you like the mailman. I'm sorry. That was a bad choice of words. I do love you and care about you." But she has pointed out on several occasions that she does not feel romantic love (and certainly not sexual love), although I know she still finds me handsome and attractive. This is because she is still trapped in the fog of her emotional attachment to the other man who, quite frankly (because I know this person), is not physically the hottest ticket in town and goes against her particular "type". Please, don't take this as bragging or boasting -- I know that there's more to a person than their looks, of course. And she has proved that point. Our relationship has never been about that -- although people always comment that we make a great couple which, in retrospect, makes me laugh. If they only knew!

Is she deeply committed to the marriage? Again, I don't know because she doesn't know, either. She is trying to arrive at a decision as to whether she wants to work on rebuilding our marriage. She has told e that she has to feel 100% vested and committed toward that and I agree; it ain't gonna work unless she goes all in. I am not pressuring her or forcing her to make a decision. What I am doing, though, and I have told her this just recently, is that I am now setting boundaries. Mostly with regards to myself. I need to protect my heart from any more damage, because I honestly do not know how much more I can take. I know that God only gives us as much hardship as we can handle; He knows our limits. Some days, though, like last night for example as I lay alone in our bed while she curled up in one of the kid's beds (which she does not always do, maybe 2-3x since the discovery)? She texted me "goodnight!" from the kid's room. I responded "Yeah, goodnight I guess. Isn't it kind of weird to text each other "goodnight" while we are in the same house though?". And for the next 1-2 hours I laid in bed, crying my a** off, lamenting how wrong all of this was, pleading with the Lord to make things right if it His will, asking Him to reveal to me the purpose of all of this because I am so in the dark as to why this is all happening in the first place.

The good thing from that? I woke at about 6 to find her back in bed near me, her leg draped over mine, fast asleep. And when she awoke, she (in a rare moment) leaned over to hug me and kissed me on the cheek, asking how I slept. That was really nice to wake up to. ;-) So, I think Him for that and the small acts I see along the way. Maybe there is hope yet.

Somewhere she had an emotional affair because you two weren't in sync somehow. Could be that she felt it was lack of compatibility, but is there anything else?

Something else? Yes, of course, many "somethings". I lost a job about 3 years ago that affected us financially, putting the strain on her. The way in which I lost it was, basically, I was put on the chopping block and "forced out" by having my position and role cut with the offer to take a secondary position, without the "director" title, at about a 25% pay cut. It was humiliating, and I knew deep down what was going on; there was a recent regime change in the company, and they had been clearing out the old guard of which I was apart of. I took the alternate severance package they offered instead, thinking I could find a job with my skills quickly enough. I did not consult my wife of this, it just happened. It was a fool's move, one I have deeply regretted and one that she now understands (the humiliation part), but at the time she felt that I should have taken the other role offered, sucked it up for the family, then conducted a job hunt. I blew it in that regard.

I also neglected certain responsibilities in terms of accepting more of the household maintenance workload: setting appointments/calling service people, stepping up in home maintenance in other areas (although I was doing alot of repainting, yard improvement, other fixes -- but apparently not enough). And I neglected a couple of other, smaller things. Like not getting a better bicycle for, and teaching my younger son, to ride a bike when he was of age (I'm just telling you what she "singled out"). And I did not always fully listen/engage with her in certain conversations, either b/c I was distracted by the kids or my phone or whatever. Not actively suggesting that we (her and I) go out, not making the plans/arranging for the babysitter/etc. Spending too much time on some art/filmmaking projects I had taken up. Not being as respectful at times when it came to sexual fulfillment, like when she would not really be "in the mood" but I would pressure her for sex and, most times, she would just give in to "get it over with", or doing little things that she doesn't particularly like or favor. Little things like that, that snowballed into one big thing: inattentiveness.

Thoughts on that?

I know I screwed up in some cases. But I've also been kind, generous, thoughtful, romantic, non-judgmental, great with our kids and active in their lives, etc. Not exactly a wife beater, alcoholic, insensitive jerk. And so, I hardly think that where I have faulted is justification for her going out and getting her "needs" from someone outside our marriage. She knows this, feels tremendous remorse over this, and knows how much she has hurt me and hurt our marriage. But is that enough?

BTW, I am sorry to hear of what you are going through. That really bites. Have you tried counseling at all, ever? What is his purpose of staying in the marriage? I would ask him that --"why are you even here"? I would consider setting boundaries. Tell him so, that your heart is numb, that you cannot live like this any longer, and that there must be change. Maybe try saying "You know what? If this continues, if you continue alienating me, you are going to lose me -- not the other way around". And then, decide on a course of action. A life like the one you are leading, is no life! This is something I will say to MY wife, if she doesn't pull her head out of the sand and start showing me some small improvements and start gaining an "attitude of gratitude". She needs to wake up, get with the program, and decide what is most important to her -- the great family and love she has before her? Or some exciting little fling that she had a girl's high school crush. One is proven and solid (deep down), with a husband and friend who, though he has always been there, has FULLY awakened and is someone she has a proven history, and loving family structure with. Someone who is a man of God and values God's plan. The other man? He is not a Christian and has misplaced views on what/who God is = not good! Should she REALLY want to pursue a total unknown/unproven entity, she is going to get a jolt of reality at some point when she discovers all of the things he is NOT. I only pray she has the innate sense to see that, before she makes a HUGE mistake.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
May 9, 2017
9
2
59
San Francisco
✟15,860.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Here's a lovely song to maybe post to a spouse's Facebook page or send by email -- a spouse you may have trouble communicating with or is otherwise either questioning your love for them or feeling their own regrets and doubts -- that may cause them to think. At the end of the day, most troubles we have with each other can be chalked up to communication, either good...or bad.

I posted this to my wife's page and I think she may have gotten the message, just a little bit. Sometimes, a little bit is enough.


Little Beatle-esque song called "Say It" with some tender lyrics:

Open up your heart
Say the things you want to say
Maybe a delicate subject
But say it anyway

Say it very soon
When you take your tea and toast
Don't leave the house without saying
Whose toast you love the most

'Cause there's some
Who wished they had said it
At the cemetery gates
Don't be the one to heave a sigh
Say it now, don't wait!

(Go on say it)
Say it now
(Go on say it now)

Say it anywhere
Even on a crowded train
The eight thirty one to Euston
Won't be the same again

Say it to the ones
Who brush your collar everyday
And stick around in December
As they did in May

'Cause there's some
Who wished they had said it
At the cemetery gates
But we'll never make that mistake

Let's say it anyplace
Let's say it face to face
Say it for goodness sake
...Now
 
Upvote 0

live4Christ2016

Active Member
Apr 22, 2016
117
73
54
Melbourne, Australia
✟16,335.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
If the other man is not a Christian or believer then it would be a very bad road for her to be on. Yes, not good.

My husband is the silent type so talking about personal issues goes nowhere. To leave is impossible. I tried one time when my son was a baby, but came back. He is not abusive, always tries to do for me, is a good father, but he just doesn't show the affection I need. Sex never happens. Never. He says he loves me, but there is no touching....no initiating on his part. I did all of the initiating and don't do it anymore. I suggested sex therapy as he has erectile dysfunction, but he said no way. He is so embarrassed about his problem that he will avoid sex completely. A man who loves his wife doesn't avoid sex with her. Sex equals frustration and it's too much work it seems.
On the other hand I can't imagine being with anyone else. I don't want to be with anyone else. Sigh. It's a long story.

With God's help you will work through this, but she better wake up to trying o have something with a non believer. My husband was a non believer when we married....I was a believer. I made the mistake of marrying unequally yoked. We have been married 15 years and he is saved now, but still a child when it comes to his faith.
Your wife is barking up the wrong tree if she wants to be with this other man. Just sayin.
 
Upvote 0
May 9, 2017
9
2
59
San Francisco
✟15,860.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
"Live",

I agree, it's no bueno -- she is defiant in the face of God, which is more important than any opinion I could have. I just can't understand on a logical level but, then again, this is grounded in fantasy and sin and temptation where there is little room left for logic or rational thinking.

I will say this, though. I have seen a subtle shift in her the last few days. I have not mentioned events of the last few days. She asked for "space" the other night so I headed to the sofa. She then started sobbing a 1/2 hour later. I silently entered, knelt beside her, took her hand and, for the first time ever, prayed aloud with her and asked the Lord to bring her peace and comfort. I then went back to the sofa and went to sleep.

Woke up at 5:30 am to the sound of sobbing. This time I just let her do her thing. Brought her some tea later, went outside with my coffee and cried myself. As she passed me by on her way to work she shot me a glance and said "it's not just about you -- it's about me, too". 15 minutes later, she texted an apology and said she was sorry I was hurting, too, but that she has to deal with her own low points. Rest of day was ok. That evening, while she was out for a swim, my "radar" went off. I checked her email; nothing sent or suspicious looking. But, in one folder, I found an email she had sent herself from her phone, which was basically a short note to "him" stating she was broken-hearted, trying to keep it together for her and us (presumably, herself and the other man), and that she loved him. I flew into a rage. When he got home I screamed at her, "you have betrayed me for the last time!". She had no idea what I was taking about. We went to the car, soundproofed, away from the kids. I went into a fury; "you wrote this, this morning! As you were sobbing in bed! And sent to him?". She was hysterical. "No! No! I didn't send it to him, I swear!". "Yes you did! If you want to be with him so bad, GTFO! You are free to go, there's the door!" "No! I swear I didn't! Sometimes I just wrote down what I'm feeling and experiencing but I save to refer to it later when I have calmed down, like a journal!" More sobbing. I said "If you could give me a reason to begin trusting you, I would trust you -- but right now, after seeing this? I don't! You need to get clear with me and be transparent!" It was intense. I pray that the Lord was using me for a conduit, using my anger as a tool for getting through to her since some other means (i.e. Using "sugar") are only so effective. Anger can be a good tool, as long as it's not violet or not used in a disrespectful way but a way of calling someone out as I did. Anyway, after 5 minutes of imploring her that she could leave at any time -- and her refusing to -- I calmed down a little. "That's it! No more lies, no more deception, no more betrayal even if it's within your heart." I said it was time for some answers to some unanswered questions.

She answered a bunch of affair-related questions. I thanked her. Next morning, I sent her a couple of emails. Told her, in no uncertain terms, that I was setting boundaries for myself and that she must make a clean break for good (she hasn't seen him but she did email him once or twice to see "how he's doing", ha). I would deliver a break-up letter to him. If she could not agree to that, I would be compelled to take next steps. He has told me that she is working on a response to my email and will give to me soon.

Since then, her mood has changed quite a lot. She actually leaned over, hugged and kissed me upon waking the other morning. Has generally been very kind to me, calling me "honey" a couple of times. We have a nice weekend planned, with a couple of parties and Mothers Day on Sunday. But the jury is still out, and I am caught somewhere between being loving as always but being on my guard.

As to your situation, can I ask how old you guys are? We are 52 and 49. Have you thought of telling him that the Lord would want him to try to rebuild your marriage, which I truly believe. You can't just throw in the towel without even trying!
 
Upvote 0

Dan61861

7 days without God, makes one weak.
Jul 21, 2012
839
366
Valparaiso, Indiana
✟102,026.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
"Live",

I agree, it's no bueno -- she is defiant in the face of God, which is more important than any opinion I could have. I just can't understand on a logical level but, then again, this is grounded in fantasy and sin and temptation where there is little room left for logic or rational thinking.

I will say this, though. I have seen a subtle shift in her the last few days. I have not mentioned events of the last few days. She asked for "space" the other night so I headed to the sofa. She then started sobbing a 1/2 hour later. I silently entered, knelt beside her, took her hand and, for the first time ever, prayed aloud with her and asked the Lord to bring her peace and comfort. I then went back to the sofa and went to sleep.

Woke up at 5:30 am to the sound of sobbing. This time I just let her do her thing. Brought her some tea later, went outside with my coffee and cried myself. As she passed me by on her way to work she shot me a glance and said "it's not just about you -- it's about me, too". 15 minutes later, she texted an apology and said she was sorry I was hurting, too, but that she has to deal with her own low points. Rest of day was ok. That evening, while she was out for a swim, my "radar" went off. I checked her email; nothing sent or suspicious looking. But, in one folder, I found an email she had sent herself from her phone, which was basically a short note to "him" stating she was broken-hearted, trying to keep it together for her and us (presumably, herself and the other man), and that she loved him. I flew into a rage. When he got home I screamed at her, "you have betrayed me for the last time!". She had no idea what I was taking about. We went to the car, soundproofed, away from the kids. I went into a fury; "you wrote this, this morning! As you were sobbing in bed! And sent to him?". She was hysterical. "No! No! I didn't send it to him, I swear!". "Yes you did! If you want to be with him so bad, GTFO! You are free to go, there's the door!" "No! I swear I didn't! Sometimes I just wrote down what I'm feeling and experiencing but I save to refer to it later when I have calmed down, like a journal!" More sobbing. I said "If you could give me a reason to begin trusting you, I would trust you -- but right now, after seeing this? I don't! You need to get clear with me and be transparent!" It was intense. I pray that the Lord was using me for a conduit, using my anger as a tool for getting through to her since some other means (i.e. Using "sugar") are only so effective. Anger can be a good tool, as long as it's not violet or not used in a disrespectful way but a way of calling someone out as I did. Anyway, after 5 minutes of imploring her that she could leave at any time -- and her refusing to -- I calmed down a little. "That's it! No more lies, no more deception, no more betrayal even if it's within your heart." I said it was time for some answers to some unanswered questions.

She answered a bunch of affair-related questions. I thanked her. Next morning, I sent her a couple of emails. Told her, in no uncertain terms, that I was setting boundaries for myself and that she must make a clean break for good (she hasn't seen him but she did email him once or twice to see "how he's doing", ha). I would deliver a break-up letter to him. If she could not agree to that, I would be compelled to take next steps. He has told me that she is working on a response to my email and will give to me soon.

Since then, her mood has changed quite a lot. She actually leaned over, hugged and kissed me upon waking the other morning. Has generally been very kind to me, calling me "honey" a couple of times. We have a nice weekend planned, with a couple of parties and Mothers Day on Sunday. But the jury is still out, and I am caught somewhere between being loving as always but being on my guard.

As to your situation, can I ask how old you guys are? We are 52 and 49. Have you thought of telling him that the Lord would want him to try to rebuild your marriage, which I truly believe. You can't just throw in the towel without even trying!

My friend, it's about time!

Can I ask, how long did this affair last? My prayers are with you, you really are between a rock and a hard place.

In Christ
Daniel
 
Upvote 0
May 9, 2017
9
2
59
San Francisco
✟15,860.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Dan,

Affair lasted a little over 3 years but "off and on" from what I've been told; they each tried breaking it off on numerous occasions. Not that it matters much, does it? I guess the longer it goes on, the more difficult it is to break the connection. I appreciate your prayers. I'm praying for total reconciliation, healing, forgiveness and trust to return (on both of our parts); the Lord has the ability to turn those rocks you speak of into dust, so if it is His will then so be it.

I have to say...I'm truly afraid of my anger. When my anger comes up -- which it does, oh yes it does, especially when my wife is not around and I have time to dwell on things -- my mind is like hornet's nest that's been hit with a baseball bat. It's truly terrifying. I pray to Him to tamp that anger down, b/c I'm truly afraid of what it might look like if kept unchecked. When my thoughts turn to the two of them together and what they may have done, it's just too much. I put away some of my wife's laundry one day, and noticed a few pairs of underwear that I had never seen, and went into a blind rage (she was not around). It hurts so freaking much!!! My wife's intimacy is supposed to be for ME! Not someone else, especially a man who apparently is not exactly "right with God". What hurts most, though, is the apparent disappearance of respect my wife had not just for me, but for our family, our kids, our safety and security as a family. We are all supposed to feel safe and secure in a marriage, in our little family unit. You do not expect that to be broken from the inside-out. What an incredibly selfish act! I ask the good Lord to put up roadblocks around her heart when it comes to "the other man", that He drives thoughts of the other man from her, that she sees the folly of the whole thing, that He fill her with contriteness/remorse for what she has done -- not just to me but to all of us, the way in which she by placed our family in harm's way like that. And then, I hope she accepts God's forgiveness and learns to forgive herself. Time will tell, won't it?
 
Upvote 0

Dan61861

7 days without God, makes one weak.
Jul 21, 2012
839
366
Valparaiso, Indiana
✟102,026.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
To be honest, I've truly debated in my reply to you. Most assuredly, I have prayed for you and your wife, your children as well. I can truly feel your pain, there is healing in the Lord. As for your anger, you have that right...as long as it isn't violent. There were times our Lord showed His anger.

The reason I did hold back from replying, I didn't want to add to your pain. My friend, this isn't an emotional affair, your wife has had an affair. This isn't two people that are separated by distance, writing back and forth to one another. They are two people who have had complete access to each other.

The honest truth needs to be brought forward, so true healing can begin. Right now, you are getting bits and peaces. When you come to terms with that, you're hit all over again. She has you spinning to the point that her dung has you questioning whether or not some of this is your own fault. Everything you have mentioned is normal in every marriage. None of us are perfect, none of it should have led to an affair. This is her sin, unfortunately she is doing what many do...excusing her sin. We all sin, we all need Christ. She needs to face hers, take it to Christ, He is sure to forgive her.

True love isn't a fairy tale. It's a choice we make. She has a choice, to love you or not. Once she chooses you, love will grow. I would demand nothing less from my own wife. She would demand nothing less from me.

Both of you need to put the Lord first in your life. Pray together each day...everyday. You seem strong in the Lord, your goal is to make your wife strong in the Lord. Read the bible together, I can't stress this enough. Start immediately.

Be her rock, don't be a stone she kicks around. You have a long road ahead of you. Her tears are for the loss of someone else. There should be absolutely no contact between her and the other man. No goodbyes, no nothing...it's time to move forward. Her contacting him is disrespectful, don't let it be an option.

There is nothing wrong with you demanding things from her. She broke your vows. Besides, every married couple demands certain behavior from there spouse. The hardest part of your situation, you have to stand firm while you fear her moving on without you. Yet you do have to stand firm or she will never respect you.

I pray for your marriage, may God give you the strength and patience you need. May God turn your wives heart to you.

In Christ
Daniel
 
Upvote 0
May 9, 2017
9
2
59
San Francisco
✟15,860.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Dan, I appreciate this. And I agree, it was an affair. She has vowed to me that they did not have intercourse, has offered to get an STD, and so on. She divulged alot to me just recently (a couple of nights ago), after I hit the roof, that they were sexual with each other (mostly early on), but she did not want to disclose details. Frankly, I'm not so sure I want to know specifics b/c I'm afraid that i will never be able to enjoy having sex with her ever again should it get to that stage. But, you are right, it was more than an emotional affair. The only reason I use the word "emotional" is b/c she fell in love with him, which is different from a purely sexual affair.

As to saying goodbye...I had told her early on that I would allow that. Many therapists and counselors recommend that, mostly because of the statement it makes to all parties. I wrote her an email with some links to a site on "how to break it off with your AP", and instructed her that I would allow one short letter which I would deliver (and read, of course). I actually know the AP -- we were friendly to each other and our kid's have attended the same schools! -- which makes the whole thing just tragic beyond belief. I will hand it off to him. And that will be that.

i have told her, in no uncertain terms, that if she cannot do this, it will show an additional breach of trusts and respect -- and that I will take "next steps", I did not outline those steps to her as I would rather have her fear what those might be. All of this I reflected on and have put before the Lord in prayer, in terms of having Him use me as His instrument and doing His work. Yes, He hates divorce -- as do I -- but, then again, i will not be made a fool of, be disrespected, or repeatedly have my heart broken. I made this explicitly clear to my wife the other night in a heated fit of anger which I am sure she will never forget, as she has never seen me erupt quite like that; I even snapped the rear view mirror clean off the windshield (sheared the support off the glass itself, necessitating a windshield replacement -- so she know I am not messing around. Thank you for your prayers, I need all the help i can get. ;-) But I believe that the Lord is lifting me up, and our relationship up, and that he is working on softening her heart. It's a slow process; sometimes He works overnight miracles, sometimes it's a process. I trust that He knows best for me, for us, for her, for our children.

p.s. regarding praying together. I prayed with her (well, I was the one speaking) the other night for God to give her comfort and peace so she could sleep as we were both exhausted, as I mentioned in an earlier post. It was a first. I will have to ask her what she thought of that. And we do go to church together, etc, but do not read the Bible together; it may take some time to work up to that, b/c I think there's a part of her that wants to keep her spirituality private.

I will keep you, and others, posted as developments come in...
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Dan61861

7 days without God, makes one weak.
Jul 21, 2012
839
366
Valparaiso, Indiana
✟102,026.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Like I said, honesty.
Your wife had a three year affair, but mostly the sex happens early on? I wouldn't want to know what they did either. I would want the truth though.

You don't think there is a problem with her walk with the Lord? Her private spirituality is missing something. The affair has ended only because you found out. Her heart is broken, not because she hurt you. It's broken because the man she thinks she loves is lost to her.

You want God to heal your marriage, don't you think it's more important that He heals her first? You can play a huge role in this, if you truly allow God to use you. I wouldn't ask her if she wants to pray, I would do it. Heck, read a chapter of the bible a day. It isn't much, it doesn't take long. You will be overwhelmed in how much you grow together.

My wife and I sit a talk about the bible all the time. I can't imagine not having that with her. We both grow and we grow together. If you want to heal your marriage, bring God into your marriage.

In Christ
Daniel
 
Upvote 0
May 9, 2017
9
2
59
San Francisco
✟15,860.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Thank you Daniel. I will reflect and pray on this. It's going to take "some doing" if you know what I mean. But I agree, if we can shift the focus to God healing her first it will be far easier. I already pray that she draws closer to God, but it would not hurt to say that prayer together.

You're going to love this. Ironically ...she volunteers teaching Sunday school once a month!
 
Upvote 0

Dan61861

7 days without God, makes one weak.
Jul 21, 2012
839
366
Valparaiso, Indiana
✟102,026.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Thank you Daniel. I will reflect and pray on this. It's going to take "some doing" if you know what I mean. But I agree, if we can shift the focus to God healing her first it will be far easier. I already pray that she draws closer to God, but it would not hurt to say that prayer together.

You're going to love this. Ironically ...she volunteers teaching Sunday school once a month!
I do know what you mean, you have a long road ahead. May our gracious Lord guide you. I do hope I haven't added to your hurt. I honestly respect you, not many would stick around after a three year affair. The Lord never gives up on us, I pray you don't give up on her.

Her teaching Sunday school doesn't surprise me. We are all sinners, we all fall short of the glory of God. The Bible says each one of us are ourselves barely saved. She should step down for a period of time, until this storm is over and she's moving forward in Christ.

Love is a choice, God chooses to love us. He has shown us that love in Christ our Lord. Once we come to terms, that God alone is good we can understand that each of us are on the same level. It makes loving one another so much easier. You, me, my wife and yours are sinners. We take refuge under Christ's wing. Jesus is our righteousness.

Bring Him into your marriage, my friend. Make him your vocus, for both you and your wife. May you take the lead, the ball is in your court. Your wife has made a mess of things, she needs the Lord more than ever. Then and only then does she need you. The Lord says, cast our burdens on Him. Our burdens is our sin.

May God's peace and blessings be with you and your wife.

In Christ
Daniel
 
Upvote 0
May 9, 2017
9
2
59
San Francisco
✟15,860.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Dan,

Thanks for your thoughts. While I agree that maybe she should "step down" from assisting with Sunday school, I am not going to be the one to do that. That is a decision she is going to have to make for herself in conjunction with her own conversations with God. In fact, most of her decision-making process is going to have to follow this blueprint. I cannot "make her" do anything; I can suggest certain things, but even then I have to be extremely cautious b/c the emotions are still too raw and I run the risk of applying too much pressure.

I have been listening and taking note of things said in conversations, body language, etc, alot recently. After a conversation I had with her Saturday (about a little red flag that came to mind regarding an email of hers I had read) I realized that she's been walking around, "hyper-vigilant" (her words), feeling that she's always going to be perceived as having done something wrong no matter how transparent she is with me. She said that, when things are just normal and calm between us (i.e. no questioning, no suspicious or anxious feelings, etc), she begins to feel like she might have a chance to reach clarity and to "separate the real from the unreal". It also gives her a chance to just relax, let her guard down a little, and feel better around me. But she has felt that, nearly every day, my radar is up and that makes her look at me as more a grand inquisitor than her husband. My behavior/attitude is adversely affecting hers and it's something I have to be careful with; I don't wish to drive her away before we even get a chance to heal. I need to strike a balance between my ability to trust her and be patient vs continuing the questioning, or asking her to do certain things in order to create a more harmonious atmosphere for healing, and so on. She is not in a space where she can sit down and read the Bible with me right now. She may never be. I really don't know. I need to let God do His work on her outside of my own influence for the time being, because sometimes I have no idea how to proceed. This is something I prayed on while walking the dog today, and felt great peace about it.

I already knew, from the outset, that there was only so much I was going to be able to do; I say "only so much" because, 1) it's the truth, it's really God's will and 2) I can only do so much emotionally, mentally, & psychically. It hurts me to even think about this for any length of time. It's truly torturous at times, and if I allow it the wheels of the train invariably go off the tracks. And so, I have to give myself a break -- remove myself from the equation, if you will, and let God truly take the wheel as I am not capable at this point in time. I have given my wife alot of food for thought, though, alot. Now, I need to sit back and let it gestate. So much of this is in God's hands. I pray for some sort of divine intervention to take place, for the message to be delivered to her through some other means, whether it be through hearing a particular sermon at services, through talking with Christian friends we have (not about "our issue", just through having a fun night out/BBQ at a friend's house/etc where perhaps something will be said that causes her to have a paradigm shift in her thinking), that sort of thing. One moment which I hope will have a deep, spiritual effect on her is going to take place in late June when our sons are baptized by a pastor friend of ours in a semi-private ceremony at his in-law's pool (Baptism 'n BBQ!). I've decided to be baptized, as well, as I have never made this commitment before. The timing, and the fact my two boys are going to do this, seems perfect and I am very excited to truly pledge my life to the Lord along with my sons. It's very fitting. If that does not cause some sort of shift in perception for her then, frankly, I don't know what will.

The outcome of this has already been determined, based on God's will. I know that He would likely prefer us to work through this and come out the other side, based on scripture regarding marriage and divorce. I just have to be patient and see how it plays out.

More later.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums